People In Christ, But Not In Church

[Guest]

im'a catholic, as well as my family

parts of my family dont attend mass regulary at all

but they are still good people, and jus becuz certian people attend mass more, in my book that does not make them more christian or any better. i understand communion is an important thing, and i will not argue this, but i also know God knows hearts, and every meal i eat, i belive im participateing in eating the body of Christ. If theirs one thing i would i say i dont like about "church peeps" , is that some of the members, would be quick to judge someone elses salvation, that goes to a different church, or even doesnt go to church, and im guilty of this to, becuz i have way to often judged when i shouldnt have, and I pray the lord will have mercy on me and show me his Grace. But i feel salvation is by faith alone, and i bet u there are people who go to church but dont have actual faith that Jesus was Christ, and that he was raised on the third day, on the other hand, these people think they will get to Heaven by works, and God will judge them and I pray he'll let'em in.....I have a aunt and uncle, who I love dearly, who dont go to church at all, but there great people, and God knows there heart, and it really makes me mad when church people will say their salvation is doomed to hell, I cant stand to here it, and i think its stupidity

so i dont even know where im going with this lol but ya, anyways

Edited January 5, 2004 by Guest

[traichuoi]

Catholocism teaches that we must have faith AND works....not just faith and not just works

[M.SIGGA]

Well God is everywhere and Jesus said that he would always be there to help us whenever we need him, so I guess Jesus could be in bar if two Christians are gathered in his name, like in prayer or something ?!?

And you have a good point that some people across denominations believe they are saved by works alone while giving Jesus good lipservice, and a lot of folks who sit in church everyday of their life can end up in hell.

But if you believe in faith alone, why wouldn't your amesome faith move you to experience Jesus in fellowship with other Christians and in an extremey personal way in the Blessed Sacrament during mass? The faith that saves isn't separated from works, because they flow into one another, and you would be practicing what you preach in the fullest sense.

[Guest]

i agree with what your sayen, completly

i jus wish, like at mass, there would be more preaching done

i almost sometimes prefer to go to a church where i can hear a preacher get up there and preach, like i say, im catholic, and i dont wanna offenend nobody, I belive God put me where i am for a reason, but like i dunno, i feel sorta weird sayen it, but i guess i get more out of it when im sitten in a church where a preacher is preachen, and you can really feel the holy spirt, and a thing that bugs me about some catholics, is that they'll say that their church is "THE CHURCH" and me being a catholic to, im not saying i disagree, i jus think its ignorant to say that someone else, haveing their church, cant be "The Church" to, i know this isnt even to do with what i posted before, but i dunno, its wuts on my mind i guess

[Guest]

so like i guess im sayen

if a few people are chillen somewhere, and their in the word, talken about God, I think that can be called Church jus as much as anything else. And i think anyone can give communion, i dont feel i need a priest to do this for me. And in no way am i takeing a shot at priest, i have much respect for them, and what they stand for, and i admire them very much, becuz i know that it has to be a huge sacrifrice to do what they do. But i read alot of the post here from people, and its like the attitude is to be a devout christain means, that 1....ur catholic, and 2 your in church everyweek and so forth, again dont take my comments as being arrogant or anything, cuz im catholic also, and I love my faith, and I have alot of respect for the people who know alot more then i do when it comes to the teachings and stuff like that, this being a debate table though, i jus said wut was on my mind right now

[M.SIGGA]

You seem to be a little new to PM, but 99% of all the debates are theological shouting matches, which don't really exemplify the love of Christ all the time. I don't know anyone personally on this board, but I'm thinking that it is more of people defending their faith instead of faithless gloating, but I'm sure there is a difference in oppinion out there. It makes me feel better that this is everyone's intention, both Catholic and Protestant.

[M.SIGGA]

For the record, someone dropped me a little VC flag under my name and I'm thankful and speechless that some other outside folks consider me a faithful Catholic, which I pray everyday to be, but I'm no fancy theologian or anything.

