Children's Liturgy

[KatS]

It seems to me if the teachers are there to instruct the kids about faith and the Mass, and it's not just play-time or nap-time, then yes, it seems like a good thing for children...then when kids are a little older and they can attend "Grown up" liturgy, they'll be able to follow along and understand.

It seems like this might be something good for our scholar team to comment on: where's cappie and the rest of the posse when ya need 'em?

Edited May 25, 2006 by KatS

[Guest Veni Sancte Spiritus]

I have never heard of this before. Thankfully, my parish is not that innovative. When I was a Lutheran they did a simillar thing, and quite frankly I am not able to comment on it since I did not have a child at that time. Now that I am a mother of a toddler I can say that I would not choose to take part in such a thing. I am doing what every other parent has had to do for generations and generations, taking her with me and giving her the opportunity to behave. She is doing just fine, and I have been very blessed that she has not been disruptive or needed "entertainment" to keep her interest. In regard to CCD, I taught 3rd grade CCD and had a challenging time getting any parental involvement. Unfortunately, in my case the parents even resented that I tried to involve them. I was scolded by one mother who felt that my request was going to "rob" her of HER private time without her daughter! Many times I felt like a babysitter. I think the parents should be required to spend time in the classroom and they should be given an evaluation at the end of class. The children that do well in that setting do it with parents that care about what they are learning and get involved.

[Noel's angel]

When it is the only education kids are getting, it can only be a good thing.

[homeschoolmom]

It can be a good thing even if it's not the only education a child is getting.

[MC IMaGiNaZUN]

When i said controversy...

I did mean abortion, divorce, etc.

But i also meant pornography and rape.

SHALOM

[zunshynn]

[quote name='prose' post='989420' date='May 24 2006, 07:15 AM']
So, I am reluctant to send my kids to Children's liturgy (she is almost 3 which is the age to go here) b/c I think it is important that they learn how to behave in Mass. I don't like the idea of segregating them into a "class" type structure during Mass. I also don't like the idea of "playtime" during Mass, which is what I think some of it it. I will concede that at least at our Church it isn't just making crafts and stuff like that, but I still feel like she will be missing Mass.

A woman I work with told me I was wrong b/c it is still "Mass" and they get all of the readings and things, and they are supposed to be back in time for the consecration.

I dunno.

I am still not feeling great about it.
[/quote]

Ask OLAMDad what he thinks. His kids turned out good.

But in my humble opinion, I would say that in retrospect, I had gone to a regular mass when I was little. I grew up thinking church was dumb because of my shallow catechesis. You grow in faith when you experience the Mass with a deeper, lived understanding of it.

Catechesis should be outside, not in place of Mass. You're probably a much better person to explain everything to her than her sunday school teacher anyway.

And I agree, segragating them is a bad idea. That's what starts them thinking church is only good when it's "geared for them" and "fun" and if its not exciting to them, then they don't see a point in it all.

And it seems a stretch that they can leave after the Gospel, and be back in time for the consecration, and have really learned anything meaningful.

[OLAM Dad]

Mass is about worship and not catechesis (children or adult).

It is also meant to be a community event. I don't like the idea of separating children from their families during Mass.

YMMV

edit: I wrote this before I saw what zunshynn wrote. It was very nice of you to say what you said but I only have one child who has left home. While she has turned out OK so far, I could end up with 5 who turn out rotten and whom all hate the way they were raised. My opinion on this matter might be totally wrong.

[Fides_et_Ratio]

[quote name='dandy777' post='989713' date='May 24 2006, 03:56 PM']
Remember that even though Communion is the apex of the Mass, the Liturgy of the Word is as important as receiving the Eucharist. The Word of God is as powerful as the Eucharist itself cos both of them are Christ. So it is equally important that kids are exposed to and taught the Gospel according to their cognitive level.
[/quote]
I didn't mean communion only in relation to the Eucharist. We experience communion, in a sense, during the Liturgy of the Word.

I also dislike "dumbing down" texts... kids should be challenged! It's good for them. They can ask questions, etc.

