You'ze Wasn't "properly" Catechized !

[Eutychus]

If I had ten bucks for every time some smart alec Catholic tossed out the phrase.. [color="#000099"][b][i]"YOU WERE NEVER PROPERLY CATECHIZED"[/i][/b][/color] to me I would have enough by now for a GREAT winter ski trip vacation!

Despite 12 years of Catholic School, with ONLY Nuns and Priests as teachers { there were NO lay teachers in the day and age I went through the system } I hear that silly phrase over and over.

OK.

I ** SERIOUSLY WANT A DEFINITION HERE ** please!

[color="#660000"][b]Exactly WHEN DO YOU [size=4] ** BECOME PROPERLY **[/size]CATECHIZED?[/b][/color]

How do you KNOW if you were, or WERE NOT, [color="#990000"][size=4][b]PROPERLY[/b][/size][/color] catechized??

Is there a point when it is there, but not quite [size=4][b]PROPERLY??[/b][/size]


How do you know if you were PROPERLY, but with all the changes, your [size=4][b]PROPER[/b][/size], is [size=4][b]NOW IMPROPER??[/b][/size]

Seriously.

Honestly.

Please answer this for me.

Edited September 10, 2006 by Eutychus

[Budge]

Poorly Catechised...

i[u]it means the brainwashing ie indoctrination didnt take.[/u]

While people in the Bible became Christians immediately after hearing the gospel and becoming born again, with Catholicism, it seems not even 12 years of Catholic school is enough with an hour or more of daily religious instruction.

Id love to know what the Catholics here think needs changing...

more vocabulary lists?

More repeating answers to questions?

Bring back the Baltimore Catechism?

10 more years of instruction? Graduate school for every Catholic?

Whats it going to take?

[Winchester]

Free will is a son of a gun.

Who knows if Euty was properly catechized. Who knows if euty isn't a wiccan high priest. We know words, that's it, that's all.

Brainwashing is a much more involved process than we have time for in CAtholic school. We use subliminal messages in the lunch room and then we hypnotize the students to do horrible things like oppose abortion.

[CatholicCid]

[quote name='Winchester' post='1060417' date='Sep 10 2006, 06:24 PM']
We use subliminal messages in the lunch room and then we hypnotize the students to do horrible things like oppose abortion.
[/quote]

And get them to eat the meatloaf...

I'd agree with the statement that a lot in Catholic Schools aren't properly Catechized... Imo, it has little to do with how much is actually taught, it is how it is recieved. I've seen many people so hardened against learning anything Catholic that they went into the lessons with minds and hearts of stone.
The lessons were pure, it was the students who refused to even listen.

Edited September 10, 2006 by CatholicCid

[goldenchild17]

[quote name='Eutychus' post='1060397' date='Sep 10 2006, 06:36 PM']
If I had ten bucks for every time some smart alec Catholic tossed out the phrase.. [color="#000099"][b][i]"YOU WERE NEVER PROPERLY CATECHIZED"[/i][/b][/color] to me I would have enough by now for a GREAT winter ski trip vacation!

Despite 12 years of Catholic School, with ONLY Nuns and Priests as teachers { there were NO lay teachers in the day and age I went through the system } I hear that silly phrase over and over.

OK.

I ** SERIOUSLY WANT A DEFINITION HERE ** please!

[color="#660000"][b]Exactly WHEN DO YOU [size=4] ** BECOME PROPERLY **[/size]CATECHIZED?[/b][/color]

How do you KNOW if you were, or WERE NOT, [color="#990000"][size=4][b]PROPERLY[/b][/size][/color] catechized??

Is there a point when it is there, but not quite [size=4][b]PROPERLY??[/b][/size]
How do you know if you were PROPERLY, but with all the changes, your [size=4][b]PROPER[/b][/size], is [size=4][b]NOW IMPROPER??[/b][/size]

Seriously.

Honestly.

Please answer this for me.
[/quote]


It means being educated in this system after 1940's .

[Budge]

[quote]'ve seen many people so hardened against learning anything Catholic that they went into the lessons with minds and hearts of stone.
[u]The lessons were pure, it was the students who refused to even listen.[/u][/quote]

[img]http://www.hfsvt.org/images/Father-w-children.jpg[/img]

Yeah those stubborn 9 year old heretics and apostates!

[CatholicCid]

[quote name='Budge' post='1060488' date='Sep 10 2006, 09:08 PM']
[img]http://www.hfsvt.org/images/Father-w-children.jpg[/img]

Yeah those stubborn 9 year old heretics and apostates!
[/quote]

You ma'am didn't read my post entirely.

Edited September 11, 2006 by CatholicCid

[MIKolbe]

[quote name='Budge' post='1060488' date='Sep 10 2006, 08:08 PM']
[img]http://www.hfsvt.org/images/Father-w-children.jpg[/img]

Yeah those stubborn 9 year old heretics and apostates!
[/quote]

[PadrePioOfPietrelcino]

I agree that too often people say that any fallen away Catholic has not been properly Catechised. I also believe that it is not so much the Truth of the teaching that can lead to this but about the willingness to recieve. Peter was face to face and lived WITH the Truth, but he stilled denyed him. The difference is theat Peter was able to recognize it and come back. It is much easier to be a Protestant in today's world than it is a Catholic. Things are alot easier when we try to make Christ's words symbolic and feel goody. The fact is that sometime the Truth is hard to swallow, but swallow we must (Eucharistic pun intended). That is why I am not longer a Protestant Minister, but a Catholic laity.

