Jesus Is A Human Being(disconnect Line& Read

[hyperdulia again]

On the Cross Christ died. He died the way that you and I will die, completely. He was raised from the dead. He is in Heaven. This is the Mystery of Faith we proclaim in the Mass.

Christ has died.

Christ is risen.

Christ will come again.

He is all. He is the only reason to breathe, the only reason to try and live a moral life the only reason to do anything. His death was not a moment of weakness it was triumph par excellance, he killed sin, he blinded the beast, and freed me.

Ayed, if you had been the only person on the planet, God would've still come down to the Earth and laid down His life. Taken off his immortality and His eternity for just a bit to save you from the tortures of Hell. God is amesome (as in He causes awe). He is love. He is truth and He is mercy, in my reading of the Holy Qu'ran, Allah does not strike me as a God who inspires love and devotion He seems very willing to give out punishment, but where is His mercy? It is almost completely lacking it isn't even shown to repentant sinners. Don't you think there has to be MORE to God than angry pronouncements and general dispassionate watching of Humanity. He died so that we might live. He died, because we, each of us, owe a debt to God that we couldn't repay on our own. He the creditor repayed the debt that we the debtor owe Him. All we have to do is say yes to Him and say yes to the Church He founded.

God looked at everything He made and thought it was "very good" so why then in His un-imaginable love for us would He not become one of us, born from the womb of a Virgin?

Mary concieved without sin, holiest Mother of God, great Queen of Truth ask the Lord to flood us all with love for truth, even when it is hard, even when it goes against all we've been taught.

St Matthew pray for us.

St Mark pray for us.

St. Luke pray for us.

St John pray for us.

St. Paul pray for us.

St Peter pray for us.

Lord have mercy!

Christ have mercy!

Edited July 30, 2003 by hyperdulia again

[ironmonk]

thank you all of you who spent his muh time to debate.

Anyone who written some bd words or some attcks on. I say again, hang your hat .i will not pat attention to that nor can you divert attention of our dear members or visitors .

whatsoever someone says or attacks, it does not bother me .

ironmok:

"ayed, Jesus died for you. He suffered for you. He is the fulfillment of the Old Testament Scriptures"

A-I am a muslim, praise be to Allah, I am not in need of a messnger who is right now at His heaven. alive not dead.

1-If you , inronmonk believe Jesus(peace be upon him) died.Then, you have the follwoing:

The Father.

The Holy spirit.

the Jesus died which leads to :

3-1=2

If you believe in Jesus as God , why did he die?

a God dies for you or for me?

where is immortality?eternal?

If we take it for granted that he(Jesus) died , won't you die ? won' I die?

If you believe that then,

Jesus=human being flesh and blood

jesus=you and me

thank you

and be redy to another questions

(*)special thank to our Moderator ho organized this debate and sif up what was writtn

ayed,

God Bless.

Jesus died, descended into the dead, and rose again on the Third day, in fulfillment of the Word of God.

Jesus assended to Heaven to the Right Hand of His Father. Jesus is the only begotten Son of the Father. The Holy Spirit goes forth from the Father and the Son. Not three Gods, but One God. God is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. Three persons, that have always been.

Jesus died and was Resurrected.... As God had promised in the OT, and showed us in the NT.

Jesus is God.

God Bless, Love in Christ & Mary

ironmonk

[ayed]

In the name of Allah , the Most merciful , the Most gracious

By your favor , execuse me going on this weekend , this Wednesday till Friday. I will be back , by Allah’s sustenace, to discuss with you another issue and not forget to go over our previous posts and to meditate what we have discussed.

So. Have this passage:

The matter is a piece of cake.Just open up your mind and meditate if someone of you happen to experience the following situation:

(*)All of sudden , a traffic police stopped you without any reason, gave you a violation slip and cried at your face commanding to show up at your State Court ?how can you behave in this case?what is your reaction towards him?is not it oppressive of him to do so?It is accepted that you will ask him instantly what mistake you commited to be given such an unlawful violation slip.So,you try to look for any convincing mistake to calm down your soul and nerves that you deserve it.Moreover, you will look for any bit of justification for this alleged violation slip.

Rationalize this : It is not of our Creator’s laws to Create you sinned or punish you on account of your father or mother’s sins or even ancestors’without commiting criminal evil deeds. I do not object Allah’s ability.He Is able to do whatever He wishes.

So,You will object paying the alleged violation slip which is of no a justification.

Do you think Allah will account your sins without justifications?The rational man has the answer.

The matter is as simple as this :

Worship Allah(God) only Him

Do good deeds , Allah will rewards you

If you do wrongdoings, Allah punishes you

Allah says in the Holy Quran:

“So whosoever does good equal to the weight of an atom (or a small ant), shall see it(*)And whosoever does evil equal to the weight of an atom (or a small ant), shall see it(Az-zalzalah 7:8)

And He says about His Oneness:

“Say (O Muhammad (Peace be upon him)): "He is Allâh, (the) One "Allâh-us-Samad (The Self-Sufficient Master, Whom all creatures need, He neither eats nor drinks)"He begets not, nor was He begotten; "He begets not, nor was He begotten” "And there is none co-equal or comparable unto Him"(Al-ikhlass 1:4)

***********************************************************

At last, I would like to thank you for all your clear comments and special thank to the moderator of Phatmass who supervises our debate.

I would like to say , although there are neither familial ties nor realtionships between me and you, we are sons of Adam and Eve.I haven’t come over here neither to bother nor to upset you . You don’t owe me a dime nor do I as well.

