Groo the Wanderer Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Yeah..they are also realizng in record numbers how 'beneficial' it is to cut open a woman's belly instead of letting her have a natural birth. ***huge dose of sarcasm*** I personally am losing a lot of faith in the medical establishment. Too much legaleeze and bureaucratic nonsense. Not enuff healing. But then what to expect from a culture of 'healers' with so many members who routinely murder the innocent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KizlarAgha Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 [quote name='Groo the Wanderer' post='1108856' date='Nov 2 2006, 02:51 PM'] Yeah..they are also realizng in record numbers how 'beneficial' it is to cut open a woman's belly instead of letting her have a natural birth. ***huge dose of sarcasm*** I personally am losing a lot of faith in the medical establishment. Too much legaleeze and bureaucratic nonsense. Not enuff healing. But then what to expect from a culture of 'healers' with so many members who routinely murder the innocent. [/quote] Right, so you know more about infections than people who spent a decade training to be doctors. Terrific. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thy Geekdom Come Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 [quote name='KizlarAgha' post='1108857' date='Nov 2 2006, 04:52 PM'] Right, so you know more about infections than people who spent a decade training to be doctors. Terrific. [/quote] A doctor taught me about the problems caused by too many c-sections. For starters, they produce scar tissue on the uterine wall which can harm chances of implantation for future children. For another, it takes much less time and effort and costs much more...which means the doctor gets more money for putting patients through unnecessary surgery and you get stuck with higher insurance premiums. Sometimes they're necessary...often the doctor is lazy or greedy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desertwoman Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 [quote name='RC_' post='1108851' date='Nov 2 2006, 04:47 PM'] Um....it keeps women faithful to thier husband? [/sarcasm] [/quote] lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groo the Wanderer Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 [quote name='KizlarAgha' post='1108857' date='Nov 2 2006, 02:52 PM'] Right, so you know more about infections than people who spent a decade training to be doctors. Terrific. [/quote] Nah...I just realize why they always say they 'practice' medicine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KizlarAgha Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 [quote name='Raphael' post='1108860' date='Nov 2 2006, 02:54 PM'] A doctor taught me about the problems caused by too many c-sections. For starters, they produce scar tissue on the uterine wall which can harm chances of implantation for future children. For another, it takes much less time and effort and costs much more...which means the doctor gets more money for putting patients through unnecessary surgery and you get stuck with higher insurance premiums. Sometimes they're necessary...often the doctor is lazy or greedy. [/quote] I don't think the doctors are "often" lazy or greedy any more than any other group of honest hardworking professionals. We may have the highest rates of c-section we've ever had, but we also have the lowest rates of infant morality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sojourner Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 [quote name='Raphael' post='1108860' date='Nov 2 2006, 12:54 PM'] A doctor taught me about the problems caused by too many c-sections. For starters, they produce scar tissue on the uterine wall which can harm chances of implantation for future children. For another, it takes much less time and effort and costs much more...which means the doctor gets more money for putting patients through unnecessary surgery and you get stuck with higher insurance premiums. Sometimes they're necessary...often the doctor is lazy or greedy. [/quote] I think saying that C-sections are "often" done because doctors are lazy or greedy is a huge overgeneralization. I think that does happen, but methinks you paint with too broad a brushstroke. Personally, I'm glad for C-sections. I and each of my four siblings are here thanks to C-sections. I was breach and Mom labored with me for 24 hours, puking with most contractions, before they opted for the C-section. It didn't seem to harm her fertility either ... my youngest brother was born when Mom was 47. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thy Geekdom Come Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 [quote name='Sojourner' post='1108872' date='Nov 2 2006, 05:06 PM'] I think saying that C-sections are "often" done because doctors are lazy or greedy is a huge overgeneralization. I think that does happen, but methinks you paint with too broad a brushstroke. Personally, I'm glad for C-sections. I and each of my four siblings are here thanks to C-sections. I was breach and Mom labored with me for 24 hours, puking with most contractions, before they opted for the C-section. It didn't seem to harm her fertility either ... my youngest brother was born when Mom was 47. [/quote] Hey...it's what the doctor told me. He said that everyone should be on the lookout because there are lots of doctors who just want money. This guy is an embryologist (he shows off his own grown children's placentas in class... ). Anyway, I believe him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RC_ Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 [quote name='Raphael' post='1108877' date='Nov 2 2006, 03:08 PM'] Hey...it's what the doctor told me. He said that everyone should be on the lookout because there are lots of doctors who just want money. This guy is an embryologist [b](he shows off his own grown children's placentas in class... )[/b]. Anyway, I believe him. [/quote] What was his problem? He didn't have any embarassing pictures of his kids in the tub? