Mel Gibson and his Dad

[Jnorm888]

I was just asking because whatever group it is it sounding like they held to a pretty high view of predestination.


It kinda resembled Calvinism a little bit.



I would like to know how their high view differs from Calvinism? Do they follow Thomism? Or Augustinianism?






If there is someone on here who belongs to the same group then I would like to talk to them about it.

But if not then I would settle for anyone that knows about them










INLOVE Jnorm

Edited May 25, 2006 by jnorm888

[Era Might]

I don't believe Mel Gibon has publicly expressed what exactly he believes, or how he views himself in relation to the Church.

Not sure about his father, though.

[EcceNovaFacioOmni]

All I know is he built a Church that is not under his Bishop's jurisdiction... Just an independent chapel I'd say.

[dspen2005]

his father is definitely separated from Rome -- he's a sede....

[GenesiusMMVI]

[quote name='jnorm888' post='989853' date='May 24 2006, 07:03 PM']
I was just asking because whatever group it is it sounding like they held to a pretty high view of predestination.
It kinda resembled Calvinism a little bit.
I would like to know how their high view differs from Calvinism? Do they follow Thomism? Or Augustinianism?
If there is someone on here who belongs to the same group then I would like to talk to them about it.

But if not then I would settle for anyone that knows about them
INLOVE Jnorm
[/quote]


I believe Mel's sect doesn't have a name per se but he built a church, calling it Holy Family Chapel in southern California that is "outside" the Diocese of LA, CA.

His father, also Catholic, is a rabid holocaust denier. Disgusting.....and sad.

[Charms717RM1]

His father is a what?

[Tarcisius]

Mel Gibsons father is a Sede and worships at an Independent Chapel in PA that he got his son to build. He is not a holocaust denier, rather he judges the death toll to be only around 3.4 million instead of the ludicrous 6 million, he also doubts the use of gas chambers and systematic killing and puts more importance on the 20 million Christians killed in the gulags. His veiws are very justified. Hes simply not pro-jewish.

[Jnorm888]

[quote name='Era Might' post='989869' date='May 24 2006, 05:23 PM']
I don't believe Mel Gibon has publicly expressed what exactly he believes, or how he views himself in relation to the Church.

Not sure about his father, though.
[/quote]




I just heard him say on TV about everything being predestined.

Predestined this and predestined that...........type of stuff.











INLOVE Jnorm

[GenesiusMMVI]

[quote name='Tarcisius' post='990579' date='May 25 2006, 05:26 PM']
Mel Gibsons father is a Sede and worships at an Independent Chapel in PA that he got his son to build. He is not a holocaust denier, rather he judges the death toll to be only around 3.4 million instead of the ludicrous 6 million, he also doubts the use of gas chambers and systematic killing and puts more importance on the 20 million Christians killed in the gulags. His veiws are very justified. Hes simply not pro-jewish.
[/quote]

I stand corrected. His father is NOT a total denier but....these are a few rich quotes he made:

[i]During his lengthy radio interview, Hutton Gibson, 85, said Jews were out to create "one world religion and one world government" and outlined a conspiracy theory involving Jewish bankers, the US Federal Reserve and the Vatican, among others.[/i]

Also:

[i]In his interview on WSNR radio's Speak Your Piece, to be broadcast on Monday, Hutton Gibson, argued that many European Jews counted as death camp victims of the Nazi regime had in fact fled to countries like Australia and the United States.

"It's all -- maybe not all fiction -- but most of it is," he said, adding that the gas chambers and crematoria at camps like Auschwitz would not have been capable of exterminating so many people.

"Do you know what it takes to get rid of a dead body? To cremate it?" he said. "It takes a litre of petrol and 20 minutes. Now, six million of them? They (the Germans) did not have the gas to do it. That's why they lost the war." [/i]

The last quote really strikes a nerve with me personally. My Great Uncle was a tailgunner in a B-24 and bombed the Ploesti oil fields over and over in August of '43. Trust me...the Germans had PLENTY of oil.

For someone like him to say it's mostly fiction is pretty close to denial. For you to say "ludicrous 6 million..." and that his views are justified is sad.

[avemaria40]

[quote name='Tarcisius' post='990579' date='May 25 2006, 05:26 PM']
Mel Gibsons father is a Sede and worships at an Independent Chapel in PA that he got his son to build. He is not a holocaust denier, rather he judges the death toll to be only around 3.4 million instead of the ludicrous 6 million, he also doubts the use of gas chambers and systematic killing and puts more importance on the 20 million Christians killed in the gulags. His veiws are very justified. Hes simply not pro-jewish.
[/quote]

There is nothing justified or ludicrous about it. I lost a LOT of family members (who I will never know b/c of antiSemitism) in the gas chambers of the death camps (yes, i do have some Jewish ancestry, though I am Catholic and most of my fam is Christian). I understand that he has his own views about it but there is nothing condonable about minimalizing the genocide that took place in WWII, on innocent ppl whose only fault was that they were Jewish (or Catholic, clergy, homosexual, disabled, communist, antiHitler, Polish, gypsies, w/e) The Nazis were very capable of this kind of evil.

