Sojourner Posted November 15, 2006 Author Share Posted November 15, 2006 [quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1120264' date='Nov 14 2006, 07:56 PM'] Is this a debate or pointless comment time? The actions of TFT to banned a Jesus doll, just because it is a Jesus doll is Liberalism, the marines are being forced to liberalism. [/quote] You don't know many Marines, do you. [quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1120264' date='Nov 14 2006, 07:56 PM'] Is it "demeaning" to reduce Jesus to a statue? No. [b]What about these dolls is demeaning?[/b] [/quote] You're seriously asking me why it's demeaning to make a toy version of the Son of God? Maybe you're right ... maybe EVERY kid should be taking their Jesus doll to bed with them at night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homeschoolmom Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 [quote name='Jalazar' post='1120281' date='Nov 14 2006, 09:09 PM'] I can't argue with this. Catholic parents: Would you really want your kid being given a Mohammed or Buddha doll, particularly a talking one? I thought not. I think this particularly toy is inappropriate for the charity in question. [/quote] If I were celebrating a Muslim holiday or a Buddhist holiday, I wouldn't be too surprised... I was unaware that Muslim and Buddhist families celebrated Christmas. btw, for the record, I just think it's a lame gift-- but not inappropriate for the holiday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romans1513 Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 [quote name='Sojourner' post='1120229' date='Nov 14 2006, 09:25 PM'] But aside from that, I find myself a little uncomfortable with a Jesus doll in general ... [/quote] Finally, I was beginning to think no one else thought this! I don't mind biblical dolls so much... like, if they make a Moses thats ok. But Jesus is God, we have to be a little more careful with that. I mean, it kind of "belittles" Him, as Sojourner said. And what about when the kid doesn't want the doll anymore, I don't want to think of it being thrown in the garbage! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Romans1513 Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 I replied to this post in open mic, didn't realize it was over here too... [quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1120264' date='Nov 14 2006, 09:56 PM'] Is this a debate or pointless comment time? The actions of TFT to banned a Jesus doll, just because it is a Jesus doll is Liberalism, the marines are being forced to liberalism. Is it "demeaning" to reduce Jesus to a statue? No. [b]What about these dolls is demeaning?[/b] [/quote] Do you show respect for the statue? yes. Do you play with it, pull a string on its back (or whatever) to make it talk, let a 5-year-old toss it around, throw it in the garbage when you grow out of it? no. Thats what would happen to these dolls. They're dolls. Way different than statues. I don't think its right to make Jesus into a doll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toledo_jesus Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 [quote name='Azriel' post='1120299' date='Nov 15 2006, 12:25 AM'] You know, I'm one of the one's that thinks its just a really bad gift. [/quote] YES! Right on. In all seriousness, I find the doll to be entirely too familiar, and slightly vulgar. What does one even do with it? Pull the string? Act out the Gospels? ugh. Can you imagine the games kids would play? The kid with the Jesus doll would always win in an action figure battle. A statue is dignified, serves a purpose. you don't play with a statue of Jesus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suuran Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 I think plenty of Muslim/Buddhist/Jew families might sign up for a Christmas toy drive, if they were in desperate straits.... And I gotta agree that Jesus dolls are kinda tacky. He's going to be sparring with the Transformers and Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, or perhaps attending tea parties, rather than preaching the good news. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sojourner Posted November 15, 2006 Author Share Posted November 15, 2006 [quote name='homeschoolmom' post='1120371' date='Nov 14 2006, 09:36 PM'] If I were celebrating a Muslim holiday or a Buddhist holiday, I wouldn't be too surprised... I was unaware that Muslim and Buddhist families celebrated Christmas. btw, for the record, I just think it's a lame gift-- but not inappropriate for the holiday [/quote] Heck, I know Jews who celebrate Easter ... exchange baskets, have egg hunts, the works. Christmas has likewise taken on secular components. While we of course celebrate the birth of Christ at Christmas, plenty of people participate in the cultural celebration without regard to its origins. [quote name='Romans1513' post='1120448' date='Nov 14 2006, 10:54 PM'] I replied to this post in open mic, didn't realize it was over here too... Do you show respect for the statue? yes. Do you play with it, pull a string on its back (or whatever) to make it talk, let a 5-year-old toss it around, throw it in the garbage when