Separating people out is appropriate for catechesis, but this is not the point of Mass, the point of Mass (Liturgy of the Word included) is communion.

[Socrates]

[quote name='homeschoolmom' post='989438' date='May 24 2006, 08:27 AM']
Abortion, contraception, gay marriage, divorce (marital infidelity)... Um, yeah... Adult-themed.
[/quote]
This is a bit off-topic, but you should consider your parish blessed that the priest speaks out against such things. Coming from one of the more conservative parishes in the country, I've heard such sexual sins denounced from the pulpit, but we commonly hear from Catholics around the country that priests never denounce such "controversial" sins (or even abortion) from the pulpit anymore.

For many Catholics, if they do not hear such sins denounced from the pulpit during the homily, they will not know where the Church actually stands.
In these times especially, priests should speak the truth on such matters publicly, rather than refrain out of cowardice or "political correctness."
(This is not to say that the priest should not show good taste, or give unneccessary lengthy or graphic descriptions of such sins, of course.)


And I don't like the idea of a "children's mass." I think attempts to bring the Mass down to a childish level, with "cute" and childish gimmicks, do not instill respect and reverence for the mass.

[jiyoung]

Yeah, the children's liturgy is sort of an iffy idea to me. When I was a kid I had to take part in it and I didn't like it, I wanted to go back to Mass. It was really just like sing some songs and stuff though, very Protestant, so different kind of format, I suppose. But I think that it might be good to prompt discussion in the home. It would also force parents to listen and to study up so they can explain things to their kids...I don't know if I'm getting my point across very effectively right now, but do you get what I mean? Kids listening to the homily, and asking their parents questions about the parts they didn't understand, and their parents can explain it to them. That would require their parents knowing their stuff. It really is true that catechesis needs to start at home. I don't know, the idea of the children's liturgy doesn't sit too well with me, but I imagine there would be situations in which it would be appropriate.

[Piccoli Fiori JMJ]

[quote name='Socrates' post='990689' date='May 25 2006, 07:54 PM']
And I don't like the idea of a "children's mass." I think attempts to bring the Mass down to a childish level, with "cute" and childish gimmicks, do not instill respect and reverence for the mass.
[/quote]
They do this for the Catholic School Kids on Friday mornings. I feel bad for the kids above 2nd grade. I think they can handle something that isn't so... "let's be friends"-ish... you know? I think kids can handle the Mass as they experience every Sunday (if they even go that often). I kinda helped the hijack, but I'll stop now...

[prose]

One more comment about this:


If I choose to volunteer to help with the Children's litugy, I was told that it would not count as my Sunday obligation. If this is the case, I would be back to square one where I need to attend Mass myself, and I don't want to send my kids away, volunteer, and then I still need to go to Mass. Does that make sense?

I also don't like the idea of sending my child somewhere where I don't volunteer and help with the program to be sure it is okay.

One more twist to the story, I work at the Church, so I am expected to send her to litugy when she is old enough.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='prose' post='990950' date='May 26 2006, 10:22 AM']
One more comment about this:
If I choose to volunteer to help with the Children's litugy, I was told that it would not count as my Sunday obligation. If this is the case, I would be back to square one where I need to attend Mass myself, and I don't want to send my kids away, volunteer, and then I still need to go to Mass. Does that make sense?

I also don't like the idea of sending my child somewhere where I don't volunteer and help with the program to be sure it is okay.

One more twist to the story, I work at the Church, so I am expected to send her to litugy when she is old enough.
[/quote]
If you start out in church with the kids, go and hear the kids version of the gospel and come right back to the mass, why wouldn't it count?

[OLAM Dad]

[quote name='cmotherofpirl' post='991354' date='May 26 2006, 10:41 PM']
If you start out in church with the kids, go and hear the kids version of the gospel and come right back to the mass, why wouldn't it count?
[/quote]
I'm not sure what you can miss and still fulfill your obligation.

No proper gospel and no homily might be enough.

[cmotherofpirl]

hey scholarly types, whats the answer on this?