Democracy Is A Tool Of Satan

[Resurrexi]

I hate Democracy and I think it's a tool of Satan. Does anyone else here feel the same way?

[Aloysius]

this is lame

[Budge]

The USA is a REPUBLIC...

[KnightofChrist]

Hate is a tool of Satan...

Oh and ha! Your Voting Poll is a form of Democracy, watch out!

[Era Might]

[quote]But in matters merely political, as, for instance, the best form of government, and this or that system of administration, a difference of opinion is lawful. Those, therefore, whose piety is in other respects known, and whose minds are ready to accept in all obedience the decrees of the apostolic see, cannot in justice be accounted as bad men because they disagree as to subjects We have mentioned; and still graver wrong will be done them, if - as We have more than once perceived with regret - they are accused of violating, or of wavering in, the Catholic faith.

--Pope Leo XIII, Encyclical Letter "Immortale Dei"[/quote]
[quote]Governmental authority, therefore, is a postulate of the moral order and derives from God. Consequently, laws and decrees passed in contravention of the moral order, and hence of the divine will, can have no binding force in conscience, since "it is right to obey God rather than men."

Indeed, the passing of such laws undermines the very nature of authority and results in shameful abuse. As St. Thomas teaches, "In regard to the second proposition, we maintain that human law has the rationale of law in so far as it is in accordance with right reason, and as such it obviously derives from eternal law. A law which is at variance with reason is to that extent unjust and has no longer the rationale of law. It is rather an act of violence."

The fact that authority comes from God does not mean that men have no power to choose those who are to rule the State, or to decide upon the type of government they want, and determine the procedure and limitations of rulers in the exercise of their authority. Hence the above teaching is consonant with any genuinely democratic form of government.

--Pope John XXIII, Encyclical Letter "Pacem In Terris"[/quote]

[goldenchild17]

I don't like democracy, but I don't think it is a tool of the devil. I do think it is a highly insufficient model of government, and should be not be in practice in a country where Catholicism is not the only allowed public religion. I think it would be a decent model in a fully Catholic country, but I still have questions about it on a functionality level.

Edited September 29, 2006 by goldenchild17

[Era Might]

[quote name='goldenchild17' post='1079461' date='Sep 29 2006, 04:36 PM']I don't like democracy, but I don't think it is a tool of the devil. I do think it is a highly insufficient model of government, and should be not be in practice in a country where Catholicism is not the only allowed public religion.[/quote]
It is not necessary, even in a truly Christian democracy, for Catholicism to be the only allowed public religion. In fact, especially today, when the world is inexplicably integrated with people of different backgrounds, it would be gravely injurious to the common good not to allow free exercise of religion. This is why the Second Vatican Council had to address the issue of religious liberty, because the world has changed so much.

[quote]The Church, indeed, deems it unlawful to place the various forms of divine worship on the same footing as the true religion, but does not, on that account, condemn those rulers who, for the sake of securing some great good or of hindering some great evil, allow patiently custom or usage to be a kind of sanction for each kind of religion having its place in the State. And, in fact, the Church is wont to take earnest heed that no one shall be forced to embrace the Catholic faith against his will, for, as St. Augustine wisely reminds us, "Man cannot believe otherwise than of his own will."

--Pope Leo XIII, Encyclical Letter "Immortatale Dei"[/quote]

[goldenchild17]

[quote name='Era Might' post='1079467' date='Sep 29 2006, 04:43 PM']
It is not necessary, even in a truly Christian democracy, for Catholicism to be the only allowed public religion. In fact, especially today, when the world is inexplicably integrated with people of different backgrounds, it would be gravely injurious to the common good not to allow free exercise of religion. This is why the Second Vatican Council had to address the issue of religious liberty, because the world has changed so much.
[/quote]

Free private exercise of religion I have no problem with. When it extends into affecting the public and public matters that's when I take issue with it.

[Resurrexi]

[quote]But in matters merely political, as, for instance, the best form of government, and this or that system of administration, a difference of opinion is lawful. Those, therefore, whose piety is in other respects known, and whose minds are ready to accept in all obedience the decrees of the apostolic see, cannot in justice be accounted as bad men because they disagree as to subjects We have mentioned; and still graver wrong will be done them, if - as We have more than once perceived with regret - they are accused of violating, or of wavering in, the Catholic faith.

