Ora et Labora Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 [quote name='brendan1104' date='Feb 20 2006, 04:46 PM']Aww Kristina, I'm touched. Nobody on PM has ever said that before... Of course you're not as "ultra" traditional as me, but it's good to know somebody agrees with something I said... [right][snapback]893085[/snapback][/right] [/quote] You know as well as I do that we have had our.....conflicts. At least we have had conflicts... But I do agree with you on some points. And I'm pretty traditional...believe me! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brendan1104 Posted February 20, 2006 Author Share Posted February 20, 2006 [quote name='Ora et Labora' date='Feb 20 2006, 06:50 PM'] You know as well as I do that we have had our.....conflicts. At least we have had conflicts... But I do agree with you on some points. And I'm pretty traditional...believe me! [right][snapback]893091[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Yes, but you don't go to the SSPX. By the way, I find your thread "To Brendan only" a few days ago, and responded a few times... but you didn't. Check it out in the Debate table. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ora et Labora Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 Oh, I will. Are you really SSPX though? I thought you sort of got over that.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChild Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 I love the Latin in our Mass at church. We are still NO, but we have the incense, the Latin, the male choir, etc. And what's interesting is that those who attend that Mass, regardless of if they usually attend that Mass or attend any of the Masses, depending on the convenience of the time for them. . .everyone is silent, reverent, etc. It fills me with awe. I like the sacred-ness of the Latin, regardless of Diocesan Tridentine Indult or NO in origin. (and since I have a missal which shows me what is being said, in either Mass, I can follow along!) To *ME*? It's better than a rock concert I sometimes stumble into when walking into visiting parishes (like if I am on vacation and go to Mass, like I will next week). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brendan1104 Posted February 20, 2006 Author Share Posted February 20, 2006 (edited) [quote name='Ora et Labora' date='Feb 20 2006, 06:53 PM']Oh, I will. Are you really SSPX though? I thought you sort of got over that.... [right][snapback]893096[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I still go to their chapel... I love serving High Mass there- they do it much more properly and fully than the indult. I like the doctrinal instruction and the fellowship. They have everything the indult doesn't and there are no conditions, no restraints, etc. Edited February 20, 2006 by brendan1104 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 [quote name='OLAM Dad' date='Feb 20 2006, 05:39 PM']Whats wrong with everyone!?! We are [i][b]not[/b][/i] against the Church!! Why do y'all think that just because we are traditional, we are against the church??!! We are not the same as SSPX. You clearly [i]misread[/i] our posts. We prefer the Latin mass......that doesn't mean its the [i]only[/i] mass we go to and is the [i]only[/i] mass we believe is valid. Okay? [right][snapback]893076[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I think Adam uses the term "traditionalist" in the same way that I prefer to use it, namely, to describe someone who hates the Novus Ordo Mass, loves the SSPX (even if they don't attend their chapels), refuses to submit to Vatican II, thinks popes like John Paul II were among the worst popes in history, etc. For Catholics like you and me who are loyal to the Church and merely happen to prefer the Tridentine Mass, I consider the proper term to be "traditional Catholics." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brendan1104 Posted February 20, 2006 Author Share Posted February 20, 2006 [quote name='Dave' date='Feb 20 2006, 06:57 PM']I think Adam uses the term "traditionalist" in the same way that I prefer to use it, namely, to describe someone who hates the Novus Ordo Mass, loves the SSPX (even if they don't attend their chapels), refuses to submit to Vatican II, thinks popes like John Paul II were among the worst popes in history, etc. For Catholics like you and me who are loyal to the Church and merely happen to prefer the Tridentine Mass, I consider the proper term to be "traditional Catholics." [right][snapback]893101[/snapback][/right] [/quote] "I'm a Catholic, not a traditionalist." - Hutton Gibson. - Brendan Young. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam42 Posted February 20, 2006 Share Posted February 20, 2006 [quote name='Raphael' date='Feb 20 2006, 03:52 PM']What are what we always have been. We believe what we have always believed. We worship Whom we have always worshipped, in spirit and truth. We have always been right. We have never been wrong. Accept that the faith is unfolding and the Church living. Stop making God and His Church into a dead system of rules and acknowledge the greatness of the Trinity of Divine Persons. [right][snapback]892922[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Nice Micah, very Nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HisChild Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 I am so honored to enter the PCPA on the feast of Divine Mercy sunday, the one year anniversary of JP II the Great's death. (even though it's not the actual date as last year). I haven't taken off