Children Are So Cruel

[Balthazor]

I begged for homeschool when I was young but looking back I am really glad that I did not have it.

I definately would not be where I am today if I was homeschooled. There are some things I really enjoyed about school,I got to visit other schools in competition (math league, science league, quiz bowl) Public school taught me how to go through administration, it taught me Politics first hand and it taught me how to deal with other people that have different opinions than me, including authority. My mom was right, if she would have homeschooled me I would have had zero tolerance for other people (this was her saying I agree).

I do not look at going to public school as a detriment, I look at it as a great advantage. I did not have one school or one teacher, I had many and when I came home I had to keep on learning. I took independent courses at home during high school for language and ornithology. I have read all three sets of our encyclopedias from cover to cover. During the summer my parents took us into town to take courses at the local university in college style programs they had for 3rd through 6th graders, I took greek mythology and computer science and studied stars and planets among other things.

I am getting my Master's in Political Science now.
I am sure that homeschooling is great, no bullies and a perfect Catholic environment but I liked public school and in my opinion public schooling is only a failure if you let it be a failure, the resources are there but you have to utilize them.

[ardillacid]

[quote name='Balthazor' post='1114925' date='Nov 8 2006, 03:14 AM']
I begged for homeschool when I was young but looking back I am really glad that I did not have it.

I definately would not be where I am today if I was homeschooled. There are some things I really enjoyed about school,I got to visit other schools in competition (math league, science league, quiz bowl) Public school taught me how to go through administration, it taught me Politics first hand and it taught me how to deal with other people that have different opinions than me, including authority. My mom was right, if she would have homeschooled me I would have had zero tolerance for other people (this was her saying I agree).

I do not look at going to public school as a detriment, I look at it as a great advantage. I did not have one school or one teacher, I had many and when I came home I had to keep on learning. I took independent courses at home during high school for language and ornithology. I have read all three sets of our encyclopedias from cover to cover. During the summer my parents took us into town to take courses at the local university in college style programs they had for 3rd through 6th graders, I took greek mythology and computer science and studied stars and planets among other things.

I am getting my Master's in Political Science now.
I am sure that homeschooling is great, no bullies and a perfect Catholic environment but I liked public school and in my opinion public schooling is only a failure if you let it be a failure, the resources are there but you have to utilize them.
[/quote]
Best of luck to you with the masters degree, Balthazar


....it seems to me you have the typical view of the homeschooler, the stereotype, which I get alot here at school. "oh you were homeschooled, you didn't have a life. You didn't learn from real teachers, how could you learn? You didn't interact with other kids. You are socially stunted. You didn't have opportunity." Its all carp. I am happy that I was not sent to public school. Most of the peeps i know that did, ended up hating learning, and I believe the best thing homeschooling did for me is teach me to value it above everything else. On top of that, I got self-discipline, self-reliance, and a top notch education. I am currently pursuing a degree in Chemical engineering and hopefully go for a ph.d. (My advisor says its do-able anywhere between 8-10 years of total college) Public schools might give loads of opportunity, but one persons success (yours ) doesn't make the system a success

[RC_]

I wish I was homeschooled.

[CrossCuT]

[quote name='notardillacid' post='1114940' date='Nov 8 2006, 04:42 AM']
Best of luck to you with the masters degree, Balthazar
....it seems to me you have the typical view of the homeschooler, the stereotype, which I get alot here at school. "oh you were homeschooled, you didn't have a life. You didn't learn from real teachers, how could you learn? You didn't interact with other kids. You are socially stunted. You didn't have opportunity." Its all carp. I am happy that I was not sent to public school. Most of the peeps i know that did, ended up hating learning, and I believe the best thing homeschooling did for me is teach me to value it above everything else. On top of that, I got self-discipline, self-reliance, and a top notch education. I am currently pursuing a degree in Chemical engineering and hopefully go for a ph.d. (My advisor says its do-able anywhere between 8-10 years of total college) Public schools might give loads of opportunity, but one persons success (yours ) doesn't make the system a success
[/quote]

[size=1]Im a typical homeschooler.
It ruined my life.
[/size]

[Balthazor]

