Thy Geekdom Come Posted October 15, 2006 Share Posted October 15, 2006 Back on topic, ladies and gentlemen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budge Posted October 16, 2006 Author Share Posted October 16, 2006 You all forget when I read this book, I LIKED ST. Terese, the girl that wrote it, I felt bad for her that she had been taught wrong things about God. Also it does no favors for the sick and disabled to be taught it is good to suffer. [suffering for their own salvation] That is not a God a sick or disabled person can run to for comfort and solace. That is not what the God of the Bible teaches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomaly Posted October 16, 2006 Share Posted October 16, 2006 [quote name='Budge' post='1093055' date='Oct 16 2006, 12:29 PM'] You all forget when I read this book, I LIKED ST. Terese, the girl that wrote it, I felt bad for her that she had been taught wrong things about God. Also it does no favors for the sick and disabled to be taught it is good to suffer. [suffering for their own salvation] That is not a God a sick or disabled person can run to for comfort and solace. That is not what the God of the Bible teaches. [/quote] I guess when Jesus got back to Heaven, he must have given God a piece of His mind for letting Jesus suffer while He was on earth. LOL It certainly seems you misinterpreted the entire book, Budge. But I must admit, I didn't read it and am not about to read it either. I feel bad that you were taught the wrong things about God and confuse a human's attitude about suffering as being God's attitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budge Posted October 16, 2006 Author Share Posted October 16, 2006 Jesus suffered and died for our sins, conquering sin and death, so people could be saved eternal suffering in hell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomaly Posted October 16, 2006 Share Posted October 16, 2006 [quote name='Budge' post='1093085' date='Oct 16 2006, 01:23 PM'] Jesus suffered and died for our sins, conquering sin and death, so people could be saved eternal suffering in hell. [/quote] Okay... So I my choices are: A. I get Faith by Grace and I'm "saved" and I will have Grace that makes me do good works. That also means if I was born and lived in the Amazon 150 years ago, I was born to burn in hell. Some people get the opportunity to be saved, others don't. You only know if you do Good Things. B. I get Faith by unearned Grace and that's the begininning of a Faith Journey where I will get Graces through out life and I can either participate with Grace and have salvation, or I can reject these Graces and scoot down to Hell. I'm also required to nurture that Seed of Faith to keep weeds from choking it out or removing rocks so that it can grow in soil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mateo el Feo Posted October 16, 2006 Share Posted October 16, 2006 [quote name='Budge' post='1093055' date='Oct 16 2006, 02:29 PM']You all forget when I read this book, I LIKED ST. Terese, the girl that wrote it, I felt bad for her that she had been taught wrong things about God. Also it does no favors for the sick and disabled to be taught it is good to suffer. [suffering for their own salvation] That is not a God a sick or disabled person can run to for comfort and solace. That is not what the God of the Bible teaches.[/quote]The "God of the Bible" teaches that Jesus was "'crowned with glory and honor' because he suffered death" ([url="http://www.usccb.org/nab/bible/hebrews/hebrews2.htm#v9"]Heb 2:9[/url]) and that He was made perfect through suffering ([url="http://www.usccb.org/nab/bible/hebrews/hebrews2.htm#v10"]Heb 2:10[/url]). Following Jesus Christ is neither masochistic nor "Health and Wealth." It is, as Our Lord says, the decision to deny oneself and take up one's cross ([url="http://www.usccb.org/nab/bible/mark/mark8.htm#v34"]Mark 8:34[/url]). In St. Paul's letter to the Colossians ([url="http://www.usccb.org/nab/bible/colossians/colossians1.htm#v24"]Col 1:34[/url]), we learn the value of suffering. Budge, "it does no favors for the sick and disabled" to teach a [i]different gospel[/i] from the one that was given to us by Our Lord, and Canonized by the Church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nawtyeravgjoe Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 [quote name='Budge' post='1093055' date='Oct 16 2006, 01:29 PM'] Also it does no favors for the sick and disabled to be taught it is good to suffer. [suffering for their own salvation] That is not a God a sick or disabled person can run to for comfort and solace. That is not what the God of the Bible teaches. [/quote] this is why a protestant will never get blessed with stigmata. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Socrates Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 [quote name='Budge' post='1093085' date='Oct 16 2006, 01:23 PM'] Jesus suffered and died for our sins, conquering sin and death, so people could be saved eternal suffering in hell. [/quote] Said nothing about Christians being spared suffering on earth. Did you even read the Bible quotes I gave earlier this thread?