Children in Mass

[goldenchild17]

I believe it important for children to be with their parents in the pew at Mass. They will not likely be able to pay attention the whole time. But it is a good time for them to be looking at prayer books with lots of colors and pictures, or to maybe have coloring books of saints or the Mass or something. I don't think they should be let loose to go crazy, but I don't think they should be isolated from the rest in a cry-room either. I'm talking more 2-3 and up. Babies sometimes have to be taken out of the room when they get really loud and have nothing to keep them still. But for those 2-3 and up I think just them being there is good, whether they are sitting quiet or reading, or coloring, it all helps, moreso than sitting in a cry-room allowing them to act badly. Take this for what it's worth(nothing ) from a 19 yo w/no kids and only having 7 younger siblings as experience.

Edited April 18, 2006 by goldenchild17

[homeschoolmom]

Our priest told a story during one of his homilies about a priest he knew of who had a disruptive child (maybe two and a half or three years old) in mass. The dad picked the child up, tossed him over his shoulder like a sack of potatoes. As the child was being extracted, he looked up from his father's back and shouted, "PRAY FOR ME!" (I guess he knew what was coming next....) I think of that every time I see a child being taken out.

PRAY FOR ME!

[Lil Red]

[missionarybelle]

I think that it's good for the parents to start from the beginning to train their children to sit still during Mass or read books quietly etc. I hate it when people just go park in the cry room and break out their food and toys and just have a party.
I appreciate it when parents train their children to be semiquiet during Mass and I really don't like it when their bigger kids (even up tp 5 yrs old) go to Mass and talk and play with their parents all through the liturgy. I don't think they should be left home, just properly trained.
The Mass is a community prayer and I love it when I see whole families make the sacrifice to go together.
when we were small, we were told to obey. and if we didn't, we were led outside to be disciplined. mom and dad were very good about that.

[jasJis]

[quote name='Birgitta Noel' date='Apr 18 2006, 02:09 PM']Cry rooms are great, but they should be used for their original purpose.  They are intended to be used so that when a baby (young'n) starts crying and can't be stopped in a reasonable amount of time, or is screaming at the top of her lungs, the parent can go into the cry room to quiet and calm the child, but still participate in the mass.  The cry room is not meant to be a place where one starts out and stays the whole mass.

And yes, children should definitely be at mass.  Just because we can hear them at times doesn't mean that they're too loud, it just means we know they are there.  When you hear a baby, smile at the parent(s), don't glare! 

Really the problem is most parents who don't know how to teach their children to behave in public and encourage bad behavior at mass!  (Not anyone here!)
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[/quote]But unfortunately people think a cry room is 'Romper Room' at church. The prior pastor at the parish I used to attend wanted to eliminate the cry room and change it to an adoration chapel. He felt that if kids can't behave for most of the mass, they shouldn't be there. It's a big parish and they had 'Family' mass in the other Chapel every Sunday so that families could go with kids. But with about 7 masses a Sunday, he expected that parents and adult would understand that the 10:30 'High Mass' with all the smells and bells was not meant for people to bring bratty kids. Just like the 6:30 PM Youth Mass wasn't meant for those who wanted a quieter, lower key Mass, or the 12:15 Mass was said in Spainish.
But of course, nobody was happy. 1/2 the people felt like they were excluded and couldn't understand why Mass wasn't the way they wanted when they wanted it, and the othe 1/2 felt like they were disrespected because people wanted a different Mass. Oy. The complaints about the family mass being too loud and the simplistic sermons or the 10:30 Mass was too long with the choir and and all the responses being sung and the Eucharistic prayers done in Chant. I think Catholics are happiest when they're unhappy.

[thessalonian]

I don't like the term "forced" with the first option. I hate the cry room because it seems my wife uses that as an excuse to let them run and be noisy. We need to train our children to be respectful and quiet at mass. That does not happen overnight. Personally I find it better to sit in Mass and they are quieter if you sit up front. From time to time we have to take the very youngest ones out. But by the time they are 5 or 6 out in the Church it seems to me we have had much better luck getting them to learn to be quiet. Sometimes we do the switch off and don't bring them to Church. But I don't like this. The earlier they get used to going every sunday the better.

We have people glare at us and make rude comments as well. That's there problem. I ignore it.