[quote name='notardillacid' post='1114940' date='Nov 8 2006, 04:42 AM']
Best of luck to you with the masters degree, Balthazar
....it seems to me you have the typical view of the homeschooler, the stereotype, which I get alot here at school. "oh you were homeschooled, you didn't have a life. You didn't learn from real teachers, how could you learn? You didn't interact with other kids. You are socially stunted. You didn't have opportunity." Its all carp. I am happy that I was not sent to public school. Most of the peeps i know that did, ended up hating learning, and I believe the best thing homeschooling did for me is teach me to value it above everything else. On top of that, I got self-discipline, self-reliance, and a top notch education. I am currently pursuing a degree in Chemical engineering and hopefully go for a ph.d. (My advisor says its do-able anywhere between 8-10 years of total college) Public schools might give loads of opportunity, but one persons success (yours ) doesn't make the system a success
[/quote]
\

First off I am not typical and do not have typical views. If you must taxonomize me to analyse me then please limit it to the Catholic pigeonhole.

What I am saying is that homeschooling may be possible for some people and it may be better for others. But not for me. I doubt if my parents would have been able to homeschool us four kids, both Mom and Dad were working on the farm all day. To feed four children and have a successful farm they both needed to be there. Besides you cant really say that I do not have discipline...the independent classes I took were just that; independent of public school, individual, and it was corespondence.
To clarify: I was not given an education.....I earned it just like you did through self reliance, and discipline, just like my classmates at public school. I know that some schools might give diplomas to kids that do not make the grade, but mine did not. I may come from a back-water cow country but here we put a lot of money and effort in our public schools.

And for the record the system may not be a complete success everywhere but the same can be said for homeschooling. I know several homeschooled kids who are a mess. Two of them were put in public school and then had to be pulled out again because they were having such difficulties, both academically and socially and no these two boys were not mentally handicapped. I still know them. And these were not the only two, I also know of some in college who had problems. So in my opinion , low as it may be, homeschooling is not any better or worse than public schooling in success.

As for the socially stunted comment, the "I know better than you" comment, is typical no matter where you go get used to it....everyone thinks they know better. I lived in a town of 200 people, I was a farm kid and an outcast among my peers I get the who "socially stunted" stereotype also in college. I was once told that I must have been socialized by cows. In the country we think people from the city are dumb because they don't know anything about living in the country. No matter where you live or where you are educated you will get the whole you must be dumb because you are different thing...true in all twelve countries I have been in and in every town, city, county and state I have been in, in the States. If you are not from that certain place you must be dumber.

Good luck in your Ph. D., however you may want to consider getting a Master's first. I was going to go for a Ph. D. right away also, however I found that I would be much more marketable as a Master's. A Ph.D automatically puts you in a higher pay scale and many companies are reluctant to hire an untested person at a higher pay rate. So instead they opt for hiring the person with a Master's and then subsidizing their furthur education. This is of course unless you are planning on going into Medicine or into a Professorship in which you will need the Ph.D.

[homeschoolmom]

[quote name='notardillacid' post='1114940' date='Nov 8 2006, 04:42 AM']
Best of luck to you with the masters degree, Balthazar
....it seems to me you have the typical view of the homeschooler, the stereotype, which I get alot here at school. "oh you were homeschooled, you didn't have a life. You didn't learn from real teachers, how could you learn? You didn't interact with other kids. You are socially stunted. You didn't have opportunity." Its all carp. I am happy that I was not sent to public school. Most of the peeps i know that did, ended up hating learning, and I believe the best thing homeschooling did for me is teach me to value it above everything else. On top of that, I got self-discipline, self-reliance, and a top notch education. I am currently pursuing a degree in Chemical engineering and hopefully go for a ph.d. (My advisor says its do-able anywhere between 8-10 years of total college) Public schools might give loads of opportunity, but one persons success (yours ) doesn't make the system a success
[/quote]



In an effort to get this train back on the tracks and make a sort of rational segue... Many people are under the false impression that being homeschooled means that you never have to socialize with others who are "different" or have special needs. In actuality, special needs kids make up a large percentage of hsed children. My kids know lots of kids with learning disabilities, physical challenges, and "behavior" problems. They don't always know that they know kids with these issues-- it's not like they see them go off to the nurse for their meds at lunch each day or see that they only go to the "special" classroom. No. To my kids, they are just kids.

