SEPARATE SPANISH MASSES

[1337 k4th0l1x0r]

They go to the parish closest to their house. Basically, what happened is that two parishes were disolved and reformed into one parish. They had a beautiful church built over a hundred years ago, but it was too small for the new parish. Many of the parishoners are kindof upset with the bishop because a parishoner had died and left some nice land to be used for a new church. Since land cannot be left to parishes anymore, the diocese sold the land, bought some new land, and designated that their parish would be the 'hispanic parish' for north Alabama, despite the fact that most of the people there are not hispanic. They still don't have an actual church building. They built the school and family life center first and they hold mass in the family life center.

[photosynthesis]

sounds weird... this parish that i was talking about wasn't designated by the archdiocese as an 'ethnic parish,' it just so happens that the area in which it is situated has a lot of different ethnic groups. it also is an area that is poorer than the one I live in, which is full of expensive cars and big houses.

the parish building is really interesting in its structure. everything is connected. The parish sanctuary is in the middle, and then there are classrooms, parish offices and other things you'd see in a Catholic school on either side. The adoration chapel is way up at the top.

[Sojourner]

[quote name='OP_MOM' date='Mar 2 2006, 12:18 AM']There are a number of parishes in my archdiocese that celebrate a weekly Spanish Mass. At first my reaction to the Mass was positive. After all, shouldn’t the Mass be for everyone?

However, since its inception, I have come to view the Spanish Mass in a different way, and worry that it could actually be a means of keeping many people from fully joining the activities of the parish. Although unintentional, it seems to polarize the Hispanic community, slowing down what would be a natural assimilation into not just the parish, but our American culture. In addition, because not all parishes offer the Spanish Mass, it tends to draw its congregation from a wider geographic area, thus preventing them from becoming an integral part of their home parishes. To me, this doesn’t seem to be a favor to anyone.

In the 19th century, when immigrants were entering the U.S. in record numbers, while this type of polarization wasn’t completely unknown, (we still have many ethnic churches) it posed less of a problem because at least all Masses were celebrated in Latin. Until a new citizen was comfortable speaking English, they could take comfort in knowing that they shared a common bond with other Americans through the Catholic Church. People of all languages shared the Sacrifice of the Mass together. I believe (strictly conjecture on my part ) that being forced together helped many immigrants find the common ground that unites us today.

In my opinion, it would be more beneficial to the Hispanic community if we welcomed them into our parishes through the general assembly rather than having separate Masses for them.

I’m sure that there are many points of view on this issue and I’d be happy to hear a few.
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Both of the parishes I've attended have Spanish Masses. Although I'm not as up on the one I currently attend, the former one was almost evenly split between Spanish and English congregants. The parish attracted Spanish-speaking folks from all over the city, even though several other parishes also have Spanish services. The percentage at the newer one isn’t as high, but it’s fairly large suburban parish, whereas my former parish was a medium-sized urban church.

I don’t think having a Spanish Mass necessarily keeps people from participating fully in parish activities. On the contrary, I think it can provide a means for Spanish-speaking folks to gradually integrate with their English-speaking counterparts ... but this is provided that there is a genuine desire for such integration on both sides. I think most of us trend toward taking the path of least resistance, and let’s be honest: cross-cultural friendships are hard work, particularly if there’s a language barrier involved. In my former parish, the priest regularly made attempts to bring the Anglo and Hispanic congregations together through parish activities and on Holy Days. There was plenty of grousing from the English folks about bilingual services (much longer than English only) but it did get all of us in the same room, at least.

I think it’s a two-way street. If Spanish Masses have a polarizing effect in the church, why is that? I’ve gone to a few Spanish masses where I was the only white person present. I think just saying “you’re here, so smell of elderberries it up and adjust” may be OK for secular culture, but in the church that seems a little harsh. Is the common ground we’re looking for only for those who speak English well?

Besides, I don’t think we have to sit next to each other in the pew to share in the Sacrifice of the Mass. That common ground exists regardless of what church we sit in or what language we speak.

[photosynthesis]

[quote name='Sojourner' date='Mar 3 2006, 01:05 PM']Besides, I don’t think we have to sit next to each other in the pew to share in the Sacrifice of the Mass. That common ground exists regardless of what church we sit in or what language we speak.
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that's one of the things I love most about the Church... we're all in communion with one another even if we speak different languages.

[MissScripture]

I think that everyone should have to learn English when they come to America, to make life easier for them in the long run. However, because the Church is universal, I see no problem in having Mass in various languages. Prayer and worship is something that ought to be done in the language you feel comfortable with. I have a friend who comes from South Africa, so her first language is Afrikaans, but she speaks English fluently (better than a lot of Americans!) but she can't pray in English. She said it just doesn't come out right. She goes to Church in English, because she has no choice, but all of her private prayers, her Bible and all of that is in Afrikaans. It just makes sense that you'd want something as important as prayer/worship/Mass in the language of your heart.

[Quietfire]

My parish has Mass in Italian.
The parish down the street has Mass in Spanish.
We did have a parish that had the Latin Mass, but I just found out that that is not the case now, so I have to find out why.
I like participating in bi-lingual Mass. I get the opportunity to meet people within the Church that I normally wouldnt see at an english only Mass.

and I only speak english. go figure.

[photosynthesis]

if you regularly go to Mass, you know the structure of the Liturgy. You know what goes on during the consecration. Although you won't understand the homily as well as you would if the Mass was in your own language, you can participate in the Eucharistic sacrifice because you know what's happening.

When I went to Mass in Croation, they had missals that had the whole Mass translated into both languages. It was very helpful.

before Mass, you can go to the USCCB website and print out the Sunday readings and bring them... so that solves the problem of not understanding the Scripture readings.