you grow out of it? no. Thats what would happen to these dolls. They're dolls. Way different than statues. I don't think its right to make Jesus into a doll. [/quote] Thank you. [quote name='toledo_jesus' post='1120450' date='Nov 14 2006, 10:55 PM'] YES! Right on. In all seriousness, I find the doll to be entirely too familiar, and slightly vulgar. What does one even do with it? Pull the string? Act out the Gospels? ugh. Can you imagine the games kids would play? The kid with the Jesus doll would always win in an action figure battle. A statue is dignified, serves a purpose. you don't play with a statue of Jesus. [/quote] Thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sojourner Posted November 15, 2006 Author Share Posted November 15, 2006 [quote name='Socrates' post='1120287' date='Nov 14 2006, 08:22 PM'] While I disagree with Sojourner's general tendency to be against anything at all religious in public ... [/quote] I am really going to try to respond to this charitably. I don't know why you felt compelled to make this statement. I don't believe I have ever stated that I am "against anything at all religious in public" or even words to that effect. If you believe I have made such assertions, then by all means, prove me wrong. If you cannot find such a statement, then please retract this, and I would appreciate it if you would refrain from speaking for me in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightofChrist Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 (edited) [quote name='Sojourner' post='1120369' date='Nov 14 2006, 11:33 PM'] You don't know many Marines, do you.[/quote] Yet another pointless comment on your part. [quote name='Sojourner' post='1120369' date='Nov 14 2006, 11:33 PM'] You're seriously asking me why it's demeaning to make a toy version of the Son of God? [/quote] LOL man LOL, if its demeaning to make a toy of Christ its just as demeaning for the Church to make a statue of Christ. Which by the way is not Christ just a symbol of, both the toy and statue. [quote name='Sojourner' post='1120369' date='Nov 14 2006, 11:33 PM'] Maybe you're right ... maybe EVERY kid should be taking their Jesus doll to bed with them at night. [/quote] Dude the doll of Christ is just a symbol, theres nothing wrong with giving a kid a symbol of Jesus, better than those satanic brat dolls. Should we only give our children secular dolls? I mean how far do we take this, do we rip the Jesus doll out of little bobbys or little sussy's hands, after all cant allow the kid to have a "demeaning" doll. And I would like to buy one these for my little nephew, he loves Jesus. You know he's one of the few kids left that are happy to get anything, isn't one of those snotty little brats that thinks that anything to do with Jesus is lame and stupid. As adults its normal to think kids toys are corny and silly, after all there [color="#FF0000"]made for children[/color]. TFT had no right to ban a symbol of Jesus however lame and corny. Edited November 15, 2006 by KnightofChrist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sojourner Posted November 15, 2006 Author Share Posted November 15, 2006 [quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1120480' date='Nov 15 2006, 12:10 AM'] Yet another pointless comment on your part. [/quote] I'll just refrain from comment on that one. [quote name='KnightofChrist' post='1120480' date='Nov 15 2006, 12:10 AM'] LOL man LOL, if its demeaning to make a toy of Christ its just as demeaning for the Church to make a statue of Christ. Which by the way is not Christ just a symbol of, both the toy and statue. Dude the doll of Christ is just a symbol, theres nothing wrong with giving a kid a symbol of Jesus, better than those satanic brat dolls. Should we only give our children secular dolls? I mean how far do we take this, do we rip the Jesus doll out of little bobbys or little sussy's hands, after all cant allow the kid to have a "demeaning" doll. And I would like to buy one these for my little nephew, he loves Jesus. You know he's one of the few kids left that are happy to get anything, isn't one of those snotty little brats that thinks that anything to do with Jesus is lame and stupid. As adults its normal to think kids toys are corny and silly, after all there [color="#FF0000"]made for children[/color]. TFT had no right to ban a symbol of Jesus however lame and corny. [/quote] A toy and a statue are completely different representations of Christ. And yeah, my kids likely won't be playing with Action Figure Jesus because I don't want them growing up without a proper respect and reverence for Christ. Which, as a person who purports to be a Knight of Christ I would hope you would have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightofChrist Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 (edited) [quote name='Romans1513' post='1120448' date='Nov 15 2006, 12:54 AM'] I replied to this post in open mic, didn't realize it was over here too... Do you show respect for the statue? yes. Do you play with it, pull a string on its back (or whatever) to make it talk, let a 5-year-old toss it around,[/quote] Your not thinking as a child would think now are you? Your