[Winchester]

The solution on a kid level for bullies is to beat them into submission. If caught early, it really helps.

Schools must be reasonable in the rules against fighting. If a kid is defending himself or someone who needed it, he should not be punished. I recieved a suspension in senior year for fighting. The other guy had hit me twice before I fought back. That's ridiculous.

On the flip side. In jr. high, a kid called my mom the big b word so I tossed him down some bleachers. When I related the story to the principle, she sent me back to class and threatened the other guy with expulsion.

[franciscanheart]

Hold on... fix in a minute...

[franciscanheart]

[quote name='Balthazor' post='1114959' date='Nov 8 2006, 07:33 AM']
First off I am not typical and do not have typical views. If you must taxonomize me to analyse me then please limit it to the Catholic pigeonhole.[/quote]
Woohoo Balthazor!

[quote name='Balthazor' post='1114959' date='Nov 8 2006, 07:33 AM']
What I am saying is that homeschooling may be possible for some people and it may be better for others. But not for me. I doubt if my parents would have been able to homeschool us four kids, both Mom and Dad were working on the farm all day. To feed four children and have a successful farm they both needed to be there. Besides you cant really say that I do not have discipline...the independent classes I took were just that; independent of public school, individual, and it was corespondence.
To clarify: I was not given an education.....I earned it just like you did through self reliance, and discipline, just like my classmates at public school. I know that some schools might give diplomas to kids that do not make the grade, but mine did not. I may come from a back-water cow country but here we put a lot of money and effort in our public schools.

And for the record the system may not be a complete success everywhere but the same can be said for homeschooling. I know several homeschooled kids who are a mess. Two of them were put in public school and then had to be pulled out again because they were having such difficulties, both academically and socially and no these two boys were not mentally handicapped. I still know them. And these were not the only two, I also know of some in college who had problems. So in my opinion , low as it may be, homeschooling is not any better or worse than public schooling in success.[/quote]
That's what I'm saying.

[quote name='Balthazor' post='1114959' date='Nov 8 2006, 07:33 AM']
As for the socially stunted comment, the "I know better than you" comment, is typical no matter where you go get used to it....everyone thinks they know better. [/quote]
It's awful isn't it?

[homeschoolmom]

How did this get to be a debate about HS vs. public schooling? My point was that it's nice when kids can get to know each other as a fellow kid with a similar interest, not as the kid in the dumb reading group or that gets his meds at lunch time. Rather than knowing the ins and outs of everyone's academic achievements, kids who meet each other in different venues can get to know each other without stigma. That's all.

[123]

I understand, Hughey, I believe I saw the same thing.

When I was younger I was homschooled (For religious reasons, I wasnt a trouble child and was always a straight A student.) and I had friends whom tortured me and actually quizzed me on certain things. Such as, how to spell words and answer impossible questions that were way above my current grade level, and since I couldn't answer them I was considered stupid. But, when I went to Technical School for Information Technolgy I saw how it got even worse when it came to high school.

My friends their always use to make fun of me for being homeschooled. I know its not a physical deformality or a mental one. But, torture ranges from everything and Miles Christi is right, it is original sin. Humans know this and since they dont want to know about their problems, they make light of the misfortune of others. They, in turn, don't realize that heartless teasing and verbal (and sometimes physical) torture exclaimes their sinfulness even more.

[b]Teseaing is to be expected in schools.[/b] However, it doesn't make it right. I have even seen teachers added to the mocking of others. I guess its shows us a small splinter of a bigger problem that is the social, anti-christian, picture.

I would'nt say that public school is bad. It's in a pretty dark state but, it's also a requirement of the parents to make a difference in their children's lives. Parents do have a choice to educate their kids. However, The parents and the children should never be persecute for it.

And it also goes with children [b]who are better than us[/b] in their souls and faith, But they just don't look the same. Christ made us all and is happy they way we are. My grandmother worked at TAC industries with mentaly and phsyically handicapped for almost 20 years. She hated leaving because she felt the love that comes from these humans. I enjoyed their company also when I went to help.

