What's the greater enemy?

[Lounge Daddy]

[quote name='PadreSantiago' date='Dec 21 2005, 01:30 AM']liberals aren't in the military they aren't fighting the war so they have no effect on the outcome of the war.  The numerous protests around the world proved that.

and thanks I like your carl avatar!  Aqua teen hunger force rules!
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[/quote]

Your right, liberals are not fighting the war – they are too busy being irresponsible.
Instead of fighting evil (as if they could recognize evil if it slapped them in the face, let alone crashed a plane into a building) Liberals are too busy with other things…

* They are too busy calling our own armed forces terrorists ([url="http://www.juiceenewsdaily.com/1105/news/terror.html?1133909169760.html"]HERE[/url] - [url="http://www.cbsnews.com/htdocs/pdf/face_120405.pdf"]and HERE)[/url]

* They are too busy dismissing the success of repeated democratic elections in Iraq, and a Constitution in Iraq… (do liberals seem to distrust democracy???) ([url="http://www.woai.com/news/local/story.aspx?content_id=C36A87B9-63A0-4CDE-AA91-B41571AFD3AF"]Dean in December 2005... days before the election in Iraq[/url] --- [url="http://www.hannity.com/index/lieberman"]Joe Lieberman reporting on THE TRUTH of good news in IRAQ[/url] -- [url="http://thepoliticalteen.net/2005/12/13/gotohell"]HERE[/url], [url="http://www.accessnorthga.com/news/ap_newfullstory.asp?ID=68274"]HERE[/url])

*They are too busy trying to compare our sevice men and women to gaurds at pol pot and nazi camps [url="http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,159748,00.html"](HERE)[/url]

*They are too busy telling us that we deserved 9/11 ([url="http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=16812"]HERE[/url], [url="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ward_Churchill"]HERE[/url])

*They are too busy treating radical Islamo-Fascists as criminals, and terrorism not as acts of war – but as simple crime (moveOn.org was launched originally as pacifist "9-11peace.org" and ran an ad in newspapers calling for "understanding" -- [url="http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4724726"]Liberals wish to impart "due-process under our laws on the very people who wish to kill us all[/url], [url="http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/talking_point/2027315.stm"]HERE[/url])

*They are too busy supporting the Patriot Act, and then announcing they struck it down to an applauding crowd – changing positions as political winds shift, rather than standing on right or wrong [url="http://www.drudgereportarchives.com/data/2005/12/20/20051220_210000_pa.htm"](HERE ...[/url] [url="http://rawstory.com/news/2005/Reid_to_oppose_Patriot_Act_will_1214.html"]HERE)[/url]

*They are too busy holding “anti-war demonstrations” that turn out to be “anti-America demonstrations” on our own soil [url="http://www.protestwarrior.com/gallery.php?group=lefties&pic=12"](HERE and[/url] [url="http://www.protestwarrior.com/gallery.php?group=lefties&pic=7"]HERE - [/url] [url="http://www.protestwarrior.com/gallery.php?group=lefties&pic=8"]HERE)[/url]- organized by global communist organization intent on working our issues against us... such as the World Workers Party ([url="http://www.protestwarrior.com/gallery.php?group=lefties&pic=10"]HERE[/url]and [url="http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=29524"]HERE and[/url] [url="http://www.workers.org/"]HERE)[/url]
And then the news cameras go away [url="http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001572310"](HERE)[/url]– they take their anti-Americanism to other countries. ([url="http://www.breitbart.com/news/2005/12/17/D8EI2P782.html"]HERE[/url])

*They are too busy making inane comments with little regard to the fact that their comments are broadcast all over the world – and our enemies make note of this, and plan to use everything to their advantage (btw - how long until Saddam writes a few children’s books? --- [url="http://news.yahoo.com/fc/world/iraq"]HERE[/url], [url="http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/796AA4AC-531C-4E6F-B855-7FBC52506824.htm"]HERE - Senator Johnsonville brat Durbin's comments were reported all over the middle-east as fact[/url],

*They are too busy leaking classified U.S. defense information to an all too willing (and equally irresponsible liberal mainstream press, such as the existence of spy satellite programs, CIA holding prisons, letting our enemies know of our war plans, and now our eaves dropping on domestic-to-foreign phone conversations ([url="http://www.conservativepunk.com/NewsItem.asp?newsId=90"]HERE[/url], [url="http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/Investigation/story?id=1375123"]HERE[/url], [url="http://thepoliticalteen.net/2005/11/14/rockefeller/"]HERE[/url], [url="http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4228873"]HERE - remarks on the senate floor that should have never been made[/url], [url="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/09/AR2005110901976_pf.html"]HERE[/url], [url="http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2005-12-06-nations-cia_x.htm"]HERE[/url], [url="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/11/01/AR2005110101644.html"]HERE[/url],

