Budge Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 La procesión del Auto de Fe. Joaquín Sorolla y Bastida. Sevilla. Postales de la Colección de J. W. Chester, pertenecientes al archivo de María Victoria Uribe.[img]http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/a/m/amw288/auto_da_fe2.jpg[/img] La procesión del Auto de Fe. Joaquín Sorolla y Bastida. Sevilla. Postales de la Colección de J. W. Chester, pertenecientes al archivo de María Victoria Uribe [quote] An auto da fe is literally a “judicial sentence or act of faith,” usually ending with the public burning of heretics. [b]In June of 1680, the largest auto da fe of the Spanish Inquisition took place. It was meant to be a celebration of the marriage of King Charles II and his wife, Louis Marie d’Orleans. Seventy-two people called “judaizers” were put on trial. judaizers were people who were descendents of Jews who had been baptized centuries ago, but were still secretly practicing their religion. Eighteen of the seventy-two were condemned to death. Charles II personally lit the “quemadero,” [/b] which is the place where the heretics were burned. The remaining fifty-four judaizers were sentenced to life imprisonment. This auto da fe is significant because it is the last time in the Inquisition that a royally sponsored auto da fe was held.[/quote] This site is interesting breaks down the painting and shows the different parts and what is happening. From Penn State webserver. [url="http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/a/m/amw288/"]AUTO DA FE[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 and your point is? IF you read the text this was conducted by the King Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budge Posted October 28, 2006 Author Share Posted October 28, 2006 Sure it was conducted by the KING, but with the INQUISITOR GENERAL right there with him. Who determined who the heretics were? When church and state marry it corrupts both. [img]http://www.personal.psu.edu/users/a/m/amw288/Altars.jpg[/img] The two black altars at the top of the stairs are for the king and the inquisitor general. These can be seen at the top if the stairs on the left, with the king standing behind one and the inquisitor general behind the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thy Geekdom Come Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 What were they tried for? I want to see the charges. Were they tried for practicing their faith or for spreading heresy? Who brought the charges? Were the charges cleared with the Magisterium? Did the pope consent to the death of each individual? Budge, you need to do more research. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 I think it's cool that we have photographic proof. No, wait... It's a painting. I'm not saying it didn't happen, or that it's a fake painting. I'm mocking you for putting up a painting as evidence, the same as the idiot Dan Brown. Acts of Faith did occur. The nature of them depended on the time and the person administering them. Oh, and Inquisitors seemed to be human and the Vatican hadn't perfected its mind control ray, yet, so some did disobey after being brainwashed by Opus Dei. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thy Geekdom Come Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 [quote name='Winchester' post='1103235' date='Oct 28 2006, 01:49 PM'] Oh, and Inquisitors seemed to be human and the Vatican hadn't perfected its mind control ray, yet, so some did disobey after being brainwashed by Opus Dei. [/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam42 Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 [quote name='Winchester' post='1103235' date='Oct 28 2006, 11:49 AM'] Oh, and Inquisitors seemed to be human and the Vatican hadn't perfected its mind control ray, yet, so some did disobey after being brainwashed by Opus Dei. [/quote] Hey............ I'm a member of Opus Dei. And that was funny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 I think Opus Dei is cool I was just making a jo..fdhajaej ;;hja help!! ghkgjhhkj arrrrrrrgggggggggggggghhhhhhhhhhh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homeschoolmom Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katholikos Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 (edited) The pictures are not photographs, but paintings. Budge has presented an artist's interpretation of an event of history. But it's art, not fact. No Catholic denies that autos de fe took place during the Spanish Inquisition. People were tried, and some lost their lives. But the number is small compared to the loss of life at the hands of other tribunals of the period. Historians estimate that 3,000 to 5,000 people lost their lives during the Inquisition. Studies of the archives will provide a more accurate count in the future. But it is claimed that some 200,000 people were burned for witchcraft alone in Europe in 16th and 17th centuries*. The Inquisition rejected all allegations of witchcraft and demanded hard evidence of wrongdoing. It was a model tribunal of that age. Abhorrent as it seems to us now, burning was not unusual but was the accepted method of capital punishment at the time. For example, John Calvin burned Michael Servetus at the stake in 1553. The charge was heresy. The "enlightened" 20th century was the most violent century in history, with the greatest loss of life. There were more Christian martyrs in the 20th century than in any other. The Black Legends of the Inquisition originated in lies told by Protestants, and those same lies have then been used by Protestants as 'historical facts' to beat up Catholics for the last 400 years. * [url="http://www.richard.clark32.btinternet.co.uk/burning.html"]http://www.richard.clark32.btinternet.co.uk/burning.html[/url] --------------------------------------------- Blessed Father Damien, pray for us! Edited October 28, 2006 by Katholikos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katholikos Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 [quote]This site is interesting breaks down the painting and shows the different parts and what is happening.