My grandmother always told that God always had a special place in his kingdom for people like that. Because, their burdens were out for all to see.

Edited November 8, 2006 by GloriaIesusChristi

[franciscanheart]

[quote name='homeschoolmom' post='1115093' date='Nov 8 2006, 11:52 AM']
How did this get to be a debate about HS vs. public schooling? My point was that it's nice when kids can get to know each other as a fellow kid with a similar interest, not as the kid in the dumb reading group or that gets his meds at lunch time. Rather than knowing the ins and outs of everyone's academic achievements, kids who meet each other in different venues can get to know each other without stigma. That's all.
[/quote]
Your particular post may have been relevant to the topic at hand but the material of preceeding posts were definitely debating the merits of homeschool versus the merits of public school and not quite on the same plain as the OP. We were no longer discussing bullying in school but the success academically and socially (bullying not being mentioned) of the two types of schooling programs.

[quote name='GloriaIesusChristi' post='1115095' date='Nov 8 2006, 11:55 AM']
I understand, Hughey, I believe I saw the same thing.

When I was younger I was homschooled (For religious reasons, I wasnt a trouble child and was always a straight A student.) and I had friends whom tortured me and actually quizzed me on certain things. Such as how to spell words and answer impossible questions that were way above my grade level, since I couldnt answer them I was considered stupid. But, when I went to Technical School for Information Technolgy, I saw how it got even worse when it came to high school.

My friends always use to make fun of me for being homeschool. I know its not a physical deformality or a mental one. But, torture ranges from everything and Miles Christi is right it is original sin. Human know this and since they dont want to know it the bring out the misfortune of others when they dont realize that heartless teasing and verbal and sometimes physical torture exclaimes their sinfulness even more.

Teseaing is to be expected. However, it doesnt make it right and even teachers I knew even added to the mocking of others. I guess its shows us a small splinter of a bigger problem that is the socical, anti-christian, picture.

I wouldnt say that public school is bad. Its in a pretty dark state but, its also a requirement of the parents to make a difference in their childrens lives. Parents do have a choice to choose how they educate their kids.
[/quote]
I think the important thing too is that parents are made AWARE of what goes on at school. Sometimes I think parents go on completely clueless as to what happens with their child at school. Some kids are very two-sided. They are completely different people at school and at home.

I just felt so awful for that girl. She was so hurt. It still makes me cry.

[Balthazor]

Yeah I got teased too...
it made me a fighter a surviver.
It made me a crusader...I embarrassed and humbled the kids who tried to pick on the LD kids.
I was ADD, one of my teachers put me in the back of the classroom facing the wall, that hurt, but I survived...I got the highest grades in class. Through Highschool it continued to be bad, I even remember trying to bribe someone to take me to prom...I would have paid for everything and then some....nope to much social stigma attatched to me.
My mom told me that the things that don't kill you will make you stronger.
You arfe stronger now....I used to weight lift, I know that without tearing muscle apart you can not build muscle.
It is painful but it makes you stronger.

I know that school can be painful and even leave scars, but I bet you are a stronger person now. and when you have children you will be able to know what to do better if they are picked on, and advise them because you were harassed, than if you never were.

Edited November 8, 2006 by Balthazor

[franciscanheart]

I merged them back together. Sorry for the confusion. Hopefully we'll get back on track.

[quote name='Balthazor' post='1115102' date='Nov 8 2006, 12:04 PM']
You arfe stronger now....I used to weight lift, I know that without tearing muscle apart you can not build muscle.
It is painful but it makes you stronger.
[/quote]
I'd rather not be stronger.

[123]

[quote] I think the important thing too is that parents are made AWARE of what goes on at school. Sometimes I think parents go on completely clueless as to what happens with their child at school. Some kids are very two-sided. They are completely different people at school and at home.[/quote]

Are you kidding Hughey!? My cousin went on a trip with his government class to Washington, they found narcotics on the bus. The teacher, after finding the drugs, exclaimed to the kids to never tell their parents. Thankfully, my aunt found out from a friend's son.

This of course is only one example, I really don't want know any of the others.