Which Mass do you hear?

[Amator Veritatis]

Let us not forget the words of Our Blessed Lord: "Amen I say to you, unless you be converted, and become as little children, you shall not enter into the kingdom of heaven." (St. Matthew xviii.3) Now, of course, Our Lord was speaking about humility and obedience, though, I for one am quite impressed by the work of someone who is so tender in years.

I would also hope that divine Charity would be the basis for one's [i]vie[/i], regardless of a person's age. Though, sadly this is not always life. In any event, I would like to add that I have actually had the grand privilege of assisting at a solemn Dominican Mass. It was quite close to the traditional Roman Rite, though it did have some of its own particular differences which are comparable to those of other traditional Latin Rites.

I pray that we can continue to discuss matters in a civilised, intellectual, and--above all--charitable fashion. I also hope that solid points can be brought up in our debates that they might be fruitful. By the way, I have just joined here and look forward to participating in future discussions.

Edited February 16, 2006 by Amator Veritatis

[Cam42]

[quote name='brendan1104' date='Feb 15 2006, 08:42 PM']it's interesting that st josemaria escrive continued to offer his private mass according to the tridentine rite. apparently he believed it was superior to the novus ordo...
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It was his perogative, as it is any priests to celebrate the Tridentine Mass. However, it is mandated that the Prelature will celebrate the Missa Normativa.

You don't need to tell me what the Founder did and did not prefer. And he held both Masses to be of equal value. Because he preferred to celebrate the Tridentine in private doesn't lessen or make him question the Missa Normativa.

St. Josemaria often said of the Mass;
[quote]In her liturgy, the Church dares to sing joyfully of the mystery of Christ’s Cross. Sorrow does not cancel out joy if we live it in union with the self-giving of Jesus Christ for our salvation.[/quote]

This was re-iterated in 2001 by Bishop Javier Echevarría.

[heavenseeker]

not sure

[qfnol31]

[quote name='brendan1104' date='Feb 15 2006, 07:42 PM']it's interesting that st josemaria escrive continued to offer his private mass according to the tridentine rite. apparently he believed it was superior to the novus ordo...
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I think our current Pope in many ways considers it to have been superior. I think he also wrote that they should work together now that there's no getting rid of it.

I know a few Priests who offer it in private because they consider it superior in many ways to the Novus Ordo...or at least prefer it.

[Donna]

Cam, your tone does not impress me. The ears literally turn off [i]because of the way you talk down to[/i] - especially - a youngster.

You lost one [i]right here[/i], is it worth it?

You are a grown man acting not like it.

Edited February 16, 2006 by Donna

[Donna]

And unto whomsoever much is given, of him much shall be required.

- Luke 12:48.

[Cam42]

[quote name='Donna' date='Feb 16 2006, 03:01 AM']Cam, your tone does not impress me. The ears literally turn off [i]because of the way you talk down to[/i] - especially - a youngster.

You lost one [i]right here[/i], is it worth it?

You are a grown man acting not like it.
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C'est la vis. Whatever shall be, shall be. I don't hold it against you that you don't like my tone. May God Bless you.

Thanks for the Scripture quote. Let me offer you one.....

Matthew 10:14

[Amator Veritatis]

Cam42, I do not know if you noticed my other response, but I hope you would take my comments to heart. I must say, as a new member here, that I was immediately scandalised by reading many of your posts on this topic. I pray you take this as fraternal correction offered for your own edification and perfection and the honour of Almighty God.

Further, I would like to point out that Our Lord's admonition to abandon those who hear not the truth in no way permits sins against charity, as Saint Paul makes clear in his Epistle to the Ephesians, thus: "But doing the truth in charity, we may in all things grow up in him who is the head, even Christ." (Ephesians iv.15) [i]Veritatem facientes in caritate[/i].

[Cam42]

[quote name='Amator Veritatis' date='Feb 16 2006, 07:43 PM']Cam42, I do not know if you noticed my other response, but I hope you would take my comments to heart. I must say, as a new member here, that I was immediately scandalised by reading many of your posts on this topic. I pray you take this as fraternal correction offered for your own edification and perfection and the honour of Almighty God.

Further, I would like to point out that Our Lord's admonition to abandon those who hear not the truth in no way permits sins against charity, as Saint Paul makes clear in his Epistle to the Ephesians, thus: "But doing the truth in charity, we may in all things grow up in him who is the head, even Christ." (Ephesians iv.15) [i]Veritatem facientes in caritate[/i].
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Before you claim scandal, I would suggest that you understand the circumstances surrounding this thread.

At some point, a child needs to be corrected in not so subtle terms. I have taken the not so popular role of being the one to correct StThomasMore. His prior actions were completely out of line and they were obsitinant. He refused to listen to many persons on this board, not just me.

Hence the citation of Matthew 10:14. While I appreciate your words, I think that charity was not prevaded. The language may have been a bit harsh, but the view of StThomasMore was at odds with understood Catholic thought. Since this is a debate board, and he stated that he had a working understanding of many things, I simply wanted to find out what they were.