[Aloysius]

there's a difference between knowing the Church and disagreeing with it, and having a complete ignorance of what it is actually all about. You, my friend, display an ignorance about what it is all about which would lead anyone to doubt that you had ever been catechised. I know plenty of folks who were properly catechised in the sense that they knew what the Church was about but then chose to disagree, and that's fine...

but your attempts to describe Catholic teaching are either straw men, misinterpretations, or outright lies. this is what the Catholic means when he thinks you were imporperly catechised.

[Eutychus]

[quote] t is much easier to be a Protestant in today's world than it is a Catholic. Things are alot easier when we try to make Christ's words symbolic and feel goody. The fact is that sometime the Truth is hard to swallow, but swallow we must (Eucharistic pun intended). That is why I am not longer a Protestant Minister, but a Catholic laity.[/quote]

Oh fiddle faddle!

Get REAL!

Just about EVERY ex Catholic becomes a fundy, or a fundy/pentecostal. That NORMALLY involves services on Sunday of 2hrs, AFTER you go for a 1 hour "Adult Sunday School" then we do "Wednesday Nights" which is another 2 hours. And just about EVERY ONE OF US does a "Bible Study of 2 Hrs" in addition to the above.

We used to give { $300 bucks a year - national average now for the Catholic Church } sparingly to the Catholic Church, as "fudy/pentecostals" we NORMALLY give a minimum of 10% of our GROSS, not net income, PLUS special collections for missions, building, books, and it is not unusual for most of us to support a needy kid overseas at $45 a month. Add it all up, the NORMAL contribution rate for EX Catholic Church's turned "fundy/pentecostals" is about $2,500 per family, EIGHT TIMES what we gave as pew stooges in the old parish.

Now, additionally, being EX RCCers, we didn't know SQUAT about the bible, as is the norm for Catholic Church'ers so MOST of us have to invest in biblical commentaries, tapes, lessons, books, and other "get up to speed" materials to make up for the so seriously deficient training in Gods word the petticoat pretenderes gave ... or rather did NOT give us as pew puppies.

I could go on and on....but your statement is just so WRONG....ask any EX Catholic which was easier, being a run in run out Roman Catholic, or a Fundie....and you will get an earful.

What denomination were you anyway, Episcopal, or Lutheran??

Edited September 11, 2006 by Eutychus

[CatholicCid]

Thank you again for another great post Eutychus.
Making everything religious materialistic was great.

[Eutychus]

[quote]Making everything religious materialistic was great. [/quote]

I guess you just "missed" the time requirements and the effort....huh? One does not enter into this "lifestyle" unless one is deeply moved by the Holy Spirit, it is just too much work, and resource demanding otherwise....

My Roman Catholic family, thinks I'm NUTSO for doing all that....they are "good Catholics" and ALWAYS make sure they go to Mass, at least once a month, and they always make sure to leave a $5 bill in the basket whenever they do... { despite them being borderline filthy rich... }

[img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/uploads/av-2807.gif[/img]

Why did the Vatican insist the clergy stop the Tonsure?

{ when they found out the bible actually forbids that hairstyle because the pagan priesthood wore them too?? Just wondering.... }

[CatholicCid]

[quote name='Eutychus' post='1060531' date='Sep 10 2006, 10:21 PM']
I guess you just "missed" the time requirements and the effort....huh? One does not enter into this "lifestyle" unless one is deeply moved by the Holy Spirit, it is just too much work, and resource demanding otherwise....
[/quote]

I was just commenting on how you felt a need to break religion down into such a materialistic and worldy things... Time, effort, and money.

I don't think we need to compare our spiritual lifes as they are what we make of them.

Though, it's nice to see no one escapes your ridicule and mockery, including your own family.

Edited September 11, 2006 by CatholicCid

[Paladin]

Let's ease up on the ad hominem hammers and focus on the actual question: what is proper catechesis?

Let's face it. You can grow up in a a very Catholic family, Catholic school and/or homeschool, be taught by people who know the faith, and still get "poorly" catechicized. I've seen it happen. People just don't know their faith, or they just disagree with the faith they're taught. Maybe they had bad teachers who clung to "enlightened" doctrines that didn't teach much about the Church. Maybe they had a dogmatic teacher who didn't care if his students loved Jesus so long as they knew about Him. There are a lot of reasons. I've also seen kids who were raised in athiest homes, turn to the Church on their own accord, and come out knowing more than I do.

Actually, that seems to be the norm for converts: they know more about the Faith than their Catholic by birth brethren. I think that to a degree, people who grow up with the Faith are less zealous and knowledgable about it than converts. I don't think this is limited to Catholicism, as Budge and Eutychus believe. I've seen Baptist kids turn pagan, Lutherans turned athiest. And I've see the vice-versa. I think the reason is converts feel there's so much to explore. It's all very new to them, whereas kids who grow up learning from their parents feel like they "know" enough already, or they want to rebel as kids tend to do. (Please note I'm not referring to Budge, Eutychus, or anyone else here as kids, but I'm making generalizations about people who grow up Christian.)

What's the answer? There's no easy one. All you can do is raise your kids with love and knowledge. Guide them in the Faith, don't shove them into it.

Eutychus, I'm sorry you've been told you're poorly catechized. For all we know, you were expertly catechized and simply disagree with the Church. It happens. I pray that you some day return, but that's your choice. If you feel you were poorly catechized, educate yourself. Read the Catechism and the Church Fathers and all that. Frankly, if you think you were shorted in your education, the responsibility is yours to seek out the Truth. I pray that you find it, or at least cling to whatever kernels of it you find.

Oh, and for everyone that accuses anyone of "improper catechesis": be part of the solution and teach what you know to be the Truth. And do it with Christian patience, understanding, and love.