Blessings

[ironmonk]

[quote name='prose' date='Apr 18 2006, 11:44 AM']I find that I am frustrated as a mother of a two year old and a 6 month old about this issue.  I try to help them understand Mass, but at this age, they are not welsome in the Children's liturgy, and frankly, a two year old doesn't understand particularily what is going on.  I think the most she grasps is when the priest hold up the Eucharist, she says "There's Jesus, mom"

Children can not be magically quiet and sit still for an hour or more.  No matter how much we want them to.  People that call them names and hold disdain for parents are half of the problem.  Many parents I know won't even go to Mass because of the fear that they are offending people like this when their children cry. 

The Bible does not say  "go forth and multiply - but make sure they are quiet and calm all the time"

For the record, We have no cryroom, so I  let my children cry in pews or play in pew by us.  I do my best to keep them quiet, but it isn't always possible, and I shouldn't be judged if my two year old is incapable of sitting silent and still for an hour.

[/end rant]
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[/quote]

My answer is: "With their parents wherever they sit, parents that let their kids run around need help learning to be better parents. Kids run around because they know they can get away with doing it."

I also have a two year old... I find that making her sit still for 30 minutes to an hour at home a couple times a week helps when at Mass. I know how hard it can be, but now is when we lay our foundation of their personality. Teach them now and you will not regret it later.

Some people that call themselves Catholic and do not like kids in the main area of the Mass are missing some very important things about the faith. Not taking a child to Mass because they are young is a horrible thing.... in fact it would be keep them from Christ... children need to go to Mass and have things explained to them, even if they don't understand it, explaining it to them over and over day in and day out the child will learn and remember. They will be strongly rooted in the faith... as they should be.

my two cents...

God Bless,
ironmonk

[Balthazor]

I think that children should come with thier parents to mass.
It gets them used to the idea, it sets parents as role models for going to church from little on. And it help to show them how they are expected to behave during mass.

[avemaria40]

Children should come to Mass because they need to learn about Jesus and of course how can we ever expect them to be patient and quiet if their parents don't take them? Jesus said, "Let the children come to me" and that applies to Mass because that is where Jesus is. I hate it when people make faces or glare or do anything else to make families with young children feel unwelcome. That has no place in Mass

A cry room should only be used to calm down a child who can't stop crying or is being excessively loud. It can have its good uses but people abuse it and that's when it's a problem

[styx chyx]

Hey all,

As you can see, I'm not a Catholic, so I don't know how well these suggestions will sit with the Catholic faith as opposed to Anglican views.

Our church has often struggled with the very issue of children in services. I used to be a part of a rather traditional style service, in which many people considered it inappropriate for the children to even make their existence known in the slightest way. In this church, we had a small area at the very back of the church, where on one side a few pews were missing. Here there were a few religious picture books and some soft teddies for kids, and the younger children were given a small library bag (which was returned at the end of each service), which contained 2 or 3 small, chewable lollies, and a couple of big colouring in pictures of images from the Gospels with some crayons inside. These worked wonders to keep the kids entertained and quiet. We also got the children to take part in the service a little, passing around the collection bags for example. When the kids got to do this, they were more motivated to keep quiet so that they could get the privelege of passing the bags.

Now, our church has evolved quite a lot from previous days. We now have a traditional service at 8:00 in the morning, then a 'family' service, which is geared towards young families and the unchurched at 10:00 (giving the families plenty of time to get up and get ready). In the second service, people come who understand that children make noise, they are after all, KIDS! This service is very short and sharp, the music is enjoyable for the children, involving actions etc and they are given maraccas etc to play in the songs. Instead of having a 'reading' directly from the Bible, we have 'the story', where the children sit on the floor with an adult, and the Bible reading is given to them with the assistance of felt squares and pictures. The children then stay in the church, where their parents can keep an eye on them, and are guided by a member of the church in drawing a picture about the Gospel while the sermon takes place so that the kids don't get bored.

I don't know if these suggestions are a bit too radical to put to your church/parish council/priest, but they have all worked for us in outback Western Australia!!! Sorry for being so long winded, but hopefully something might help!!!

[MC IMaGiNaZUN]

My own theological opinion does not reflect in any way the doctrines of dogma of the church (end disclaimer)

If a child has not thus attained the age of reason, a child cannot be held morally culpable in instances of moral nuetrality.

Children have not the ability to grasp the depth and responsibility of morals, and cannot be held thus accountable.

Although, a parent is responsible to instill moral virtue in their children from an early age to the best of their abilities, a parent cannot be expected to create morally perfect angels.



Mostly, i just dont get how people can get so upset with other people who are trying to bring their children into that kind of atmosphere. I come to Mass to experience God, and what a privelege it is. It helps me to have children present, because it reminds me of what it means to be a child of God.

