Congressman Wants To Take His Oath On The Quran

[SanctitasDeo]

Really?

[catholicinsd]

[quote name='SanctitasDeo' post='1141824' date='Dec 13 2006, 10:43 PM']
Really?
[/quote]

Yeah, ya know how his head looks a big red balloon? Well, the balloon nearly popped. m

[homeschoolmom]

[quote name='catholicinsd' post='1141925' date='Dec 13 2006, 11:50 PM']
Yeah, ya know how his head looks a big red balloon? Well, the balloon nearly popped. m
[/quote]

[123]

I.M.H.O, swearing in on Qur'an would be nessessary in his native country. However, just like importing of Spanish language and culture into ours via childrens shows (Manny and Dora the Explorer). Other people of differing cultures aren't taking our Beautiful Country by war, they are taking it covertly through the importing of their values and religions into our's and at the moment American is so wishy washy becasue of this oozing postmodernism that they can only take it lying down.

Just like Red Knight said in the [b]Top 10 muslim[/b] post, they are bent on converting the entire world. This swearing in ceremony with the Qur'an is just a crack in the door for them to put their foot in. Great post Red Knight.

[avemaria40]

Why is this even an issue? He's not saying he wants everyone to swear on the Qu'ran, he just wants to be able to. This country was not founded to be a Christian country (though some colonized it with that end in mind) Most of our founding Fathers were deists and Masons who wanted a nation where people are free to believe in whatever they choose to believe or not to believe. Besides, if the Bible means nothing to him, wouldn't it be dishonest and disrespectful for him to swear on it?

I am a huge believer in freedom of religion. God gave us free will, why shouldn't we extend that to our fellow humans. Besides, it means so much more when someone chooses Christ rather than are forced to believe by political means or any other means (Bear in mind, I'm not talking about raising kids in the faith here, I believe children should be raised in the Faith, I'm talking about politics enforcing Christianity) I don't see it as taking over the world just to swear on your own religious text. I'm in favor of a Jew being able to swear on the Torah, a Hindu being able to swear over their own scriptures, etc.

I have ancestors who were persecuted for being Jewish and I grew up being taught to make my own choices about what I believe. What I believe is that, other from issues such as abortion, death penalty, euthanasia, etc. (since those involve killing) and telling women and teens the hard truth about premarital sex and contraception (which sadly, many refuse to do), the govn't should just stay out of everyone's personal lives. We are not a Christian country, we are a secular nation in which the majority of the people claim to be practicing Christians, so my advice is to get over it and let's debate something else.

[thessalonian]

[quote name='hot stuff' post='1132937' date='Dec 1 2006, 12:38 PM']
That's what makes you a resident, not a Minnesotan

Get through the winter
[/quote]


I am a minnesotan and they didn't invite me.

[Socrates]

[quote name='avemaria40' post='1142590' date='Dec 14 2006, 08:38 PM']
Why is this even an issue? He's not saying he wants everyone to swear on the Qu'ran, he just wants to be able to. This country was not founded to be a Christian country (though some colonized it with that end in mind) Most of our founding Fathers were deists and Masons who wanted a nation where people are free to believe in whatever they choose to believe or not to believe. Besides, if the Bible means nothing to him, wouldn't it be dishonest and disrespectful for him to swear on it?

I am a huge believer in freedom of religion. God gave us free will, why shouldn't we extend that to our fellow humans. Besides, it means so much more when someone chooses Christ rather than are forced to believe by political means or any other means (Bear in mind, I'm not talking about raising kids in the faith here, I believe children should be raised in the Faith, I'm talking about politics enforcing Christianity) I don't see it as taking over the world just to swear on your own religious text. I'm in favor of a Jew being able to swear on the Torah, a Hindu being able to swear over their own scriptures, etc.

I have ancestors who were persecuted for being Jewish and I grew up being taught to make my own choices about what I believe. What I believe is that, other from issues such as abortion, death penalty, euthanasia, etc. (since those involve killing) and telling women and teens the hard truth about premarital sex and contraception (which sadly, many refuse to do), the govn't should just stay out of everyone's personal lives. We are not a Christian country, we are a secular nation in which the majority of the people claim to be practicing Christians, so my advice is to get over it and let's debate something else.
[/quote]
The thing is swearing on the Qu'ran (or Bible, for that matter) is not part of someone's personal private life, but is a public gesture.
Yes, in itself, it may seem an insignificant gesture, but devout Muslims do not share the liberal west's pluralistic, multicultural views.

A civilization cannot long survive radical pluralism, multiculturalism, and relativism. It must be based primarily on one set of beliefs. It cannot equally be based on Christianity, Islam, paganism, and atheism, as these are ultimately in conflict. In the end, one belief-system will prevail.
If our country, and western civilization, rejects its Christian heritage, it is bound to collapse.

