Bishop In Vietnam: Ok To Join Communists

[Budge]

[quote]OK to join Communists, Vietnamese Bishop tells young faithful

[size=4]
A Vietnamese bishop has told a gathering of 60,000 young people that they have the right to join the Communist Party provided their faith is not threatened.[/size][url="http://www.cathnews.com/news/608/167.php"]LINk[/url]

UCA News reports that Bishop Joseph Nguyen Chi Linh (pictured) was responding to a question from a participant who asked whether religious freedom is respected in Vietnam and whether Catholics are allowed to join the Communist Party.

Bishop Nguyen replied that from the Church's standpoint, religious freedom is part of human nature and inherent from birth, since religion covers the relationship between a person's soul and God.

However, this concept of religious freedom has hardly been implemented in Vietnam, the Bishop said, since relations between the government and Church were strained in the past by war, ideology and historical complications.

"Whether to join the Communist Party or not is your right," he continued. "The Church just reminds you to consider whether such an environment threatens your faith or not," he said, adding that faith "is above all."

"The Church never wants to oppose any government but wants to call it to respect freedom of religion," Bishop Nguyen stated. "Whether to join the Communist Party or not is your right," he continued. "The Church just reminds you to consider whether such an environment threatens your faith or not," he said, adding that faith "is above all."

Bishop Nguyen was speaking at a gathering at Vinh in northern Vietnam of Catholics aged 18-30 taking part in the fifth annual northern Vietnamese Catholic youth gathering.

Archbishop Joseph Ngo Quang Kiet of Hanoi, six bishops, 200 priests and a few thousand nuns also attended the gathering on the theme "What shall I do, Lord?"

Archbishop Kiet identified "individualism, consumerism, liberalism, relativism and materialism" as common factors connecting various social problems.

Liberalism leads many people to "mistakenly think that freedom means the rights to do whatever they want and to say whatever they want to say," the Archbishop said.

He also warned that while a market-oriented economy encourages people to work and do business to get rich and develop the country the danger is that people may come to respect only material things.[/quote]

[cappie]

Your draging up old stories that was reported at the end of august. Can't you do better than that

[url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=56580"]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=56580[/url]

[Akalyte]

The Bishop of Vietnam doesnt speak for the entire Church.

[Budge]

[quote]Your draging up old stories that was reported at the end of august. Can't you do better than that blink.gif
[/quote]

Hey even I miss some of the news...


[quote]
The Bishop of Vietnam doesnt speak for the entire Church.[/quote]

Do you think the Pope or any Cardinals will tell him not to tell people not to join the Commies?

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Budge' post='1060182' date='Sep 10 2006, 11:55 AM']
Do you think the Pope or any Cardinals will tell him not to tell people not to join the Commies?
[/quote]
I hope someone pulls him aside. I tend to want to give him the benefit of the doubt though, the news likes to zero in on little comments like that out of context simply because they are slightly shocking or scandalous. I'm sure the situation is more complex then we realize, and I like to hope that there was more to what the Bishop said than meets the eye.

[Eutychus]

Now Budge, that isn't fair.

Only a few months ago, it was revealed that INSIDE THE VATICAN itself, the commies had Cardinals spying on JPII and reporting back to the Polish Secret police.

Goodness....if the VATICAN can do that, and no one was excommunicated for that, a Vietnamese Cardinal can be a COMMIE TOO, no need even to change the color of his pretty outfits, [color="#FF0000"][b]COMMIE RED and CARDINAL RED[/b] [/color]are so close....

[img]http://www.neatorama.com/images/2005-12/mao-red-book.jpg[/img]

[img]http://news.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41047000/jpg/_41047477_afp300portugalmartin.jpg[/img]

Edited September 10, 2006 by Eutychus

[Socrates]

This Cardinal lives in a country where the Communist government unfortunately still wields considerable control over religion and public life. I do not agree with this Cardinal's words, but we must keep in mind that in his country, speaking out against the Communist party is illegal. We should pray for the Church in Vietnam and other communist countries, that they have the strength to stand up against the Communist oppression.

Trying to use this incident to prove the Catholic Church is Communist is just ridiculous. Popes have repeatedly and explicitly condemned Communism, and Pope John Paul II is widely recognized as doing more than any one individual to bring about the fall of global Communism. Even a quick survey of the history of the Church and Communism will show how absurd your claim is.

[url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?s=&showtopic=55868&view=findpost&p=1042263"](See here.)[/url]

Edited September 11, 2006 by Socrates

[aalpha1989]

And besides, I find your (Budge's) repeated news stories of individual priests and cardinals (taken out of context with no background information, and so any judgement we make would be skewed. not that we or you have the authority to make judgements anyway) childish and not in the least convincing to anyone except yourself. C.S. Lewis said that the only good argument against Christianity was Christians themselves. Based upon your own logic, no one should even be Christian. We should all probably join Hinduism, or Judaism. If you can't come up with real arguments, don't even bother posting attacks on the Church. It's rather annoying.

[Eutychus]

[quote]Based upon your own logic, no one should even be Christian. We should all probably join Hinduism, or Judaism. I [/quote]

I could have sworn, that is what the Catholic Church has been doing these past years anyway, with Assisi one, Assisi two, and only LAST WEEK, Assisi THREE.

And lest you think that this is confined to Assisi, far from it!

[quote]
HINDUS, BUDDHISTS, AND MUSLIMS SURPRISE OFFICIALS AT SHRINES DEDICATED TO VIRGIN

[b]The Indian Express reports an upsurge in Hindus, Muslims, and Buddhists visiting Catholic shrines dedicated to the Blessed Mother. As it says in its report, which we could not directly link due to technical problems:

"In an unexpected twist of globalization, Hindus, Buddhists, Muslims and other pilgrims regularly worship at famous Roman Catholic shrines to the Virgin Mary such as Lourdes in France and Fatima in Portugal. They drink the holy water, light votive candles and pray fervently to the Madonna for help with life's hardships. Many venerate her like one of their own goddesses, a view that would be a heresy if a Catholic theologian tried to defend it.

Rather than turned away, the newcomers are free to join the crowds from Ireland, Italy, Spain, and other traditionally Catholic countries who flock to Europe's most popular shrines. [/b][/quote]

[aalpha1989]

So you are arguing with me by doing the very thing I accused you of? Find faults with the Theology itself (not that you can, but you can try if you want), not the people who believe it. No one is perfect, and C.S. Lewis saw that. Ever read Mere Christianity? He says that anyone watching the planet would never be able to tell that we had a moral code. What they would see is sex, violence, and drugs. Therefore, this must be our moral code, right? Wrong....therefore, don't pin the Catholic Church as evil just because some Catholics make mistakes. All people (including you and me) make mistakes, but that doesn't make our religion bad. Stop using faulty logic in a forum full of logicians. I am not one, most people here are smarter than me, but your posts are pointless, all they do is make you feel better about yourself.

Edited September 11, 2006 by aalpha1989

[ruso]

We can agree or not with Monseñor Joseph Nguyen Chi Linh, he has not said anything contrary to the teachings of the Church,
The position of the Church is very complicated in Vietnam, although better than in China, one must look at the statements inside what occurs in Vietnam.
The catholics suffered very hard pursuits, and the Church remains in Vietnam, while the Protestants were running as rabbits, now that there is certain religious liberty and are opened al capitalism, the protestant sects return to Vietnam. Perhaps for MONEY?.