DesiringMore Posted December 22, 2003 Author Share Posted December 22, 2003 I guess the world has already ended. But at the same time, it has just begun. None of it makes sense to me. That's why I abandoned religion a while ago, but not belief in the existence of God So, when you say "belief in the existence of God"...what do you mean by that?? what kind of belief?? do you just believe that there is a God but nothing else?? i am interested...please elaborate... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beng Posted December 22, 2003 Share Posted December 22, 2003 (edited) All quotes by DesiringMore what about growing up and looking inside...i've heard that before...and sometimes we fail to do such a thing.... Yes, you should look inside and realize how fortunate you are that you're not in concentration camp. the cold hard truth??? i'm not sure if i agree with that, The cold hard truth is true. I challange any Catholic, or even Protestant for that matter, who disagree: 1. That human without the grace of God is nothing. 2. That God never promised anything on Earth 3. That if we were so unfortunate that we are put in concentration camp since the day we're born till the day we die, GOD IS STILL JUST AND FAIR. but i don't have to.... Yeah. You don't have to. Christ did say that following Him is hard. If you're not up to it then what can I say? you're entitled to think what you want... Yes. What I think, as shown above, is what Catholics think. So,... up to you. and i will respect that... Thank you but you sure seem to know how to put holes in another's sail.... I don't understand the saying. i think you can be honest and truthful and be Christ-like doing it.... I WAS and AM being honest and truthful. I am not complaining...i am simply asking questions... Actually my post was kinda directed to all people who have the same feeling as you. Because it's very common. there is nothing wrong with asking questions... Right. There's no need to be defensive. questions i've had myself along with questions of others....i am sharing my hurts with the people who want to hear and asking questions to others who might have an answer...and opening myself up to vulnerability to receive criticism for doing so... I GAVE you answer. I GAVE you criticism. But apparently you don't want any cold hard truth, even tho telling you cold hard truth is within the parameter of answer and criticism. You like "other kind" of asnwer and criticism. Well, why don't you say so? Put it up in the thread. Then the whole thread will be filled with exactly what you wanted to hear. Edited December 22, 2003 by beng Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beng Posted December 22, 2003 Share Posted December 22, 2003 But if He knows what you are going to do, why does He hold it against you? Then free will is just an illusion. God created you to follow His plan, but you can't see the puppet strings. Saying free will is an illusion just show ignorance. If God doesn't give free will, then he would make it that no one sinned, even Lucifer. The fall of angels and our sin is the result that we use our free will to choose what is NOT free (because sinned is enslavement). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SallyCat Posted December 22, 2003 Share Posted December 22, 2003 Beng there is not a thing wrong with ignorance. Especially (sp?) When we are looking for knowlegde, answers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beng Posted December 22, 2003 Share Posted December 22, 2003 I don't understand how everything can be at the same time. So if we are veiwing in "God's time" Christ is crucified right now as my baptism is right now as my goddaughters baptism is right now as "Friends" second season is right now. Everything happens at the same time? Yes. It's hard for you to understand because human is used to think within the constraint of time. It's easier if you study certain philosophical science. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the protector Posted December 22, 2003 Share Posted December 22, 2003 "God" in the most general of terms. It's just impossible for me to believe that creation is random or unintended. I don't really know how or why He works the way he does. I don't know if He is still active in the world, watching or somewhere else completely. I don't know if he cares whether or not we believe in or worship Him. If He does, He hasn't made it clear and isn't holding any grudges. I don't buy into the theory that God reveals just enough of himself or I should rely on the word of man to validate His existence. God didn't call attention to the entire world and say, "This is my son. Listen to him." or "This man is my official prophet, so listen up." He didn't call out to everyone during the premiere of "Battlefield Earth" and say, "I know this all seems really bizarre and stupid, but this guy has it right." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the protector Posted December 22, 2003 Share Posted December 22, 2003 (edited) double post. Edited December 22, 2003 by the protector Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SallyCat Posted December 22, 2003 Share Posted December 22, 2003 I believe God reveals just enough of Himself to desire more. To seek a closer relationship to Him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the protector Posted December 22, 2003 Share Posted December 22, 2003 (edited) Saying free will is an illusion just show ignorance. Yeah, and what gives you the authority to make that statement.? I just drew that conclusion from parts of this discussion. I never said it was concrete. Apparently it's your job to determine that. I believe God reveals just enough of Himself to desire more. To seek a closer relationship to Him. But I think that can be applied to anything. They all say, "read this book by whoever. This person talks about their conversion or revelation. Read it with and open mind and you will see the truth in it." You can convince yourself it is true if it's constantly feed to you or you really want to believe it is. Edited December 22, 2003 by the protector Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beng Posted December 22, 2003 Share Posted December 22, 2003 Beng there is not a thing wrong with ignorance. Especially (sp?) When we are looking for knowlegde, answers Nothing wrong with ignorance? Heh? you surprise me. How is it that ignorance NOT wrong. We're looking for answer because WE DO NOT KNOW. It's different from ignorance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesiringMore Posted December 22, 2003 Author Share Posted December 22, 2003 Well, why don't you say so? Put it up in the thread. Then the whole thread will be filled with exactly what you wanted to hear. No, i don't ask questions or start threads that i want to hear the responses of others whose answers i want to hear...if i wanted such a thing, i wouldn't bother posting...i'm sorry you feel this way... i understand your "being thankful"....i am very thankful...yet we all have our weaknesses...and to be honest, at this moment in time, my weakness is dealing with death...and the hurting,pain, all the stuff that goes along with death.... by posting these questions, no matter how ridculous they seem, helps me to understand better, to desire more than the nothingness of life, to see what others think, if anyone has gone through such a pain, draws me closer to the feet of Christ, etc.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beng Posted December 22, 2003 Share Posted December 22, 2003 "God" in the most general of terms. It's just impossible for me to believe that creation is random or unintended. I don't really know how or why He works the way he does. I don't know if He is still active in the world, watching or somewhere else completely. I don't know if he cares whether or not we believe in or worship Him. If He does, He hasn't made it clear and isn't holding any grudges. I don't buy into the theory that God reveals just enough of himself or I should rely on the word of man to validate His existence. God didn't call attention to the entire world and say, "This is my son. Listen to him." or "This man is my official prophet, so listen up." He didn't call out to everyone during the premiere of "Battlefield Earth" and say, "I know this all seems really bizarre and stupid, but this guy has it right." Umm, sorry. This is a heresy (forgot the name) And condemned a LOOOONNGG time ago. So it's nothing new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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