[homeschoolmom]

[quote name='thessalonian' post='1142598' date='Dec 14 2006, 08:13 PM']
I am a minnesotan and they didn't invite me.
[/quote]
Oh, carp... I just found your invitation. It must have slipped off the counter and slid under the fridge... sorry.

[Sojourner]

[quote name='homeschoolmom' post='1142690' date='Dec 14 2006, 08:42 PM']
Oh, carp... I just found your invitation. It must have slipped off the counter and slid under the fridge... sorry.
[/quote]
ah, the old "I lost your invitation under the fridge" excuse

weak, lemme tell you

[avemaria40]

[quote name='Socrates' post='1142669' date='Dec 14 2006, 10:38 PM']
The thing is swearing on the Qu'ran (or Bible, for that matter) is not part of someone's personal private life, but is a public gesture.
Yes, in itself, it may seem an insignificant gesture, but devout Muslims do not share the liberal west's pluralistic, multicultural views.

A civilization cannot long survive radical pluralism, multiculturalism, and relativism. It must be based primarily on one set of beliefs. It cannot equally be based on Christianity, Islam, paganism, and atheism, as these are ultimately in conflict. In the end, one belief-system will prevail.
If our country, and western civilization, rejects its Christian heritage, it is bound to collapse.
[/quote]

Yes, it's a public gesture that they swear to their highest authority, according to their religious beliefs, that they will uphold the law of the land. Why should we care if he swears on the Qu'ran? Not all devout Muslims are into global domination. Are we going to freak out if a devout Jew wants to swear on the Torah?

[cowsgomoo]

[quote name='GloriaIesusChristi' post='1142113' date='Dec 14 2006, 06:34 AM']
I.M.H.O, swearing in on Qur'an would be nessessary in his native country. However, just like importing of Spanish language and culture into ours via childrens shows (Manny and Dora the Explorer). Other people of differing cultures aren't taking our Beautiful Country by war, they are taking it covertly through the importing of their values and religions into our's and at the moment American is so wishy washy becasue of this oozing postmodernism that they can only take it lying down.

Just like Red Knight said in the [b]Top 10 muslim[/b] post, they are bent on converting the entire world. This swearing in ceremony with the Qur'an is just a crack in the door for them to put their foot in. Great post Red Knight.
[/quote]

I have never seen a more bigoted comment.

For the record, I am a Presbyterian (protestant).

Let's examine this for a second. First, the importing of the spanish language into America through Kid's TV shows is a bad thing? Unless you haven't noticed, Europe has been thriving with their children learning multiple languages, and it certainly hasn't hurt them, if anything, it's enhanced their communication skills and made them better, more well-rounded kids. Second off, the Muslims are 'taking it covertly through the importing of their values and religions into our's'? You've gotta be kidding me. I live in Southern California, more of a 'grab bag' of a society than any other place I've been, and diversity isn't a bad thing at all. After all, take this for an example: Let's say you have a good day just watching TV and eating cheesy-poofs or whatever, and you liked it so much that you wanna do it again. Let's say that you loved it so much again that you just keep doing it. Wouldn't that just get boring after a while? Diversity is what keeps the world spinning, it's what catches our attention and makes us better people. Living without diversity is like listening exclusively to Mozart (any musician would know how truly grueling that would be) or any other boring composer who used the same scales and chord progressions over and over (though he did have his good moments, namely [i]Le nozzi di Figaro[/i]).

Finally, they aren't bent on converting the whole world. If anything, they might have learned from a little thing called 'the Crusades' (it happened a while back). If anything, they just wish to share their gospel, just as you and I do on a daily basis through our actions (although, frankly, your actions aren't exactly too persuasive). To say that there is only one true religion is blasphemy; as only God is the omniscient that knows that humans can only wish to know. Knowing which religion is the true one is a part of the meaning of life, which, unless I missed something, no one has really found yet (unless you ask buddhists, but by the time they try to tell you, I'd bet that they've reached nirvana.). By no means am I trying to discourage you or anybody else from any religion of any sort, but what I'm trying to infer is that faith without diversity is dangerous at best.

As for the Congressman, I applaud his actions. By swearing in on the Qu'ran, he's establishing himself to uphold his duties as a true Muslim (not of the militant nature) and swearing over what he believes to do better for society.

[SanctitasDeo]

[quote] To say that there is only one true religion is blasphemy[/quote]

I found this amusing--that there is one true religion is exactly what the Muslims believe.

Personally, I don't think my faith needs to be diverse. Perhaps you mean people should have freedom of religion--that I agree with. But if I diversify my personal faith I may as well not have any faith at all.

[Didacus]

I would sooner trust a man who swears on the Koran than an atheist who swears on nothing.