*The liberal activist machine is hell-bent on acting like irresponsible pacifists by rendering our national defense impotent, in the name of their pacifist socialist idealistic agenda! Well congratulations!
If things continue on the same road – our national defense will revert to the same level of ineffectiveness as it did during the Clinton administration … if not much worse.
In the 1990’s we were attacked several times, each one worse. I thank God we were able to step up to the plate and stop the attacks after 9/11… and every attack on the US since had been prevented
But Liberals in Congress will see us exposed again soon, if they are not stopped we will have another attack

[img]http://www.911peace.org/images/wtcbridge.jpg[/img]

Liberals are completely ignorant, they do not have the stomach to fight evil, and they don’t even seem to understand that evil exists in this world– let alone that there is a direct threat from evil people who want to kill us all
Instead of seeing evil waging war on us – Liberals like you, PadreSantiago want to [i]understand why they hate us[/i] and many even believe we deserve to be attacked

I say I like your avatar – but not because I like that S.O.B. who President George Bush, President Clinton, and President G.W. Bush all declared a threat to his own people as well as ours…
I say that I like your avatar because it shows [i]exactly[/i] where you currently stand

[Lounge Daddy]

and yes i still love you, Padre Santiago -(mwwaaaa!)
a kiss on the cheek you liberal fool

I friggin’ can’t stand liberalism – so convert you big loveable dude

[Myles Domini]

[url="http://catholica.pontifications.net/?p=1282"]Can Islam coexist with Christianity?[/url] courtesy of Pontifications

INXC
Myles

PS) [url="http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/009487.php"]Check out the case for the defence. Fantastic, nai?[/url]

Edited December 22, 2005 by Myles

[track2004]

Any idea that denies gray area or that denies black and whites is wrong.

[son_of_angels]

I said "liberalism," which is not a good stance for me. Here's the thing, in a given set of circumstances "liberalism" or "fundamentalism" can both be equally damaging.

However I immediately respond strongly against the word "fundamentalist" because it obscures an actual threat to the church which comes from primarily "liberal" Catholics. After all, the old women and EWTN fans out there might perhaps be labeled "fundamentalists" simply because they hold to the "fundamentals" of their religion. At the same time, however, for them to be truly hardcore Catholic, they don't rely on a list of "fundamentals" to achieve righteousness. Instead, they insist on beautiful liturgy, devotion to saints, numerous prayers, large crucifixes, and often obscene amounts of scapulars and medals. On the other hand, fundamentalism in the form it takes in Protestant circles tries to strip away everything except the "fundamentals" of their faith, like the plan of salvation, etc. Hence, fundamentalism, if it does exist, does not come from the most religious Catholics, but from another source.

This other source is liberalism. How often in the liberal Catholic media are we encouraged to cast off our "devotions" and "traditional pieties?" How often are we told that Vatican II ended the use of a truly beautiful, formulaic liturgy? It is from liberals in the Catholic Church that we find the "fundamentalist" notions espoused in many protestant churches most held aloft. Of course, the only difference is that Catholic liberals don't promise, in lieu of all the devotions and pieties, a personal relationship with our Lord. They promise instead a "social justice" gospel or a promise of "peace." What malarky, that they ignore Christ's warnings, "The poor you will always have with you" and "I come not to bring peace but a sword" and "you hear wars and rumours of wars" but that we must not be troubled for "that all things be fulfilled" this must come before the "last days." Protestant fundamentalists do promise such a relationship, as also do (if they have truly advanced through these into a vibrant spirituality) Catholic faithful.


However, I will say this. If by "fundamentalist" you mean "rigidly adherent" or "narrowly traditionally minded" or some other such idea, I would say that this also has its dangers. This does not come from the concepts it works off of themselves (though sometimes crazy devotions (Medjugorie), schismatic groups (SSPX), and religious violence work off of misunderstandings of the Catholic faith, fueled by popular ignorance), but instead from the alienation of themselves from a group of people, to whom they should instead be ministering. This is where the "pendulum effect" comes from. Liberals offer nothing so there is a fanatical backlash, the fanatics make people suffer so much that they turn back to liberals for comfort, etc. No one here is able to seek the best faith, only the most available, marketable, and personally consoling. Hence none of them offer happiness, and our malcontent poisons, as it always has, the well-springs of faith. Thank God for the Holy Spirit that we, sinful as we are, cannot destroy that which He has intended to remain! Let us not cease the Paraclete's help that we may rely "fundamentally" on Him!

Ah, but why then select "liberal." It is simple, because in an all-out Crusade between them, liberalism will always attract the rich and public, because, owing to its lack of actual internal values, it is easier to publicly adopt than conservativism. Hence, it is more vicious, and requires a stronger position to defeat than some incensed fanaticism. Usually the latter can just be waited out.