In all of the Masses I went to in all languages, nothing could keep me from fully participating in the Liturgy. For thousands of years, many people went to Mass in a language that was not their own. It is fair to expect immigrants to learn our language. But I don't think English-speaking citizens should be afraid of being somewhat influenced by other cultures through multicultural exchange.

[Mrvoll]

I went to a spanish mass by accident. There was, I thought, alot of Mass Abuse. The priest had the host in a mini monstrance and didn't take it out for communion.

[gelibeme]

I live in the Southern San Joaquin valley, and my Parish has
Sat. night in Spanish. Sunday 9am-Spanish
Sunday 11am-English
Sunday 7pm-Spanish
Daily mass is 6:45-English
8am-Spanish

I have been part of San Augustin Parish all of my life. I am bi-lingual and many in the community I come from do not understand or Speak English very well. We are a community of immigrants. Many beautiful traditions from Mexico and Latin America are practiced in my Parish. It is very traditional. While attending CCD, I assisted English mass, and I do occasionally, but our family's preference is for the Spanish mass.

We have very Strong catholic leaders in our parish who take charge of the Spanish ministries. The best approach is to have bilingual presons who can bridge the gap between groups of Spanish only and English only. The Neo-Catechumens has Spanish and English sessions. On Holy Days, our masses our bilingual. First communions and confirmations are bilingual.

I love going to the Spanish mass. I think it would further alienate some of the people who aren't strong Catholics, who assist primarily to uphold the tradition their families have handed down. But because of that tradition, there is that opportunity for God's grace to move.

I find that when I pray, I prefer to pray in Spanish. There is more comfort, more intimacy. Mass being the most sublime of communion (prayer) with God utilizes those parts of our humanity that draw of close to him.

To have a common language is good, but it is also good reach out to those who do not have the English language.

Take for example some of these beautiful traditions of devotion:
At the end of advent, before our baby Jesus is put away, we can come up after mass and kiss him and rock him.

On our Lady's Feast, people come and flood the altar with flowers, sing her beautiful songs to honor her and Jesus, people wake early to assist mass and we have processions in her honor.

Prior to Christmass, we have Las Posaditas, in which the children, and families learn of the Holy Family's pilgramage and in which we renact the rejection of Jesus, Mary and Joseph and finally an open home to recieve the baby Jesus.

Rosary novenas and prayers for the dead are rich traditions in the church.

I can go on and on...

Language carries with it the traditions of a people. In our parish, there are beautiful and rich devotions that without the Spanish language would be lost. In retaining the heritage of language, we also help to retain the heritage of faithful love and devotion to Holy Mother Church and our God.

[Paladin]

You know, I went to a church in Naples, FL once and they offered Mass in English, Spanish, Creole, and French. Talk about your universal church.

I think offering the Mass in a language people understand is important, perhaps even more important than the apparent unity of the congregation. What makes us more united than Holy Communion? Even if the Latino and English-speaking peoples of the parish don't necessarily go to the same church events, the fact that they're attending Mass in whatever language they understand binds them all in a deep and mystical way, deeper than whatever else might divide them.

[dspen2005]

forget these language masses that promote and engender nationalism and can incultate a superiority complex; say the Mass in latin and then everyone will have nothing to complain about.

[Paladin]

Unfortunately, I really doubt that would be how it goes down. You would get plenty of complains about Latin Masses. People just don't understand it anymore. In some ways, it's not their fault. Catechesis no longer bothers with Latin. It's unfortunate that people forget the langugage of the Church, but it's a fact of the matter. If you want to move back to a Latin Mass, you would need to have a complete overhaul in catechesis.

[homeschoolmom]

[quote name='dspen2005' date='Mar 9 2006, 06:23 AM']forget these language masses that promote and engender nationalism and can incultate a superiority complex; say the Mass in latin and then everyone will have nothing to complain about.
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Or everyone will have the same thing to complain about.

[mvi18th]

I live in SC which has a whopping 3% Catholic population. The parish that I attend is a missionary church (even at 1500 families it is still considered missionary) run by two Adorno fathers out of Lodi, NJ.

The reason the Adorno fathers came to the US was at a request in the early 1900’s by the local bishop to help with the Italian immigrants that had settled in the area. America is a melting pot and as such, has had this issue for a long time. It’s not just the Mass but the other services too. It takes time to learn a language, especially as an adult and we as a community need to be helpful and offer the other services that the parish has to those that need it, whether they can speak English or not.

My parish just got a new priest (not Adorno) from Latin America who speaks both Spanish and Portuguese and has taken over masses for both. This does not mean there is a separate community, just that we have something to make the rising Hispanic population feel welcome. Parish events, integrate the members and the English speaking population are invited to events specific to the Hispanic culture.

The fact is, if we don’t others will. I pass by two churches every day that are Hispanic Protestant churches that cater to those that speak Spanish. They have flourished because local parishes for the longest time did not make them feel welcome. Several “regular” Protestant churches have mission groups that go into the Hispanic neighborhoods to recruit them, speaking Spanish and having services in Spanish too.

If these churches are doing it to gather converts, shouldn’t we do it for those that are already part of our faith?

[avemaria40]

I've been to Spanish Mass at my aunt's church and I think it's a good thing. I believe immigrants, no matter where they come from, should learn to speak English but Mass is a place where they can worship together in their own tongue. These ppl are expected to speak our language, learn our customs, and do everything they can to blend in and it's probably lonely for many of them. A MAss in their own language helps them know that many of them are in this together and can give a sense of security knowing that they can still worship God in their own tongue