--Pope Leo XIII, Encyclical Letter "Immortale Dei" [/quote]

all that says is I can't say a Catholic is evil for being a supporter of democracy. There is no offocial Dogma that prohibits me from saying that democracy is evil and a tool of Satan. Now the Church does prohibit her members from calling Monarchy evil becuase the Holy Trinity divinely instituted several kings in the Old Testament, and also several kings have been canonised. Holy Mother Church also prohibits people from calling Theocracy evil because the Her visible Head is the also the head of a Theocracy.

[Era Might]

In what sense? As far as the morals of a nation go? In that sense, those must always be based objectively on the moral law. But you can't confine non-Catholics to private spaces. They have to be allowed to live and express their religion publicly, as should Catholics, and conversion must be carried out by witness and charity, not force and suppression.

This is in response to goldenchild, just to clarify. I forgot to hit reply.

[homeschoolmom]

[quote name='Aloysius' post='1079424' date='Sep 29 2006, 04:15 PM']
this is lame
[/quote]



[quote name='Budge' post='1079434' date='Sep 29 2006, 04:22 PM']
The USA is a REPUBLIC...


[/quote]

[goldenchild17]

[quote name='Era Might' post='1079519' date='Sep 29 2006, 05:05 PM']
In what sense? As far as the morals of a nation go? In that sense, those must always be based objectively on the moral law. But you can't confine non-Catholics to private spaces. They have to be allowed to live and express their religion publicly, as should Catholics, and conversion must be carried out by witness and charity, not force and suppression.

This is in response to goldenchild, just to clarify. I forgot to hit reply.
[/quote]

I guess I just don't see where other faiths have the right to express themselves publicly. What they believe, and what they practice themselves is something no one can govern, God knows it sure didn't work for the Pagan Roman emperors in their attempt to stop Christians. But I think, and I say I think because I am open to contrary evidence, that past encyclicals and so forth have made it clear that error has no rights, and that a country should not have freedom of religion, in regards to public practice and influence.

Edited September 29, 2006 by goldenchild17

[tojo]

I don't hate democracy.

I hate evil.

Some evils have been allowed/encouraged by democracy.

I don't like that.

However, evils are allowed/emcouraged by many other governmental systems than democracy also.

[Resurrexi]

The following are [b]condemned[/b] as [i][b][color="#CC66CC"][u]ERRORS[/u][/color][/b][/i] by Pope Pius IX:

[quote]55. [b][i][u][color="#FF0000"][font="System"]The Church ought to be separated from the State, and the State from the Church.[/font][/color][/u][/i][/b] -- Allocution "Acerbissimum," Sept. 27, 1852.

77. In the present day it is [b][i][u][color="#FF9900"]no longer expedient that the Catholic religion should be held as the only religion of the State[/color][/u][/i][/b], to the exclusion of all other forms of worship. -- Allocution "Nemo vestrum," July 26, 1855.

78. Hence it has been wisely decided by law, in some Catholic countries, that persons coming to reside therein shall enjoy the public exercise of their own peculiar worship. -- Allocution "Acerbissimum," Sept. 27, 1852.

79. Moreover, [u][color="#3333FF"]it is false that the civil liberty of every form of worship, and the full power, given to all, of overtly and publicly manifesting any opinions whatsoever and thoughts, conduce more easily to corrupt the morals and minds of the people[/color][/u], and to propagate the pest of indifferentism. -- Allocution "Nunquam fore," Dec. 15, 1856.

80. The [i][color="#33CC00"]Roman Pontiff[/color][/i] can, and [i][color="#33CC00"]ought to, reconcile himself[/color][/i], and come to terms [i][color="#33CC00"]with progress, liberalism and modern civilization.[/color][/i]- -Allocution "Jamdudum cernimus," March 18, 1861. [/quote]

Edited September 29, 2006 by StThomasMore

[goldenchild17]

I was going to include this to, along with other stuff. Of course without all the pretty colors.