thinking as an adult would seeing an annoying child play with some silly toy. Think as a child for just a moment would you please. Your Jesus doll is not just some doll, to you, he is your best friend, your buddy, the one that protects you from the dark at night, your sidekick on all your adventures both imagery and real, always willing to have tea with you and your kitty, or 007 comandos (save the saint from the devil) with you and your dog, beside you when you are sick, happy when you are happy, sad that you are sad, held tight to your heart when you are afraid. He is your bestest friend ever and you love Him very very much. But you've grown out of wonderland, and can not see the love and respect a child would give to her doll of Christ. All you see is some annoying kid tossing around a silly doll. [quote name='Romans1513' post='1120448' date='Nov 15 2006, 12:54 AM'] throw it in the garbage when you grow out of it? no. Thats what would happen to these dolls. They're dolls. Way different than statues. I don't think its right to make Jesus into a doll. [/quote] For some kids maybe your right, but for the most I believe you are wrong. Not every kid throws out his best friend just because he grows up. [quote name='Sojourner' post='1120486' date='Nov 15 2006, 02:33 AM'] A toy and a statue are completely different representations of Christ. [/quote] One is for a child the other for an adult. [quote name='Sojourner' post='1120486' date='Nov 15 2006, 02:33 AM'] And yeah, my kids likely won't be playing with Action Figure Jesus because I don't want them growing up without a proper respect and reverence for Christ. [/quote] It is entirely possible to teach a child the proper respect and reverence for Christ and use a doll of Christ to do that. [quote name='Sojourner' post='1120486' date='Nov 15 2006, 02:33 AM'] Which, as a person who purports to be a Knight of Christ I would hope you would have. [/quote] If I gave my nephew a doll of Christ, using it as a teaching tool for Christ, I would not be a Knight of Christ? Please do explain Edited November 15, 2006 by KnightofChrist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homeschoolmom Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 [quote name='Sojourner' post='1120229' date='Nov 14 2006, 08:25 PM'] [img]http://www.messengersoffaith.net/images/Jesus1b.jpg[/img] That's what the doll in this case actually looks like. As I said in the thread I started on this topic earlier today, I think the TFT people made the right decision, given the nature of TFT. There are many organizations that would be a better fit for this company to donate to, as has already been mentioned. But aside from that, I find myself a little uncomfortable with a Jesus doll in general ... and, I suppose, with toys based on biblical themes in general. Maybe I'm being too much of a stickler, but it just seems that it's important that we remember that the people whose stories are in the Bible are more than just characters -- they were real people who lived and loved and demonstrated faith in God and so on. It seems ... belittling to turn them into action figures, even Bible-verse spouting action figures. [/quote] While I don't think there's anything wrong with the Jesus doll, per se, I probably wouldn't get one for my kid. The biblical action figures I disagree with you about completely. Yes, they were real people who really put their faith in God (or didn't, in some cases)... I think it's good for kids to act out those stories, over and over again. Roll playing is a great way for kids to learn. Would I want them to mix them in with Spidey and the Scooby Doo gang? No. But I don't think they are inherently wrong, either. Sunday School teachers all over the place use flannel graphs to tell a story and then let the kids use the pieces to retell the story (for their own enjoyment). Kids dress up in costumes of the saints and retell their stories-- St. George, St. Joan and St. Michael being chief among them-- High action. I don't believe this deminishes their dignity. Children learn through play. Do you have a problem with this? [url="http://stores.catholicmontessori.com/Categories.bok?category=Miniature+Mass+Kit"]http://stores.catholicmontessori.com/Categ...iature+Mass+Kit[/url] or this [url="http://stores.catholicmontessori.com/Categories.bok?category=Child-Size+Vestments"]http://stores.catholicmontessori.com/Categ...-Size+Vestments[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suuran Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 I think I understand children's play very well...I have no trouble playing with my five year-old cousin. I can tell you that Jesus is much more likely to be kicking butt with Spidey than "saving the saint from the devil". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DemonSlayer Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 Yeah, Jesus action figures probably doesn't sound right anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Azriel Posted November 15, 2006 Share Posted November 15, 2006 Lets refrain from the personal baiting folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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