Mary-Kathryn Posted October 1, 2006 Share Posted October 1, 2006 [quote name='Budge' post='1080696' date='Oct 1 2006, 01:07 PM'] [img]http://img.dailymail.co.uk//i/pix/2006/09/pope300906_228x424.jpg[/img] [/quote] So...how long did you have to search to find another subject to get the flames going? Oh and your contrasting pictures are really a clincher in showcasing good versus evil...its sure to set off the good Catholic folks here.....me, I think I'll go pluck my eyebrows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thy Geekdom Come Posted October 1, 2006 Share Posted October 1, 2006 (edited) Oh, and that thing the article mentions about competence...I don't see anything in the letter but the Vatican's claim to have competence in a canon law issue. I see nothing telling bishops not to report things to civil authorities. In fact, the competence issue seems to be referring to all the matters of abuse of the sacraments addressed. It seems clear to me why the Vatican would claim competence over civil courts in matters of Eucharistic abuses. Now, I still haven't translated the whole thing. If you really want me to, I can, but I think that taking this letter for what it is, a letter regarding abuses of sacraments carried out by some priests and reserving judgment on those abuses (in as much as they are sacramental abuses), should be enough. Edited October 1, 2006 by Raphael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cappie Posted October 1, 2006 Share Posted October 1, 2006 [quote name='Fides_et_Ratio' post='1080856' date='Oct 2 2006, 04:31 AM'] "secret" letter, huh? sounds like media hype/tripe to me. [/quote] This is an old story first dragged up when Benedict became Pope Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budge Posted October 1, 2006 Author Share Posted October 1, 2006 [quote] I didn't bother translating the whole thing. It's about abuses in the celebration of the sacraments. Thanks for finding yet another reason for us not to believe you.[/quote] Hey I cant read Latin. This what I get for TRUSTING a canon lawyer. THIS FOLKS IS THE LINK TO THE LETTER [url="http://popebenedict16.blogspot.com/2005/04/benedict-obstructed-justice-dont-you.html"]http://popebenedict16.blogspot.com/2005/04...e-dont-you.html[/url] [url="http://popebenedict16.blogspot.com/2005/04/benedict-obstructed-justice-dont-you.html"]LINK RIGHT HERE--CATHOLIC CANON LAWYER.[/url] [quote]Ed Peters, CanonLaw.Info Perhaps you’ve seen recent press stories about then-Cardinal Ratzinger's "secret letter" to all bishops in May 2001 wherein the one-time head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, now Pope Benedict XVI, allegedly ordered black-out grade secrecy on ecclesiastical investigations of clergy sex abuse allegations. Depending on which version of the story you encounter, you might also hear that leaks of Church investigations will be punished with papal excommunication, that the Church claims secret jurisdiction over such cases for ten years, etc., etc. Folks, from where I sit, it seems much ado about not much. [b] First, the CDF letter is so secret that it’s been posted on the Vatican website for some time now[/b]. I noticed it months ago. It’s in Latin because it is addressed to all the bishops of the world, and it is common Vatican practice to send out important communications in one common language rather than in umpteen vernacular versions. For those whose Latin is rusty, some versions of the CDF letter include links to websites that translate Latin vocabulary.[/quote] Stupid me for trusting a catholic canon lawyer. Someone should write him and tell him to fix his link Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laudate_Dominum Posted October 1, 2006 Share Posted October 1, 2006 [quote name='Budge' post='1081057' date='Oct 1 2006, 05:39 PM'] Hey I cant read Latin. This what I get for TRUSTING a canon lawyer. THIS FOLKS IS THE LINK TO THE LETTER [url="http://popebenedict16.blogspot.com/2005/04/benedict-obstructed-justice-dont-you.html"]http://popebenedict16.blogspot.com/2005/04...e-dont-you.html[/url] [url="http://popebenedict16.blogspot.com/2005/04/benedict-obstructed-justice-dont-you.html"]LINK RIGHT HERE--CATHOLIC CANON LAWYER.[/url] Stupid me for trusting a catholic canon lawyer. Someone should write him and tell him to fix his link [/quote] it's happened to all of us. in the end you can't trust a lawyer, even a canon lawyer. j/k Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budge Posted October 1, 2006 Author Share Posted October 1, 2006 [quote]in the end you can't trust a lawyer, even a canon lawyer. [/quote] Agreed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cappie Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 (edited) The Archbishop of Birmingham in central England, the Most Reverend Vincent Nichols, told Britian's Press Association (PA) that the documentary "misrepresents two Vatican documents and uses them quite misleadingly in order to connect the horrors of child abuse to the person of the Pope." Speaking on behalf of bishops in England and Wales, he accused the BBC of "a deeply prejudiced attack on a revered world religious leader". The Catholic Church also told PA that the document in question is not directly linked to child abuse but deals with the misuse of the confessional. It said a second document mentioned in the documentary and issued in 2001 clarifies Church law and did not hinder investigations of child abuse allegations. Cardinal Cormac Murphy-O'Connor, the Archbishop of Westminster, central London, and spiritual leader of Catholics in England and Wales, has written to Mark Thompson, the BBC's director-general, to protest about the program. The Most Reverend