his crucifix in the 12 yrs I've worn it. (well, to clean it!) He's just. . . .amazing. Inspiring. And the springboard of many vocations. God bless you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam42 Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 [quote name='brendan1104' date='Feb 20 2006, 02:00 PM']Sorry, but indults make up only a small part of traditional Masses. We continue the Mass and Church of all time. I'll be back later later I have to go to confession. [right][snapback]892808[/snapback][/right] [/quote] But the Tridentine Mass is NOT "the Mass of all time." It is simply the accepted form the Mass for 399 years. And how do you reconcile this: [quote name='Quo Primum Tempore']Nevertheless, if this Missal which We have seen fit to publish be more agreeable to these last, We hereby permit them to celebrate Mass according to its rite, subject to the consent of their bishop or prelate, and of their whole Chapter, all else to the contrary notwithstanding.[/quote] This is in regard to local churches which have a Missal that is more than 200 years old. So, according to your logic, it is "the Mass of all time" except for those churches? Nope. Your logic is faulty. If that is the case, then it is not the Mass of all time. Incidentally, [i]Quo Primum[/i] was only a diciplinary document. There is nothing infallible about it. Should we pay it the due it deserves, you bet. But does that mean that it is never ammendable or that it is never to be superceded? Nope. If that were the case, then what was the point of [i]Cum Sanctissimum[/i] and [i]Si Quid Est[/i]? However, to answer your question, if it were reverted, which it never will be, I would go with fervor. Just like I go now, just like I go to the Novus Ordo, now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catholicinsd Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 Right, I don't understand what ya'll are saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironmonk Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 [quote name='brendan1104' date='Feb 20 2006, 11:04 AM']Good question... [right][snapback]892623[/snapback][/right] [/quote] With the obediance that the protestants that call themselves "traditionalist" should have. I am Catholic, One Faith. All who protest the Church leadership are protestants, for they protest the Church - no way to get around it. Are you Catholic or are you protestant? People who say that the N.O. Mass is invalid have no authority to do so. People who say that the Pope is not the Pope fall into protestantism. Acts 20:29-30, 2 Peter 3:15-16 <- They left the group. Therefore they are wrong. We have no authority in what is right or wrong with the Mass, it is not up to you or me to judge the Church established by Christ that will never be overcome. The Mass has always been changing, and as long as mankind exists, it from time to time will change... to win people for Christ. BOTTOM LINE: If you protest the Church, you are a protestant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brendan1104 Posted February 21, 2006 Author Share Posted February 21, 2006 [quote name='ironmonk' date='Feb 20 2006, 07:16 PM']All who protest the Church leadership are protestants, for they protest the Church - no way to get around it. [/quote] So St. Athanasius and Saint Paul and other saints were protestants? No, that's merely protesting leaders, not the Church. The Church is the Mystical Body of Christ, not bureaucrats or bishops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ora et Labora Posted February 21, 2006 Share Posted February 21, 2006 [quote name='ironmonk' date='Feb 20 2006, 05:16 PM']With the obediance that the protestants that call themselves "traditionalist" should have. I am Catholic, One Faith. All who protest the Church leadership are protestants, for they protest the Church - no way to get around it. Are you Catholic or are you protestant? People who say that the N.O. Mass is invalid have no authority to do so. People who say that the Pope is not the Pope fall into protestantism. Acts 20:29-30, 2 Peter 3:15-16 <- They left the group. Therefore they are wrong. We have no authority in what is right or wrong with the Mass, it is not up to you or me to judge the Church established by Christ that will never be overcome. The Mass has always been changing, and as long as mankind exists, it from time to time will change... to win people for Christ. BOTTOM LINE: If you protest the Church, you are a protestant. [right][snapback]893119[/snapback][/right] [/quote] So, your saying the SSPX are more protostant then Catholic? Right...? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brendan1104 Posted February 21, 2006 Author Share Posted February 21, 2006 (edited) [quote name='Cam42' date='Feb 20 2006, 07:11 PM']But the Tridentine Mass is NOT "the Mass of all time." It is simply the accepted form the Mass for 399 years. This is in regard to local churches which have a Missal that is more than 200 years old. So, according to your logic, it is "the Mass of all time" except for those churches? Nope. Your logic is faulty. If that is the case, then it is not the Mass of all time. [right][snapback]893116[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Trent and Pope St. Pius V only codified and canonized the Missal which has existed for 400 years, not the Mass which had existed previously to Trent for hundreds of years.. Edited February 21, 2006 by brendan1104 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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