Lounge Daddy Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 we had a few rotten Popes, didn't we? which were they? thank God they were so busy sinning they didn't teach their actions as moral practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OLAM Dad Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Benedict, for starters. Benedict IX that is. Urban VI John XII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 hang on, i'll look in my [u]Catholicism for Dummies[/u] book Alexander VI Benedict IX that's all it lists, but it also says (and this was before Pope Benedict XVI): [i]Some colorful characters are interspersed among the bunch of 265 popes. 78 of them are canonized saints, and ten more are beatified, which is one step short of sainthood, so approximately 32% of the papacy has been really good. Of all the rest, only twelve are actually considered morally evil and corrupt scoundrels.[/i] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Semalsia Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 How can a pope be morally evil? I thought popes were chosen by God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkwright Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 ugh I just read up on Alexander VI.. terrible man! [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Alexander_VI"]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_Alexander_VI[/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelFilo Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Before we judge the moral character of Popes... wait lets just not do it at all. God bless, Mikey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 i'm just quoting the book, people a book that was written by Fr. John Trigilio Jr. (a priest, EWTN co-host of "Council of Faith" and President of the Confraternity of Catholic Clergy) and Fr. Kenneth Brighenti (a priest, EWTN co-host, and managing editor of "Sapienta" magazine) [from the book as well] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afdchick Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 [quote name='Semalsia' post='969868' date='May 3 2006, 02:53 PM'] How can a pope be morally evil? I thought popes were chosen by God. [/quote] Popes are elected by Cardinals I thought? The Pope is still a human and is not perfect. There were definitely some bad popes. The pope as a man is not infallable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkwright Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 [quote name='MichaelFilo' post='969885' date='May 3 2006, 02:13 PM'] Before we judge the moral character of Popes... wait lets just not do it at all. God bless, Mikey [/quote] and why not?? While the Pope's teachings on faith and morals [i]can[/i] be infallible, his actions are never perfect. When he is elected Pope, he doesn't lose his human qualities or automatically become a morally perfect person. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasJis Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 [quote name='Semalsia' post='969868' date='May 3 2006, 12:53 PM'] How can a pope be morally evil? I thought popes were chosen by God. [/quote]Bingo. Or you could chose to ignore your own God provided intellect and just not question anything a cleric does. Your choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelFilo Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 Certainly right to question his actions, but to denounce a pope as evil, especially being a laymember is hardly appropriate. Thats the job for other popes to do, because only they stand as their equals, occupying the seat of St. Peter. And of course, Jesus, who judges all men. Although no man ought to judge other men... I have the book, it's wonderful, but alas... to denounce someone as morally evil would, at least from what seems to be the prevailing attitude on this forums, be unbecoming of a charitable person. Only God does that, or the hierarchy, which obviously cannot denounce that which it is under. God bless, Mikey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Domine ut Videam Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 yup....Alexander VI! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted May 3, 2006 Share Posted May 3, 2006 [quote name='MichaelFilo' post='969987' date='May 3 2006, 04:36 PM']I have the book, it's wonderful, but alas... to denounce someone as morally evil would, at least from what seems to be the prevailing attitude on this forums, be unbecoming of a charitable person. Only God does that, or the hierarchy, which obviously cannot denounce that which it is under. God bless, Mikey[/quote]i agree that their wording could've used a little tweaking, but why are you taking me to task for just quoting the book? unless i am misunderstanding your intent, and i apologize if i am Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JeffCR07 Posted May 4, 2006 Share Posted May 4, 2006 We can, and should, denounce what a person [i]does[/i] as being evil. What we cannot do is denounce a [i]person[/i] as evil. The two are very different propositions. We have the obligation for the former, but we lack the authority for the latter. This being said, it is of course permissible to point to the actions of different pope's and say that what they did was wrong, but we cannot say "so and so was an evil man." Your Brother In Christ, Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted May 4, 2006 Share Posted May 4, 2006 Jas, you've become unreasonable. Everyone knows you understand the distinction between the actions of the man filling the office of the papacy and his teachings. It appears you have merely become morally self-righteous and arrogant, judging everyone as being so inferior to you that they don't even deserve you in their Church so you're going to find one that's more of a showcase for saints rather than a hospital for sinners. It's absurd and unchristian-- you are sinning against Christ in the judgement you are rendering upon the actions of individuals, of popes and laymen alike. There is a difference between what is taught and what is practiced. That which is taught we ought to judge against scripture and tradition and conscience; that which is practiced by any individual has absolutely no bearing on that. The sin of a man does not have any bearing on the truth of his God. otherwise we might as well just throw out the God of Israel, his people never lived up to what He taught or what Moses taught... Moses didn't even live up to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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