Where we, out of love and grace become morally perfect, not through the fear and punishment of law. Well in this case, not law, just fear and punishment.

[Birgitta Noel]

From Catholic Exchange: [url="http://www.catholicexchange.com/vm/index.asp?art_id=32593"]http://www.catholicexchange.com/vm/index.asp?art_id=32593[/url]

“Cry Room” Strategies
04/18/06


I walk into church with my nearly sleeping baby on my shoulder and silently debate whether I should go into the church or my church’s "cry room." After my son raises his sleepy head to look around, I anticipate the wiggles to come and choose the room at the back of the church — set up for parents like me.

So called, "cry rooms," afford us a special opportunity to participate in the Mass without fear that our wiggly or crying children will disrupt everyone in the main church. All too frequently, however, the room becomes a barrier to participation instead of a tool to aid in it.

A few simple things may help us to get the most out of this special room.

1. Teach. The cry room is the perfect place to instruct our children about what is happening in the Mass. Even older brothers and sisters can whisper the correct responses to a younger sibling.

2. Example. Adults and older children can inspire little ones’ devotion to the faith by paying attention to the Mass. My older children occasionally stay in the room to help me with one of the "littles." They will tell them at the Consecration, "Look, Jesus is coming!" Their enthusiasm encourages the younger children.

3. Plan. Bring appropriate things into the cry room. If we need aids to keep our children quiet, saint books or Bible stories are a good choice. Motorized toys, cars or things that make noise will only distract our children, and others, from the Mass.

4. Tolerance. We need to remember that people cannot always stop a child from crying or fidgeting. A kind look, or knowing smile, may keep some parent from feeling like they have to leave Mass. After all, that’s what a cry room is for.

5. Use. The cry room at my church quickly becomes overcrowded and very warm. It is helpful to determine if we really need to be in that room. We don’t want to discourage anyone from attending church for fear they will have to wait outside with a squirmy toddler through Mass.

6. Grow. As soon as our children are old enough to participate in the Mass without causing a distraction, we should move into the main church. We should foster a desire in our children to be included in the larger church. A child who is old enough to receive Communion should be old enough to sit quietly through Mass. Sitting in the big church can be viewed as a coming of age, a privilege to strive towards.

I look forward to the day that I can graduate out of the cry room and into the main church with the rest of my family. Until then, I will use the time to try to teach my children the importance of the Mass, teach them the correct responses and how to behave at church. Say a little prayer for me, please, it’s gonna take some work.


Mary Lou Rosien is a Catholic wife and mother to seven children. She is a frequent contributor to Catholic women's and family magazines. She writes in between laundry, doing the dishes and driving her kids all over town in North Chili, New York.

This article originally appeared in the April 2006, St. Jude's Newsletter, and is used by permission of the author.

[MichaelFilo]

I like the ideas; but any idea that should make children a secondary church member has already failed to recognize the nature of Jesus's message about children. The good church that I go to (the one with the TLM at 8:00 AM) has plenty of large famalies and yet there is seemingly less noise than in churches with cry rooms. I'm lead to believe that children can do it, they simply must be raised appropriatly (as ironmonk has suggested). Removing children and parents with children from the main group is hardly ideal, and if i would suggest it for small children, then I should also extend it to the mentally deficient who often make loud noises or moans; but I do neither, as it is hardly in line with Christ's treatement of Children.

It is worthy to note some of the earliest seperation of children from the main group were among the Calvanistic reformed churches in Europe and in the US; I am lead to believe the cry room is an unfortunate effect of the protestantization of the Church today (not in doctrine of course, just in practice).

God bless,
Mikey

[Archaeology cat]

Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but found [url="http://insidecatholic.com/Joomla/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=6171&Itemid=100"]this article[/url]. And I very much agree with the author.

[quote]Not too long ago, I wrote an article for my parish newsletter about why we must offer encouragement -- not sideways glances -- to parents who bring their young children to Mass. Overall, the response was positive, but one reader sent me a letter suggesting I leave my kids at home so I could "more fully receive Christ." It was charitable enough, but the point was clear: Children are sweet, but they don't belong in church.

