Budge Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 [size=5][u]No man can by any means redeem his brother,Or give to God a ransom for him-- For the redemption of his soul is costly,[/u] And he should cease trying forever- - Psalm 49:7-8[/size] This scripture slices and dices many a Catholic teaching... [quote]Being obedient she became the cause of salvation for herself and for the whole human race .... CCC 494 [/quote] [quote] [u]This union of the mother with the Son in the work of salvation is made manifest[/u] from the time of Christ's virginal conception up to his death. . . . CCC 964[/quote] [quote] . . [u]She is inseparably linked with the saving work of her Son.[/u] CCC 1172[/quote] book of FALSE doctrine {I own this one by the way for research} [img]http://www.jmjstore.org/store/images/image_w/W-B1315.JPG[/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 Are you denying the unique role in salvation that Mary played? It was by her obedience that salvation was brought to us. It was Jesus Christ, flesh of her flesh, that brought us salvation, yes, but had Mary said no, he wouldn't have been born. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budge Posted September 3, 2006 Author Share Posted September 3, 2006 Mary had no role in our salvation. Reread it again... [size=5] No man can by any means redeem his brother,Or give to God a ransom for him-- For the redemption of his soul is costly, And he should cease trying forever- - Psalm 49:7-8[/size] Compare with this other false teaching... 2027 No one can merit the initial grace which is at the origin of conversion.[size=5] Moved by the Holy Spirit, we can merit for ourselves and for others all the graces needed[/size] to attain eternal life, as well as necessary temporal goods. no man BY ANY MEANS can redeem his brother!!! Do you folks believe what Gods Word says or not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eutychus Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 [b]NO[/b] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norseman82 Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 James 5:20: Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins. (KJV) Remember this: the person who brings a sinner back from his way will save his soul from death and cancel a multitude of sins (NAB 1970) Oh, and verse 7 of Psalm 49 (what you posted was verses 8-9, not 7-8) refers to [i]material[/i] wealth, so the context is really about rich people thinking they can uy their way to redemption and heaven. Nice try, but we didn't just get off the boat yesterday. [img]http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b61/Norseman82/80e025f2.jpg[/img] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XIX Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 So you have no interest in helping us get to Heaven, and staying out of Hell? Lest you *gasp* have a role in our salvation... Budge, you are a very intelligent human being. This is clear. I mean this in the nicest way possible--there is no logical way you actually believe the things you are posting. I believe you are trying to fool us and yourself. Maybe I'm wrong. But I'm a bit baffled by your posts sometimes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brother Adam Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 (edited) [quote name='Budge' post='1056061' date='Sep 3 2006, 04:35 PM'] Mary had no role in our salvation. Reread it again... [size=5] No man can by any means redeem his brother,Or give to God a ransom for him-- For the redemption of his soul is costly, And he should cease trying forever- - Psalm 49:7-8[/size] Compare with this other false teaching... 2027 No one can merit the initial grace which is at the origin of conversion.[size=5] Moved by the Holy Spirit, we can merit for ourselves and for others all the graces needed[/size] to attain eternal life, as well as necessary temporal goods. no man BY ANY MEANS can redeem his brother!!! Do you folks believe what Gods Word says or not? [/quote] 24Now I rejoice in what was suffered for you, and I fill up in my flesh what is still lacking in regard to Christ's afflictions, for the sake of his body, which is the church. Colossians 1:24 I'm glad you have Miraville's book. Now read it sometime as you obviously don't have any clue what the word co-redemptrix means, nor do you have any clue what the Catechism is stating. Why do you deny the Word of God and ignore the authentic understanding of the Catholic faith for your asisine anti-Catholic hogwash? Instead of bothering the good folks here with your lies and false doctrines, go do something productive like pray for forgiveness for trying to lead souls away from Christ here. We've been trying to engage you in honest dialogue, and yet your insistance of spamming and trolling this board continues. You will never be able to take us away from Christ or His Church no matter how many verses you sling at us taken out of context and without even a basic understanding of what the verse is saying. Edited September 3, 2006 by Brother Adam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 I am glad there are real Bible experts out there to steer us away from the Catholic Church, since they've been around longer and thus have actually experienced the history they presume to know. Thank God for immortals and their presence on the internet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KnightofChrist Posted September 3, 2006 Share Posted September 3, 2006 (edited) [quote name='Budge' post='1056061' date='Sep 3 2006, 12:35 PM'] Mary had no role in our salvation.[/quote] Mary gave birth to Salvation. How is that "no role?" [quote name='Budge' post='1056061' date='Sep 3 2006, 12:35 PM'] Do you folks believe what Gods Word says or not? [/quote] We believe the word of God, we just do not believe your flawed interpretation. Edited September 3, 2006 by KnightofChrist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budge Posted September 4, 2006 Author Share Posted September 4, 2006 Jesus saves not Mary... [size=4] Act 4:12 [u]Neither is there salvation in any other:[/u] for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.[/size] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fides_et_Ratio Posted September 4, 2006 Share Posted September 4, 2006 Don't worry so much, Budge. We can't love Mary anymore than Jesus does. It's impossible. Mary "saves" in the sense that she brings Christ. All who seek Mary, find Christ her Son... her soul magnifies the LORD (cf. Luke 1:46). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djc08 Posted September 4, 2006 Share Posted September 4, 2006 Nobody is saying that The Blessed Virgin saves all by herself. We are saying that because of Mary's "yes" she brought, only because God chose to, salvation to the world in the form man and his name was Jesus. By the way you have to read the Bible in context budge...you can't take one verse out the the Bible and apply it to something completely different then what the verses surrounding that verse is conveying. [quote]Mary "saves" in the sense that she brings Christ. All who seek Mary, find Christ her Son... her soul magnifies the LORD (cf. Luke 1:46).[/quote] Can we get an "Amen" from the choir? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MIKolbe Posted September 4, 2006 Share Posted September 4, 2006 Budge- when's the last time you called her 'blessed'? ...other than a rousing rendition of Silent Night?? In a nutshell, devotion to Mary makes us obedient to her Son. John 2:5, from the KJV, no less... "His mother saith unto the servants, [b][size=7]'Whatsoever he saith unto you, do it[/size][/b].' " bold and outrageous font size, just for Budge.. : Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mateo el Feo Posted September 4, 2006 Share Posted September 4, 2006 [quote]She is inseparably linked with the saving work of her Son.[/quote]I don't really understand why you quoted this, Budge. Read the sentence. The saving work of...whom? Do you have a problem with the Catholic Church teaching that Our Lord Jesus Christ saved us? In the next sentence of paragraph 1172 ([url="http://www.usccb.org/catechism/text/pt2sect1chpt2.htm"]link[/url]), she is called the "most excellent fruit of redemption." In light of Luke 1:48 ([url="http://www.usccb.org/nab/bible/luke/luke1.htm#v48"]link[/url]), I hope you would at least agree that this description was reasonable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jswranch Posted September 4, 2006 Share Posted September 4, 2006 (edited) [quote name='Budge' post='1056247' date='Sep 3 2006, 07:37 PM'] Jesus saves not Mary... [/quote] I could begin to take you seriously if you actually understood Catholic doctrine. All to often you are confused to what the Marian doctrines are about. No one is saying Mary saves and Jesus does not. Edited September 4, 2006 by jswranch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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