Anna Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 (edited) It is a good thing I do not try to justify sin like that. Most peeps don't realize when they are justifying sin like that. There are active homosexuals who will misinterpret the prohibition on homosexual relations, there are heterosexuals who will justify sterilization and contraception (basically, the sin of Onan) as being "good stewards", etc. They are sincere, perhaps, but they are sincerely wrong. If you could agree that both are not shown from Scripture - you are on the weakest leg of all. Well, that would be lying. Both are shown from Scripture, and it has been provided to you already on several threads here. Well. Ya know - things like 'The Word of the Lord shall stand forever' or 'All Scripture is God-Breathed' and ya know, since you also agree it is inerrant... Well. Ya know - The Bible says that The Church is the pillar and foundation of Truth, and the Church---Authority, Tradition, and Scripture combined---present a unified teaching for all, without deviations and a variety of interpretations, teachings as old as the Scriptures themselves. Unfortunately, you base your Apostolic Tradition and the Holy Spirit guided authority off what I consider to be weak interpretations of Scripture. What you consider to be weak interpretations is incorrect. What I consider, what Augustine considered, what Ignatius of Antioch considered, etc., etc., etc. is what the Catholic Church still teaches to this day. What do you make of this: "If you love me, deny your very self..." Are you willing to put your own pride, your own man-made, ever-changing theology aside, and consider that Christ truly established one single Church, prayed for it to remain one, commissioned it with certain authority, bestowed gifts to it, and released His Holy Spirit upon it...and that it still exists, One baptism, One Faith, One Lord, to this day? Pax Christi. <>< Edited January 7, 2004 by Anna Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyperdulia again Posted January 7, 2004 Author Share Posted January 7, 2004 bumper cars Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyperdulia again Posted January 7, 2004 Author Share Posted January 7, 2004 circular bump Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circle_Master Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 why you keep bumping Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyperdulia again Posted January 7, 2004 Author Share Posted January 7, 2004 i want to know if i'm SAVED? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circle_Master Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 how would i know! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 It is a good thing I do not try to justify sin like that. You can't seem to get it into you head that I want to be more like Christ. I love doing things in Scripture, and it never bothers me to tell the truth, or to tell the gospel. I love seeing someone's face when they learn something new about God and go 'wow!'. This is the process of sanctification - that makes us love God and hate evil. If anything, I may twist Scripture a little to make it harder on myself. Well. Ya know - things like 'The Word of the Lord shall stand forever' or 'All Scripture is God-Breathed' and ya know, since you also agree it is inerrant... Unfortunately, you base your Apostolic Tradition and the Holy Spirit guided authority off what I consider to be weak interpretations of Scripture. If you could agree that both are not shown from Scripture - you are on the weakest leg of all. Your verse emphasis's why we call it 'perseverance of the saints'. Because it is promised we will persevere to the end - just as Matthew 10:22 says. exactly - our salvation is God's work. I agree completely! I don't tell anyone they are not saved or saved based on anything. I will let them know if they don't agree with what the Bible calls for to be saved they are not saved though! That is arguing against God - not me. My comments on your comments of her comments: Nobody is arguing that you don't love God. Its nice to see you believe in doing works. The Word of the Lord included written and oral teaching just as St.Paul said. SCripture came from Aposolic Tradition, not the other way around. perserverance of the Saints is good...for the Saints. Scripture does not promise perserverence for sinners. Salvation is God's work and our work as well. Cooperation. When you talk to people about being saved , do you tell them to read the whole Bible and decide for themselves, or do you point out appropriate verses for them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyperdulia again Posted January 7, 2004 Author Share Posted January 7, 2004 cIRCLE SAID: I agree completely! I don't tell anyone they are not saved or saved based on anything. I will let them know if they don't agree with what the Bible calls for to be saved they are not saved though! That is arguing against God - not me. i SAID: i don't agree with what you say the bible calls for to be saved circle, in fact i whole-heartedly disagree. am i not saved? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circle_Master Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 then no, you aren't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyperdulia again Posted January 7, 2004 Author Share Posted January 7, 2004 oh my. i wish i had this ability to know when someone's hell-bound. *sips coffee* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circle_Master Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 rofl. and for the record - i really don't know if you are saved or not. the elements of salvation are present in Catholicism - but the elements for a works-based salvation are too. So depending on how you understand salvation by grace - that is what determines if you are still under the law - or under freedom. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyperdulia again Posted January 7, 2004 Author Share Posted January 7, 2004 i don't think any catholic thinks they're going to get to heaven by being good and not talking with their mouth full. we are saved by christ. christ demands that we do the works of the father. the sacraments convey the grace they represent. i expect the sanctifying grace available from christ in the sacraments offered by his church to save me. am i saved? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hyperdulia again Posted January 7, 2004 Author Share Posted January 7, 2004 the graces present in those sacraments are available to me because god incarnate hung on a cross that i might be forgiven for my sins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 rofl. and for the record - i really don't know if you are saved or not. the elements of salvation are present in Catholicism - but the elements for a works-based salvation are too. So depending on how you understand salvation by grace - that is what determines if you are still under the law - or under freedom. But remember Catholics don't have a works-based salvation. WE just say you can't have one without the other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circle_Master Posted January 7, 2004 Share Posted January 7, 2004 But remember Catholics don't have a works-based salvation. WE just say you can't have one without the other. The jews said that too. They also said their oral law was inspired and of God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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