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budge Posted October 17, 2006 Author Share Posted October 17, 2006 [quote]this is why a protestant will never get blessed with stigmata.[/quote] Thank God for that! I do not believe it is from God. Oozing bloody sores, it has been the subject even of at least one horror movie! besides the stigmata doesnt bleed in the right place....the physics wouldnt work. The nails were driven through the wrists [not the hands] and through the heels! [b] Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and [u]thou shalt bruise his heel[/u]. [/b] [img]http://www.law.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/jesus/heelbones.jpg[/img] Heel bone of first-century crucifixion victim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veroni213 Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 [quote name='Budge' post='1093554' date='Oct 16 2006, 11:18 PM'] [b] Gen 3:15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and [u]thou shalt bruise his heel[/u]. [/b] [img]http://www.law.umkc.edu/faculty/projects/ftrials/jesus/heelbones.jpg[/img] Heel bone of first-century crucifixion victim [/quote] You might want to re-check that scripture reference- it looks worse than a bruise to me... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budge Posted October 17, 2006 Author Share Posted October 17, 2006 I went to go look up the Hebrew... Hebrew for the word bruise.....hmmmmm [b]7779. shuwph Search for H7779 in KJVSL Pwv shuwph shoof a primitive root; properly, to gape, i.e. snap at; figuratively, to overwhelm:--break, bruise, cover.[/b] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thy Geekdom Come Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 Budge, the ancient concept of the hand began at the wrist. God can make a stigmata appear in the palm if that is people's understanding of where it happened, in order to show more people His glory in His servants. The point isn't how accurate the stigmata is, but what its message is. Oh, and if Jesus only bruised Satan's head, then that means something pretty sad for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budge Posted October 17, 2006 Author Share Posted October 17, 2006 [quote]God can make a stigmata appear in the palm if that is people's understanding of where it happened, in order to show more people His glory in His servants. The point isn't how accurate the stigmata is, but what its message is.[/quote] Why would God be inaccurate about ANYTHING? Also the message of stigmata, is based in sinful pride, "I will suffer for my own sins, bleeding and oozing sores" instead of standing on the sufficency of Christ's sacrifice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anomaly Posted October 17, 2006 Share Posted October 17, 2006 [quote name='Budge' post='1093799' date='Oct 17 2006, 08:07 AM'] Why would God be inaccurate about ANYTHING? Also the message of stigmata, is based in sinful pride, "I will suffer for my own sins, bleeding and oozing sores" instead of standing on the sufficency of Christ's sacrifice. [/quote] That's kinda twisted, Budge. Having the stigmata is a sign of suffering in Christ's name, kinda like what Paul talked about: [quote]Paul's Affliction 3 ¶ Blessed be God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies, and the God of all comfort; 4 who comforteth us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort them which are in any trouble, by the comfort wherewith we ourselves are comforted of God. 5 For as the sufferings of Christ abound in us, so our consolation also aboundeth by Christ. 6 And whether we be afflicted, it is for your consolation and salvation, which is effectual in the enduring of the same sufferings which we also suffer: or whether we be comforted, it is for your consolation and salvation. 7 And our hope of you is steadfast, knowing, that as ye are partakers of the sufferings, so shall ye be also of the consolation. 8 ¶ For we would not, brethren, have you ignorant of our trouble which came to us in Asia, 1 Cor. 15.32 that we were pressed out of measure, above strength, insomuch that we despaired even of life: 9 but we had the sentence of death in ourselves, that we should not trust in ourselves, but in God which raiseth the dead: 10 who delivered us from so great a death, and doth deliver: in whom we trust that he will yet deliver us; 11 ye also helping together by prayer for us, that for the gift bestowed upon us by the means of many persons thanks may be given by many on our behalf. [/quote] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budge Posted October 17, 2006 Author Share Posted October 17, 2006 [quote]That's kinda twisted, Budge. Having the stigmata is a sign of suffering in Christ's name, kinda like what Paul talked about:[/quote] Paul was talking about this... Gal 6:17 From henceforth let no man trouble me: for I bear in my body the marks of the Lord Jesus. [b]2Cr 11:25 Thrice was I beaten with rods, once was I stoned, thrice I suffered shipwreck, a night and a day I have been in the deep;[/b] [b]2Cr 11:24 Of the Jews five times received I forty [stripes] save one.[/b] Paul was whipped and beaten as well.....those are the marks, not stigmata... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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