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justified Saint Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 [quote name='KizlarAgha' post='1108844' date='Nov 2 2006, 12:41 PM'] I think it is the time and the place to discuss it as Balthazor specifically asked for thoughts on how it compares to male circumcision. There are zero health benefits to circumcision. Ask any non-American non-Jewish male about it. None of my European male friends are getting infections. In fact, they think the whole idea is completely silly. Why on Earth would men have foreskins if they were detrimental? That doesn't make any sense at all. Evolution wouldn't have favored it if it caused problems. [/quote] And your appendix could kill you. Evolutionary dogmatism can leave much to be desired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KizlarAgha Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 [quote name='Justified Saint' post='1109049' date='Nov 2 2006, 05:23 PM'] And your appendix could kill you. Evolutionary dogmatism can leave much to be desired. [/quote] Fair enough. But most pediatric associations do not advise routine circumcisions. The benefits conferred are dubious at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Groo the Wanderer Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 Just makes me glad I had a girl....didn't have to worry about circumcision :whew: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Balthazor Posted November 2, 2006 Author Share Posted November 2, 2006 (edited) I geuss I was just interested in this article from my own sterile political point of view. Obviously Female circumcision is a very, very bad thing, with many detrimental side effects. In some cultures they even cut more out and "sew her shut" leaving a very small hole until her wedding night. If a bride is lucky her husband gives her a day or two to heal. However, this brings into my head, a question of a slippery slope. This is the first case of this kind that I have ever heard of regaurding female circumcision in the United States. At least the first one to come to court. Could this lead to other things? All it would take is one angry parent that did not want to have his or her son circumcised to bring it about. In this light I just wonder if someone will ever go so far as to try and outlaw male cirumcision as mutilation also. As for health benefits: My mother was a nurse and she actually did know someone who got an infection and subsequently had to have a circumcision. However this is quite rare. This is where I was going, would a group that wanted to try and get male circumcision banned as mutilation. Now as a result of this court case they would have a precident, weak as it is, to stand on. A standard to point to. Edited November 2, 2006 by Balthazor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KizlarAgha Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 [quote name='Balthazor' post='1109191' date='Nov 2 2006, 06:43 PM'] I geuss I was just interested in this article from my own sterile political point of view. Obviously Female circumcision is a very, very bad thing, with many detrimental side effects. In some cultures they even cut more out and "sew her shut" leaving a very small hole until her wedding night. If a bride is lucky her husband gives her a day or two to heal. However, this brings into my head, a question of a slippery slope. This is the first case of this kind that I have ever heard of regaurding female circumcision in the United States. At least the first one to come to court. In this light I just wonder if someone will ever go so far as to try and outlaw male cirumcision as mutilation also. As for health benefits: My mother was a nurse and she actually did know someone who got an infection and subsequently had to have a circumcision. However this is quite rare. This is where I was going, would a group that wanted to try and get male circumcision banned as mutilation. Now as a result of this court case they would have a precident, weak as it is, to stand on. A stnadard to point to. [/quote] If female circumcision is outlawed, so should be male circumcision. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
track2004 Posted November 2, 2006 Share Posted November 2, 2006 I've heard the cleanliness bit for male circumcision, but I don't get it. I mean what exactly are you boys doing that is so dirty? I don't get infections in that area and I have a hole there............. I don't get it at all. I know boys can't exactly choose but why would any father (or mother) be like, 'Okay sure put the very very sharp knife on his penis, I'm sure it'll be fine'?? I mean really could you convince a man who was older to have doctors do that to him? I'd also just say about cleanliness again that um if you get that infected you may have bigger issues to deal with too. It's under 2 layers of clothing and you shower often enough... WHAT HAPPENED? Male circumcision should be outlawed save for religious reasons, of course I have friends who disagree with me, as I'm sure people here do too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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