I'm guessing that you are talking about preaching from a pastor's personal conviction, which is common in evangelical protestantism, is what you enjoy. I really like it too, but that is not usually part of the liturgy outside the homily, so you might have to shop around for a priest like that, but you should go to mass anyway to pray with other Christians who share your faith and also to recieve communion - not because it's totally the rules, also because it's spiritually healthy and that's why the Church asks it. All Christians are recognized by Catholics as members of Christ's Universal Church, but as family that disagrees about the rules of the house. Just beware false teachings whenever anyone is preaching from a personal conviction.

A lot of Christians across denoms are sketchy, and I don't think it's spiritually healthy to only be a Christian in the shaddow of what other people are doing or how other people feel. Throughout history, hypocritical "Church Christians" have been responsible for a multiude of damages against humanity, including a lot of Christians still doing this stuff today. I'm not a Christian because my parents and friends are, but because I love Jesus. I think you are saying that the world will know you are a Christian by love instead of words.

I'm not in the business of throwing stones because I respect free will, but I don't see a few select things the same way that said you do in your post. But I do understand what you are talking about. There are a great many Christians in the world today who are talking the talk and walking the walk, but a lot of times you might never run into them. The world would have never known about Mother Theresa in the gutters of Calcutta if a curious BBC reporter didn't find out about her to do a story. There are witnesses like that everywhere. Pray and live your Faith and I promise that you will see a whole other side to Christianity which includes seeing real loving Christians-in-action, and in the Eucharist you will find Jesus in an extreme and amesome way that doesn't come close to any human emotion you might experience otherwise.

God Bless :D

[Guest]

thanks for the reply man

i was feelen wut u were sayen

[jasJis]

no-tw with know-tw,

I understand your concern. Consider a few things though. Sometimes people don't go to Church because they fail to see Grace there. Sometimes people don't go to Church because they are refusing the Grace they know is there and think they have justifiable reasons to do so. They are very different motives and not easily discerned in most cases. I have family that don't necessarily go to Church. I don't ride them, but I'm happy to be an example and to share my happiness in the graces me and my family recieve. We live happy and always are happy for them to attend with us.

Recently, a non-Catholic family member has shared with us her desire to explore becoming Catholic. It's been more than 20 years since she has belonged to any denomination, and she has strong reasons why. No discussions. No debates. Occaisional questions over the years. And now this.

Be patient, and pray. Place a lot of trust in your Faith in our Hope of God's Mercy, Justice, and Power. Just as no evil act goes without it consequence, no good deed goes unrewarded.

[traichuoi]

For the record, someone dropped me a little VC flag under my name....

for a minute there i thought you meant Viet Cong and i was thinking, "Whaaaaat the.... "

but then, i figured it out... :rolleyes:

[Aloysius]

i got a lil beef with saying why can't protestant churches be "The Church" also, but the rest i get you, how we are not the judge of other ppl, only God is and stuff like that.

but, the Catholic Church is "The Church" Christ founded, the only one with the FULNESS of truth. Protestantism is just one of those heresies that holds on to some truth, but not the whole thing. if you pick and choose between the Lord's teaching, that's heresy. there have been heresies that have lasted centuries b4, i think the longest one i know of would be like, 600 years or so? <if you don't count orthodox, which is so Catholic anyway it's barely heresy>

so i truly do not believe protestantism is here for good. (although it seems so hopeless at times that true unity will ever be found)

anyway, just can't call another church "The Church"

i could call it the church that leads a certain person to Christ, but not "The Church" that teaches anyone Christ's complete teachings.

preachin, it's aight. i'd like to see more in the homilies, actually tellin ppl the Church's controversial stance on certain subjects, preachin pro-life and anti-contraception/abortion/masturbation. But for the most part they do aight teachin about the week's lesson from the Scriptures.