My actions with StThomasMore are consistent with my persona here. I have treated him no differently than anyone else on the debate board, who takes the opposite position with me. To treat him any differently would be inconsistent.

Welcome to the boards. I look forward to seeing what you will offer. God Bless.

[MichaelFilo]

I go to a Novus Ordo, but the TLM whenever possible (only one Church does it, but it's downtown, at 8:00 AM). However, I prefer the TLM, but in that Church they do a pretty good job of the NO. Sadly, for daily Mass I attend a church where the mass is usually licit, but at times, I quesion it.

God bless,
Mikey

[qfnol31]

I had to stop going to daily Mass every day...either lack of sleep or an occasion of sin.

[Cam42]

[quote name='MichaelFilo' date='Feb 16 2006, 08:59 PM']I go to a Novus Ordo, but the TLM whenever possible (only one Church does it, but it's downtown, at 8:00 AM). However, I prefer the TLM, but in that Church they do a pretty good job of the NO. Sadly, for daily Mass I attend a church where the mass is usually licit, but at times, I quesion it.

God bless,
Mikey
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Welcome back Mikey.....we've missed you.

[MichaelFilo]

Hi. As you know, i may not stay long, as Phatmass is ever a distraction from more heavenly goals. I just return from tiem to time to make sure you know I'm alive, although it's not much less than a year and a half away from the time I ship out to yonder adulthood, and take up that vocation. And once said ordained (hopefully), I shall take up the reigns of saying the TLM for the rest of my years.

God bless,
Mikey

[Amator Veritatis]

Cam, thank you for your reply. Please understand that my comments did not pertain to the fact that you saw fit to correct another member of the boards here. Whether a child needs to be corrected is not the issue with which I found scandal. I was scandalised, rather, by the manner in which you corrected the good gentleman who has taken Saint Thomas More as his patron on this website. Demeaning and condescending responses, in my humble opinion, are at odds with the most basic standards of the Virtue of Charity and the proper etiquette of debate. My scandal was primarily in the patronising use of the term "Tommy" or prefacing direct addresses to him with "little" or like terms. I feel it necessary, as a matter of conscience, to admonish the sinner in a manner keeping with the standards of clarity though not at the expense of charity. If it be scandal to make a defence of the ill doings of another, how much more loathsome the defence of one's own ill doing! I say this as one who in the past was wont to do the same and for this reason ask you to allow the sentiments of charity--or empathy, at least--to stir in you that you might be better disposed to fulfill the oft-perilous task of debate and teaching, following the admonition of Saint James: "Nolite plures magistri fieri fratres mei scientes quoniam majus judicium sumitis." (St. James iii.1)


Because I have seen fit to comment in this thread already, I feel I should at least address the topic at hand, or part of it. Sadly, I must say, with qfnol31, that I too was forced to quit my assisting at daily Mass for the occasion of sin it presented me. Happily, I have since been fortunate enough to find a parish offering a daily Mass following the guidelines of the Church and those of piety, whereas the previous parishes at which I would assist at Mass were lacking even in simple decorum. I should say, to answer the pertinent question, that I assist at a Mass according to the liturgical books in force in 1962.


I should add that I have read the majority of this thread and would be delighted to reply at a more opportune time to some of the posts, especially that rather lengthy one from soldier of Christ.

Edited February 17, 2006 by Amator Veritatis

[Cam42]

[quote name='Amator Veritatis' date='Feb 16 2006, 11:13 PM']Cam, thank you for your reply. Please understand that my comments did not pertain to the fact that you saw fit to correct another member of the boards here. Whether a child needs to be corrected is not the issue with which I found scandal. I was scandalised, rather, by the manner in which you corrected the good gentleman who has taken Saint Thomas More as his patron on this website. Demeaning and condescending responses, in my humble opinion, are at odds with the most basic standards of the Virtue of Charity and the proper etiquette of debate. My scandal was primarily in the patronising use of the term "Tommy" or prefacing direct addresses to him with "little" or like terms. I feel it necessary, as a matter of conscience, to admonish the sinner in a manner keeping with the standards of clarity though not at the expense of charity. If it is scandal to make a defence of the ill doings of another, how much more loathsome the defence of one's own ill doing! I say this as one who in the past was wont to do the same and for this reason ask you to allow the sentiments of charity--or empathy, at least--to stir in you that you might be better disposed to fulfill the oft-perilous task of debate and teaching, following the admonition of Saint James: "Nolite plures magistri fieri fratres mei scientes quoniam majus judicium sumitis." (St. James iii.1)
Because I have seen fit to comment in this thread already, I feel I should at least address the topic at hand, or part of it. Sadly, I must say, with qfnol31, that I too was forced to quit my assisting at daily Mass for the occasion of sin it presented me. Happily, I have since been fortunate enough to find a parish offering a daily Mass following the guidelines of the Church and those of piety, whereas the previous parishes at which I would assist at Mass were lacking even in simple decorum. I should say, to answer the pertinent question, that I assist at a Mass according to the liturgical books in force in 1962.
I should add that I have read the majority of this thread and would be delighted to reply at a more opportune time to some of the posts, especially that rather lengthy one from soldier of Christ.
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And that is your opinion.