This wasn't the first time (and I suspect it won't be the last) I've been scolded for encouraging our children's presence at Mass. Last summer I was pegged as a breastfeeding heretic after I wrote a column about nursing discreetly in church. What I foolishly assumed was an innocuous article about a mother's love for her Church and her children resulted in a barrage of comments -- some of them laced with vitriol directed not only at "immodest nursing mothers" but at children attending Mass in general. I discovered a litany of complaints about crying babies (who should exhibit more self control and not need to be fed during Mass), antsy toddlers, and young children's "sin" of causing distraction.

These comments baffled me. So did the woman who recently shot nasty looks at my brood during Mass. I smiled at her when I caught her gaping, but she continued to scowl at my older children (four and two), who were doing nothing more than quietly flipping through religious books. (Just imagine the scandal if I'd dared to nurse my seven-week-old!)

Then there was the time we sat down next to a woman who caught sight of us and sighed loudly, glared at my two-year-old daughter, and snapped, "Just keep her quiet" -- before the child had even uttered a peep.

At this point, you might think that I'm one of those overindulgent mothers who lets her little hellions scale the pews and leave a trail of crushed Cheerios in their wake. Not so. If my kids are being disruptive, we retreat, and I don't permit noshing during Mass (nursing babies are an exception). However, I don't consider an occasional happy squeal or my preschooler's off-key singing as a reason to surrender.

If we are truly a pro-life people, then how can we not welcome children -- the future of the Church -- at Mass? What follows are five more reasons why I believe children of all ages belong in the pews right along with us.


1. Allowing kids to go AWOL from Mass undermines the parents' duty to begin faith education in the child's earliest years (Catechism 2226). Not only will it be a lot tougher to teach an older child who has rarely been to Mass to behave, leaving kids at home sends the message that Mass is not for children. Regular attendance at Mass is a must to help them recognize the sacredness of the Eucharist and to value their faith.

Indeed, Pope Benedict XVI urges parents to make Sunday Mass a family affair. "Parents are called to make their children discover the value and importance of the response to Christ's invitation, who calls the whole Christian family to Sunday Mass," the pope said to a crowd in St. Peter's Square on June 13, 2005. Note he said the whole Christian family, not just those old enough to behave or to receive the Eucharist.

Jesus invites all of us to His table -- and He extended a special invitation to children, saying, "Let the little children come to me."


2. Bringing children to Mass helps nurture their inner life. Early lessons make lasting impressions, child development experts tell us. Good parents recognize the importance of nurturing their children physically and emotionally during their formative years. But if we fail to nurture their spiritual self as well, then we are not attending to the whole child. While we can teach about the Faith within the walls of our domestic church, being in the presence of Christ and those who love Him is what really awakens the spiritual self.

Moreover, you might be surprised by what a small child gets out of Mass. My four-year-old recently asked me if what I ate and drank was really the Body and Blood of Christ. Thankfully, before I had a chance to respond (I wasn't quite prepared to start explaining), my daughter said, "It is. I know it is." Where knowledge is lacking, wisdom often runs deep. Children too are capable of receiving God's graces.


3. Regularly attending Mass helps children find their true home. While my children are constantly with me at this age, I know I won't always be there to guide them. But God will never leave their side. Their real home is with God in His Church, but they will only learn to recognize it as home if I bring them to Mass from an early age. We cannot open the door to the Church at Baptism, only to slam it in their face until they're deemed mature enough to be a part of the Body of Christ.


4. We are all one body.God longs for His whole family to gather around the table. In the breaking of the bread, we proclaim that we are one in God. Mass unites people from all walks of life and connects us with all our brothers and sisters in Christ. There is no room for intolerance at the table of the Lord.


5. Mass isn't about me. It isn't about you, either. Unlike our Protestant brothers and sisters, who often segregate the children from the adults to facilitate a more inspiring worship experience, Catholics go to Mass to give thanks and to receive the Body and Blood of Christ. Everything we do during the celebration is in remembrance of Him.

While it's ideal to enjoy an uplifting and distraction-free Mass, we should be focusing on the fact that Jesus shed His Precious Blood for all of us -- the nursing babies, the fidgety toddlers, the disabled, the young, the old, even the teenage girl with the low-cut top (who's likely as much of a distraction as any whiny three-year-old).

We might wish it weren't so, but the Body of Christ isn't always a pretty sight. None of us is worthy to be in the presence of Christ, but He shows up anyway. Not only should we show up, too, but we should welcome everyone -- young or old, big or small -- who has come to the Lord's Supper.[/quote]

[WisdomSeeker]

I go to the 8am mass at my church and I have to say that the children that are there at that time are mostly well behaved. If they do start creating the parents can take them to a room that is just inside the church porch where they can still see the mass.