[/quote] um, uh, Budge, you mean what is happening [b][i]in the painting[/i][/b], according to the artist, huh? Winchester, you're the best. --------------------------------------------- Blessed Father Damien, pray for us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Era Might Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 [quote]The Spanish Inquisition was established to deal with the special problem created in Spain by the very large numbers of its citizens known as conversos. These were people who had converted from Islam or Judaism to Christianity, either recently in person or as a result of the conversion of their forebears had become so with the passage of time and generations. But many others had high public office, and obviously only they could hold positions in the Church, which were very influential--or by fear, particularly when there was large-scale mob violence against non-Christians. And once an individual was baptized, he was not permitted to return to Judaism or Islam. There is convincing, indeed overwhelming evidence, which even the most critical modern historians have acknowledged, that tens of thousands of false conversos, who did not believe in the Christianity they professed, continued to live secretly by the teachings and rites of their or their forebears' former religion. Many had risen high in Christian society, even in the Church; some were priests who mocked the Mass as they said it. While most of the reports of conversos engaging in satanic rites and crucifying children were probably false, it would be rash to say that all of them were; for the worst passions in human nature feed on the kind of situation in which the false conversos found themselves. Every false converso in Spain was a potential traitor--a man capable of, and very possibly inclined to opening the gates of its coastal cities to the likes of the Turkish mass killers of Otranto. And by the same token, every true converso--men such as Fray Hernando de Talavera, Isabel's saintly confessor; Cabrera, husband of her dearest friend--was open to suspicion of infidelity and treason, their reputation and careers forever in jeopardy of a false accusation to this effect. The danger was greatest in the south, particularly in Sevilla, the most populous city in Spain, not reconquered until 1250, where at least half the population had been non-Christian. Particularly after the horror of Otranto, this danger simply could not be ignored. The Inquisition is the centerpiece of the "black legend" of Spanish history. The torture it occasionally inflicted (though not as a regular practice) and the burning at the stake which the government ordered for those the Inquisition had convicted twice, cannot be defended--though they were by no means evils unique to the Inquisition or to Spain. But the historian has a duty to put the Inquisition in perspective, rarely though this may be done. It did not engage in mass murder. The contemporary historian Pulgar estimates the total number of those burned to death because of its findings during Isabel's reign as no more than 2,000, an average of about 100 a year. [b]Some 15,000 were found guilty of false profession of Christianity, but were reconciled with the Church in the public ceremony known as the auto-de-fe, meaning "act of faith"--that is, public confession of their error and reconciliation with the faith they had rejected. Because on that same occasion the few deemed irreconcilable were burned, the term auto-de-fe has come to mean, for those who know no Spanish, "burning at the stake," but the number reconciled was always much larger than the number completely cleared--including St. Ignatius of Loyola and St. Teresa of Avila and all so-called witches whose cases were brought before the Inquisition in the next century. For them, the Inquisition was a shield against calumny.[/b] The Inquisition had no jurisdiction over practicing Jews and Muslims, only over professed Christians who were in fact still Jews or Muslims, though concealing it. After its initial abuses were eliminated following the appointment of Tomas de Torquemada as Inquisitor-General for Castile in 1483, the inquisitorial tribunals were generally fair; many preferred to have their cases heard by them rather than in other courts. Those questioned by the Inquisition were not allowed to face their accusers because of the danger of blood feuds and revenge-seeking if their identity were known. But no one could be confined even briefly without the prior testimony of three witnesses against him, and anyone brought before the Inquisition as a suspect was asked first of all to make a list of all his personal enemies, whose testimony against him, if made, was immediately thrown out. No anonymous testimony was permitted. The accused had a defense attorney, often two, although they were assigned by the Inquisition ... The modern world regards heresy as not a crime, but a joke. But the vast slaughters of men, women, and children by the two worst totalitarian regimes of the twentieth century were carried out by men who bitterly hated Christianity and never hesitated to say so. Hitler was an apostate Catholic, Stalin an apostate Orthodox seminarian. Between them, they took at least thirty million lives, beside which the grand total of executions by referral from the Spanish Inquisition over its entire 300-year history is hardly measureable by comparison. They would not have been free to gain power in a time which would have taken them at their word and knew the cost and consequences of their hatred of Christianity, which many of those condemned by the Inquisition also nourished. Tomas de Torquemada would have known how to deal--and to deal early--with Hitler and Stalin. (Warren H. Carroll, "The Glory of Christendom", pp. 607-609)[/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justified Saint Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 The BIGGEST Auto de Fe in history and only 18 people died? I thought the Spanish Inquisition executed hundreds and thousands of people at a time? I demand a recount! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ruso Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 [quote name='Winchester' post='1103235' date='Oct 28 2006, 07:49 PM'] Oh, and Inquisitors seemed to be human and the Vatican hadn't perfected its mind control ray, yet, so some did disobey after being brainwashed by Opus Dei. [/quote] I'm a exmember of Opus dei and Ah Budge look the author of picture D. Joaquin Sorolla y Bastida. Century XVII?, [url="http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joaqu%C3%ADn_Sorolla"]http://es.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joaqu%C3%ADn_Sorolla[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted October 28, 2006 Share Posted October 28, 2006 [quote]The auto de fe involved: a Catholic mass; prayer; a public procession of those found guilty; and a reading of their sentences (Peters 1988: 93-94). They took place in public squares or esplanades and lasted several hours: ecclesiastical and civil authorities attended.[1] Artistic representations of the auto de fe usually depict torture and the burning at the stake. However, this type of activity never took place during an auto de fe, which was in essence a religious act. Torture was not administered after a trial concluded, and executions were always held after and separate from the auto de fe (Kamen 1997: 192-213). [/quote] Also from wikipedia, though I should think more verification would be appropriate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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