Pax Christi

[M.SIGGA]

i got a lil beef with saying why can't protestant churches be "The Church" also, but the rest i get you, how we are not the judge of other ppl, only God is and stuff like that.

but, the Catholic Church is "The Church" Christ founded, the only one with the FULNESS of truth. Protestantism is just one of those heresies that holds on to some truth, but not the whole thing. if you pick and choose between the Lord's teaching, that's heresy. there have been heresies that have lasted centuries b4, i think the longest one i know of would be like, 600 years or so? <if you don't count orthodox, which is so Catholic anyway it's barely heresy>

so i truly do not believe protestantism is here for good. (although it seems so hopeless at times that true unity will ever be found)

anyway, just can't call another church "The Church"

i could call it the church that leads a certain person to Christ, but not "The Church" that teaches anyone Christ's complete teachings.

preachin, it's aight. i'd like to see more in the homilies, actually tellin ppl the Church's controversial stance on certain subjects, preachin pro-life and anti-contraception/abortion/masturbation. But for the most part they do aight teachin about the week's lesson from the Scriptures.

Pax Christi

All I was pointing out was the whole "separated-brethren" thing in strectched out language. I wasn't trying to allude to anything else like prots being on par w/ the RC on teaching/truth or anything or I would probably be a prot instead of Catholic. We are Christian by common baptism so that makes everyone "church," or "catholic" with a small "c" right? That's all I meant.

[M.SIGGA]

for a minute there i thought you meant Viet Cong and i was thinking, "Whaaaaat the.... "

but then, i figured it out...

wow, that would have been really horrible! i don't think i ever refered to that outside an american history class in high school.

[BLAZEr]

im'a catholic, as well as my family

parts of my family dont attend mass regulary at all

but they are still good people, and jus becuz certian people attend mass more, in my book that does not make them more christian or any better.

but does attending mass LESS make them better Christians?

i understand communion is an important thing, and i will not argue this, but i also know God knows hearts, and every meal i eat, i belive im participateing in eating the body of Christ.

Cool, but only one meal on the planet allows you to consume the ACTUAL body and blood of Jesus Christ and to enter fully into communion with him. That meal is the Supper of the Lamb, the Holy Mass.

If theirs one thing i would i say i dont like about "church peeps" , is that some of the members, would be quick to judge someone elses salvation, that goes to a different church, or even doesnt go to church, and im guilty of this to, becuz i have way to often judged when i shouldnt have, and I pray the lord will have mercy on me and show me his Grace.

Don't judge whether or not they will be saved. Let God handle that. But don't assume that they will be saved either. Pray for them. Teach them about Christ. Love them. That's not judgement, that's active Christian love.

But i feel salvation is by faith alone, and i bet u there are people who go to church but dont have actual faith that Jesus was Christ, and that he was raised on the third day, on the other hand, these people think they will get to Heaven by works, and God will judge them and I pray he'll let'em in.....

If salvation is by faith alone then why does Jesus bother telling us how to live? Most of his teachings in the Bible deal with feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, praying, etc. Why would Jesus bother with this things if FAITH ALONE was all that mattered?

I have a aunt and uncle, who I love dearly, who dont go to church at all, but there great people, and God knows there heart, and it really makes me mad when church people will say their salvation is doomed to hell, I cant stand to here it,  and i think its stupidityso i dont even know where im going with this lol but ya, anyways

My uncle Steve is amesome. He is generous, sincere, loving, charitable, really an all around great guy. He never goes to church. I pray to God that he will be in heaven, but I can't make any promises. I rest assured with St. Faustina that God's Greatest attribute is his Mercy and that my uncle will be flooded with God's mercy, which I pray he will recognize and receive.

Catholicism isn't about the Judgement it's about the Life . . . God became one of us, he raised our humanity and taught us how to be authentically and truly ourselves, our real selves. We are not dung covered with snow, we are beautiful and wonderfully made. We just need to be intouch with the Incarnation, with God made man . . . don't worry so much about salvation and start worrying about LIVING FOR AND LIKE CHRIST. He alond decides if you are saved, not you, not your faith, HIM. Live for Him and then take Padre Pio's advice "Pray, Hope, and Don't Worry" . . . for yourself and your family.

God Bless!!

[FX2]

yeah my sister is like that

shes 17 years older than me and the only time she goes to mass is on christmas, easter, and when shes with my family

she is a great person in morals, just not in faith. My mom has outright tried to convice her to go to church and i have tried to show her by example. I pray for her every day that she sees ther goodness in going to church and that she is in mortal sin for not going. So im feelin where you are comin from no-tw with know-tw.