mulls Posted January 4, 2004 Author Share Posted January 4, 2004 THe Holy Spirit doesn't do the electing. THe Holy Spirit prevents the pope from teaching a doctrine for the whole Church that is in error concerning faith and morals. THats it. THat is the total extent of infallibility. Its a negative functoin. THe pope can be a total jerk, sinful etc, but as long as he doesn't try to mess with faith and morals, God puts up with him. Remember the parable of the wheat and tares? wow, that is the clearest explanation of that doctrine yet. thanks cmom! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Circle_Master Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 that is the clearest explanation. it fixes a lot of things! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paladin D Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulls Posted January 4, 2004 Author Share Posted January 4, 2004 see, sometimes regular words are better than reading something that a lawyer would need to decipher. that's why i chose to come here rather than read every catholic website and teaching out there...i want things explained to me in person, by a person. dialogue has always been better for me than sitting down and studying, but that's just me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
traichuoi Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 see, sometimes regular words are better than reading something that a lawyer would need to decipher. that's why i chose to come here rather than read every catholic website and teaching out there...i want things explained to me in person, by a person. dialogue has always been better for me than sitting down and studying, but that's just me. i ditto you on that mulls... it's just like the early Christians who came together and discussed these things...everyone always came out a winner because more Truth was learned... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
traichuoi Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 although i do like reading Catholic documents and studying Catholic theology Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 (edited) see, sometimes regular words are better than reading something that a lawyer would need to decipher. that's why i chose to come here rather than read every catholic website and teaching out there...i want things explained to me in person, by a person. dialogue has always been better for me than sitting down and studying, but that's just me. THe problem with that is somebody will immediately come along and quibble with every word I said, and want every single exception and detail. THey are never satisfied and look for any loophole to discredit our beliefs, and go thru 2000 years of our history looking for something to attack. THats why you get long detailed posts. :D Edited January 4, 2004 by cmotherofpirl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katholikos Posted January 4, 2004 Share Posted January 4, 2004 :D Yea, cmom, Sis Boom Bah! :clap:clap: INFALLIBILITY -- Freedom from error in teaching the universal (Catholic) Church in matters of faith or morals. (J A Hardon SJ, Modern Catholic Dictionary) When Christ commissoned the Apostles to "Go, therefore, and make disciples of all nations . . . teaching them to observe whatsoever I have commanded you . . ." (Mt 28:20) he promised to be with them ALWAYS, to ensure that they did not teach error to His Church. Example: Christ didn't want Matthew (or his successors) to teach that we are saved by grace and Mark (or his successors) that we are saved only by faith. He expected that all the Apostles would teach WHAT HE HAD TAUGHT THEM -- the unadulterated TRUTH. Christianity is NOT multiple choice. The charism of infallibility given to the Apostles applied especially to Peter and his successors as head of the Church, and to all Bishops (successors to the Apostles). The Bishops are assured freedom from error when they collectively teach faith or morals (as in a Council such as Vatican II), provided they are in union with the Bishop of Rome and their teaching is subject to his authority. Peter and Paul together founded the Church in Rome, and Peter was the first Bishop of Rome. (He had been the Bishop of Antioch but ordained Ignatius as his replacement when he and Paul went to Rome.) Ultimate authority in the Church follows Peter. JMJ Likos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photosynthesis Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 While whites are considered a majority in America, this does not reflect the global Catholic Church. Most Catholics in the world are not white....they are Hispanic, African, Indian, Asian, Native American, etc... Having a black Pope would make sense, since he would represent the diverse group of races and cultures that make up the Catholic Church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasJis Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 Having a black Pope would make sense to me, but somehow I don't think God has Race, color, or national affiliation on His checklist. I really think all this is compeletly irrelevant to God. But... He might have some plans for us to recieve Graces or learn something more of Him with the happenstance of whatever race, color, height, age, etc., of the next Pope that He helps us select. His standards of probable success usually aren't obvious to us. We might get lucky and get another backwater, ugly, uneducated Servant full of Grace like Peter. Or maybe a one time anti-Christian murderer that most Christians would like to see literally on fire like Paul who was graced by God to become on fire with the Holy Spirit. How about Jack Chick being moved by Grace and converting to Catholicism and becoming Pope. And all you Catholics were wondering why he doesn't get struck by lightning... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruce S Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 (edited) How about Jack Chick being moved by Grace and converting to Catholicism and becoming Pope. And all you Catholics were wondering why he doesn't get struck by lightning... ? Perhaps God isn't denominational after all. Jack is just the counterpart to some of the most extreme Catholics. He denounces Catholics, they denounce Christian Protestants as heretics. Same difference actually, both approaches are silly. Edited January 9, 2004 by Bruce S Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasJis Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 You are so wrong there, Bruce. The Catholic Church is THE CHURCH. It only became a denomination when people left to embrace error and had to tell others what they left. It calls itself the Church, it isn't denominational, it simply Grace that embraces TRUTH for us here on earth. Just because you believe a lie, Bruce, it doesn't make it true. :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasJis Posted January 11, 2004 Share Posted January 11, 2004 Bump, because I like my pithy reply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted January 11, 2004 Share Posted January 11, 2004 we don't call you heretics, we just say that you follow a heresy. theres a big difference, and it's all in jasJis's sig, you can't be charged with the sin of heresy and thus labeled a heretic unless you purposefully cause schism in that way :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatholicAndFanatical Posted January 11, 2004 Share Posted January 11, 2004 The Black and White racism issue is pretty much an American problem mostly due to America's very violent and hate-filled racial history, so if there is any drama it will come from the American media. This is why I claim to be Italian If any Catholic has racist views, they should ceast to be Catholic. Out of all the things you can do in this world to T me off, racism is on the top of my list. Right up there with abortion. It still boogles my mind that in the year 2004 we still have ignorant red knecks that hate people because of their color. Anywho, no matter what color the next Pope will be, I will honor Him as the successor to Peter. God Bless, CatholicAndFanatical Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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