[Theoketos]

[quote name='Tarcisius' post='990579' date='May 25 2006, 04:26 PM']
His veiws are very justified. Hes simply not pro-jewish.
[/quote]

That is either naivity or malice or both with at least a little bit of confusion.

[MichaelFilo]

From what I've read of history, it seems 6 million is a number set a bit high.

Whatever the case, if his father is a Sede, I can only sympathize, unfortunatly, it's very wrong. But yes, he did build an independent Chapel, however, that does not mean he is somehow removed himself from the Church. I'd be interested in a bit more info too.

God bless,
Mikey

[Dave]

If we can get this discussion back on track ...

Mel Gibson himself is a sede as well. One of the Church Scholars on here, Carson Weber, who hasn't posted on PM in a long time, used to work with Scott Hahn, who in turn has spoken in-depth with Mel Gibson. He said that Hahn got the opportunity to meeth with Gibson after talking with Jim Caviezel, who, as you know, starred in Gibson's movie "The Passion." Hahn learned all about Gibson's beliefs and stuff when subsequently met with Gibson. And soon after the conversation between Hahn and Gibson, Hahn commented, "Now all we have to work on is his sedevacantism."

Edited May 27, 2006 by Dave

[goldenchild17]

His dad is a sedevacantist. It's unfortunate because I've heard he holds some odd beliefs that give us sedes a worse reputation than we already had. I haven't done much research into this but now you have me on a tangent so I think I'll check this out .

I believe Mel is also a sedevacantist.

"I agree with everyone who says the Vatican is a wolf in sheep's clothing." [url="http://www.smh.com.au/"]http://www.smh.com.au/[/url]

Also:

".... Gibson has half-jokingly remarked that “The Passion” may be a career-killer for him. If it is not, if it somehow manages to open, and even to succeed, it will be in no small measure owing to Lauer's efforts. Lauer, whose father is Jewish, is a practicing Roman Catholic who has often heard [b]Gibson's Traditionalist views about the current Vatican (that the last “real” Pope predated Vatican II)[/b], and seems mostly unperturbed. More pressing, to him, is the difficult question of opening a movie that, even without the attacks against it, presents some formidable marketing problems: it is a religious film, whose actors speak their lines in two dead languages. Lauer has always known that the make-or-break audience for “The Passion” is the active Christian community, which could effectively kill the film if it discerned even a hint of blasphemy. As Paula Fredriksen has written in The New Republic, “evangelical Christians, in my experience, know their Scriptures very, very well.” ...."http://weblog.theviewfromthecore.com/2003_09/ind_002398.html

The priest that runs their Independent is also a faithful sedevacantist from what I gather also.

So yeah it does seem that way.

[Tarcisius]

[quote]During his lengthy radio interview, Hutton Gibson, 85, said Jews were out to create "one world religion and one world government" and outlined a conspiracy theory involving Jewish bankers, the US Federal Reserve and the Vatican, among others.

Also:

In his interview on WSNR radio's Speak Your Piece, to be broadcast on Monday, Hutton Gibson, argued that many European Jews counted as death camp victims of the Nazi regime had in fact fled to countries like Australia and the United States.

"It's all -- maybe not all fiction -- but most of it is," he said, adding that the gas chambers and crematoria at camps like Auschwitz would not have been capable of exterminating so many people.

"Do you know what it takes to get rid of a dead body? To cremate it?" he said. "It takes a litre of petrol and 20 minutes. Now, six million of them? They (the Germans) did not have the gas to do it. That's why they lost the war."

The last quote really strikes a nerve with me personally. My Great Uncle was a tailgunner in a B-24 and bombed the Ploesti oil fields over and over in August of '43. Trust me...the Germans had PLENTY of oil.

For someone like him to say it's mostly fiction is pretty close to denial. For you to say "ludicrous 6 million..." and that his views are justified is sad. [/quote]

I dont think he said anything that would make him morally wrong. His statments also hold a high plausibility of being true. Stop going along with the brainwashing. LOL its OK to question what the jews tell us.

[quote]
Mel Gibson himself is a sede as well. One of the Church Scholars on here, Carson Weber, who hasn't posted on PM in a long time, used to work with Scott Hahn, who in turn has spoken in-depth with Mel Gibson. He said that Hahn got the opportunity to meeth with Gibson after talking with Jim Caviezel, who, as you know, starred in Gibson's movie "The Passion." Hahn learned all about Gibson's beliefs and stuff when subsequently met with Gibson. And soon after the conversation between Hahn and Gibson, Hahn commented, "Now all we have to work on is his sedevacantism."
[/quote]


He talked with Dr. Miravalle about Mary at length on the phone also. Whats funny though, is that as a thank you, Mel sent Mirvalle one of those "hunky" signed pics. lol What in the world did he think Miravalle wanted with that.