We are fallible human beings , sometimes you understand me and sometimes I do. As you can apparently notice, from my second language-- English , that I endeavour to express my beliefs and though but , sometimes, my English lets me down.Consequntly, some if not most of you may misconceive what I write down here.

Oh! christian pals , I apologize if I hurt anyone of you.Kindly, if I am not welcomed here, just tell me to stop writing here forever.

Have a nice weekend,

Yours faithfully,

Ayed

[ReformationNow]

In the name of Allah , the Most merciful , the Most gracious

By your favor , execuse me going on this weekend , this Wednesday till Friday. I will be back , by Allah’s sustenace, to discuss with you another issue and not forget to go over our previous posts and to meditate what we have discussed.

So. Have this passage:

The matter is a piece of cake.Just open up your mind and meditate if someone of you happen to experience the following situation:

(*)All of  sudden , a traffic police stopped you without any reason, gave you a violation slip and cried at your face commanding to show up at your State Court ?how can you behave in this case?what is your reaction towards him?is not it oppressive of him to do so?It is accepted that you will ask him instantly what mistake you commited to be given such an unlawful violation slip.So,you try to look for any convincing mistake to calm down your soul and nerves that you deserve it.Moreover, you will look for any bit of justification for this alleged violation slip.

Rationalize this : It is not of our Creator’s laws to Create you sinned or punish you on account of  your father or mother’s sins or even ancestors’without commiting criminal evil deeds. I do not object Allah’s ability.He Is able to do whatever He wishes.

So,You will object paying the alleged violation slip which is of no a justification.

Do you think Allah will account your sins without justifications?The rational man has the answer.

The matter is as simple as this :

Worship Allah(God) only Him

Do good deeds , Allah will rewards you

If you do wrongdoings, Allah punishes you

Allah says in the Holy Quran:

“So whosoever does good equal to the weight of an atom (or a small ant), shall see it(*)And whosoever does evil equal to the weight of an atom (or a small ant), shall see it(Az-zalzalah 7:8)

And He says about His Oneness:

“Say (O Muhammad (Peace be upon him)): "He is Allâh, (the) One "Allâh-us-Samad (The Self-Sufficient Master, Whom all creatures need, He neither eats nor drinks)"He begets not, nor was He begotten; "He begets not, nor was He begotten” "And there is none co-equal or comparable unto Him"(Al-ikhlass 1:4)

***********************************************************

At last, I would like to thank you for all your  clear comments and special thank to the moderator of Phatmass who supervises our debate.

I would like to say , although there are neither familial ties nor realtionships  between me and you, we are sons of Adam and Eve.I haven’t come over here neither to bother nor  to upset you . You don’t owe me a dime nor do I as well.

We are fallible human beings  , sometimes you understand me and sometimes I do. As you can apparently notice, from my second language-- English , that I endeavour to express my beliefs and though but , sometimes, my English lets me down.Consequntly, some if not most of you may misconceive what I write down here.

Oh! christian pals , I apologize if I hurt anyone of you.Kindly,  if I am not welcomed here, just tell me to stop writing here forever.

Have a nice weekend,

Yours faithfully,

Ayed

Please Ayed, do NOT stop posting here. By all means continue. We can learn from eachother. I, for one, appreciate your politeness in your posts. It is most considerate of you to stop and reflect how your posts may affect others. I pray that we may all do the same.

In Christ,

[jasJis]

ayed,

What is your native language?

[Aloysius]

hey ayed

yeah, definitely dont stop posting, its great to learn about other ppl's viewpoints

anyway, i was wondering about the claim that Islam is descendant of Ishmael-- the great nation God said he would make of Ishmael. I'm interested in comments from both sides around here as to weather Islam is the great nation from Ishmael and Judaism and eventually Christianity are the great nation from Isaac. If so, i find this extremely interesting.

Allah's aight i guess, except the legalistic punishment side, reward for good works and punishment for bad wrks, i dont really think that's how that wrks.

but i think that Islam has ties to God's covenant w/ Ishmael and Hagar <tell me if im wrong everyone> so it is therefore interesting to learn about

if this is the claim of Islam, i pose a ?, isn't it pretty clear in the OT that Iaasac was the more highly favored by God, or is that just 'jewish corruption' of some sort in your oppinion.

anyway, may God's blessing be upon you

may Jesus' blessing be upon you (God to me, cool prophet guy to you)

and may God's love overwhelm you

PEACE

[hyperdulia again]

The Arab people fulfill God's promise to Ishmael and his mother, NOT the Islamic religion.

Edited July 31, 2003 by hyperdulia again

[Anna]

Ayed,

Regarding mercy, how does Allah treat one who has transgressed and then repented?

Everyone does commit sin on occasion, no matter how hard we try to avoid it. When that happens, and we sorrow over offending God, why would He not, like the Most Loving of Fathers, forgive us, His children?

Pax Christi. <><

[ayed]

thank you for your question .

Allah says:

"Say: "O 'Ibâdî (My slaves) who have transgressed against themselves (by committing evil deeds and sins)! Despair not of the Mercy of Allâh, verily Allâh forgives all sins Truly, He is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful"(Az-zomor , verse:53)

He is the most Merciful , the Most grcious. :lol:

[benedict_x]

Bump!

Isnt this the same topic as the Jesus is not God one?

Why do we have two threads spanning the same topic again?