Vincent Nichols, Archbishop of Birmingham, and Chairman of the Catholic Office for the Protection of Children and Vulnerable Adults (COPCA), has issued the following statement on behalf of the Catholic Church in England and Wales, in response to the BBC Panorama Programme, 'Sex Crimes and the Vatican', broadcast on BBC 1 at 10.15pm last night: "The BBC Panorama programme, 'Sex Crimes and the Vatican', makes clear the suffering of those abused in their childhood. But as a public service broadcaster, the BBC should be ashamed of the standard of the journalism used to create this unwarranted attack on Pope Benedict XVI. "Viewers will recognise only too well the sensational tactics and misleading editing of the programme, which uses old footage and undated interviews. hey will know that aspects of the programme amount to a deeply prejudiced attack on a revered world religious leader. It will further undermine public onfidence in 'Panorama'. "There are two strands to the Panorama programme 'Sex Crimes and the Vatican'. The first is a graphic and explicit account of the evil of child abuse and the personal damage it causes to its victims. This is horrific and deeply distressing. "Those abused as children have been grievously offended. This is especially so when the abuser is a priest. The film is a reminder to everyone of the need to work ceaselessly in the protection of children and in response to the needs of victims. The Catholic Church in England and Wales is doing so, with transparency and care, and, in every case, cooperating fully and immediately with public authorities. "The second strand of the programme is an attack on the Vatican and specifically on Pope Benedict XVI. This aspect of the programme is false and entirely misleading. It is false because it misrepresents two Vatican documents and uses them quite misleadingly in order to connect the horrors of child abuse to the person of the Pope. "The first document, issued in 1962, is not directly concerned with child abuse at all, but with the misuse of the confessional. This has always been a most serious crime in Church law. The programme confuses the misuse of the confessional and the immoral attempts by a priest to silence his victim. "The second document, issued in 2001, clarified the law of the Church, ensuring that the Vatican is informed of every case of child abuse and that each case is dealt with properly. This document does not hinder the investigation by civil authorities of allegations of child abuse, nor is it a method of cover-up, as the programme persistently claims. In fact it is a measure of the seriousness with which the Vatican views these offences. "Since 2001, Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, then Head of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, took many steps to apply the law of the Church tallegations and offences of child abuse with absolute thoroughness and scruple." Archbishop Nichols added: "This statement is endorsed by the Bishops of England and Wales. Cardinal Cormac Murphy-O'Connor, as President of the Bishops' Conference, is writing to the Director General of the BBC, Mark Thompson, to protest about this programme. Cardinal Murphy-O'Connor's letter will be made public later this week." Source: Archdiocese of Birmingham Edited October 2, 2006 by cappie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Socrates Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Well, the "secret document" nonsense may be a load of tripe, but that sure is a scaaarrrry picture of the Pope Budge posted! Obviously, he's up to some nefarious evil! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thy Geekdom Come Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 (edited) Well, I feel vindicated. Thanks, Father Greg. Edited October 2, 2006 by Raphael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Thanks Father, for setting te record straight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homeschoolmom Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Cappie's da man... Alright, I sound kinda stupid saying that... So, how about: "thanks, Cappie!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 Anyone care to enlighten the BBC? [url="http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article-23369148-details/Pope+'led+cover-up+of+child+abuse+by+priests'/article.do"]http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/news/article...#39;/article.do[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewReformation Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 It would seem Budge posted the wrong document. The document she posted was written much later than the document that is being spoken of. I'm reading this document at the very moment. Interesting stuff it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thy Geekdom Come Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 [quote name='NewReformation' post='1081808' date='Oct 2 2006, 10:27 AM'] It would seem Budge posted the wrong document. The document she posted was written much later than the document that is being spoken of. I'm reading this document at the very moment. Interesting stuff it is. [/quote] The 1962 document? The article addressed more than one document. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted October 2, 2006 Share Posted October 2, 2006 There was a second document which claried the first document, again on the subject of sacraments. It was brought out with great fanfare when Benedict the 16th was elected, in the same manner by the same sensationist press. Then should be several old threads on the topic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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