[KnightofChrist]

[/QUOTE]i don't understand this poll. Are we talking about relgious fundamentalists in general? Because we are supposedly fighting a war right now against these people. And yet you feel the bigger threat are liberals in america? It boogles my mind [QUOTE]


I would say liberals in america are THE GREATER DANGER than Isam fundys... Liberals are giving Terrorist rights, saying if we'd just be their friends they would not kill us, now they want to stop Bush from listening in on Terrorists phone calls, and stop Bush for seaching for nucler martial... WE ARE AT WAR WITH PEOPLE THAT WANT TO CUT OFF OUR HEADS AND BLOW UP OUR WOMEN AND CHILDEN!!!!

LIBERALS ARE AT WAR, NOT WITH TERRORIST BUT WITH CHRISTIANS AND GEORGE W. BUSH!!!! Their hate blinds them so, they betray US! How many more 9/11's will it take 2, 3????.... So sad... so very sad... The Terrorist should be "understood" the Christian must not follow his faith in public!

This Liberalism is Anti-Christian and there-for Anti-American there I said!!! Dont be getting on ACLU on me either!!!

Maybe the Libs are right maybe if we're real nice to them and run away like weak chickens the Terrorist will feel real bad when they cut an Americans head off. It is not a supposeded war, IT IS A WAR!!! A WAR WE MUST WIN!!!

[Akalyte]

I cant stand Liberalism, I hate even the word. soemtimes i dont even want to get into it on here. Liberalism is incompatible with Catholicism. Some popes have proclaimed that, but some catholics on here dont think past popes are wise and dont know what they are talking about Whether it be in the 1800's or today. I dont see a difference, but no one seems to understand that.

Take a look at the liberals of the 1800's and take a look at the liberals today, many of them were athiests then, many of them are atheists today, back then many of them rejected the church's teachings, today they are rejecting the churches teachings. I've tried to explain that many times on here. I'm just tired of people trying to say that liberalism is "ok today". Hogwash, its the same perfidious enemy of the faith.

Edited December 24, 2005 by Akalyte

[Akalyte]

the world is crazy.

Edited December 24, 2005 by Akalyte

[HomeTeamFamily]

whoa lot of long posts in this thread so ill weigh in real fast then get out.....

liberalism is a bigger threat because it is more societal than fundamentalism......fund. is still religious in nature and will affect a smaller portion of the population

lib. generally relates to things taht feel good (sex, drugs, etc etc) and will have a greater pull on those who either arent religious or arent strong in their religion.

i can see liberalism taking people away from fund, but not so much the other way around

[journeyman]

to change the words - but keep the essence of the meanings - mercy without an objective set of standards for judgment is probably an equal threat to an objective set of standards for judgment without mercy - but isn't an essence of our faith that justice will be tempered by divine mercy?

[son_of_angels]

[quote], fundamentalism, if it does exist, does not come from the most religious Catholics, but from another source.

This other source is liberalism. How often in the liberal Catholic media are we encouraged to cast off our "devotions" and "traditional pieties?" How often are we told that Vatican II ended the use of a truly beautiful, formulaic liturgy? It is from liberals in the Catholic Church that we find the "fundamentalist" notions espoused in many protestant churches most held aloft. Of course, the only difference is that Catholic liberals don't promise, in lieu of all the devotions and pieties, a personal relationship with our Lord. They promise instead a "social justice" gospel or a promise of "peace." What malarky, that they ignore Christ's warnings, "The poor you will always have with you" and "I come not to bring peace but a sword" and "you hear wars and rumours of wars" but that we must not be troubled for "that all things be fulfilled" this must come before the "last days." Protestant fundamentalists do promise such a relationship, as also do (if they have truly advanced through these into a vibrant spirituality) Catholic faithful.
[/quote]

I just thought I needed to make my point again. Liberalism IS Catholic fundamentalism.

[Lounge Daddy]

[quote name='son_of_angels' date='Dec 25 2005, 03:23 AM']I just thought I needed to make my point again.  Liberalism IS Catholic fundamentalism.
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liberlaism is NOT Catholic fundamentalism...
liberalism would be a social/political lable, would it not
the Church is concirned with "Orthodox" and "Heterodox" -- isn't it?

or do we just have a difference in definition?

[Lounge Daddy]

[quote]  I cant stand Liberalism, I hate even the word.[/quote]
me too

[photosynthesis]

when I think of Fundamentalism in relationship to Socrates' poll, I thought of Protestant fundamentalists.... the Jack Chick types who think that the Holy Catholic Church is the whore of babylon and that Catholics are going to burn in hell.

Whereas when I think of Liberals I think of people who don't believe in hell (or heaven) and don't acknowledge that the Scriptures are true. One group misinterprets Scripture, the other group chooses to be ignorant because they are afraid of the truth. Protestants Fundamentalists are fiercely intolerant of people from different faiths and they lack charity, and Liberals sugar coat everything. They preach tolerance, but they're only tolerant of people who share their views.

The Church must not give in to either way of thinking... We must never tolerate sin, but be charitable and loving toward the sinner. We must hold on to our beliefs, but not abuse others who don't believe. The Church has the truth.... fundamentalists and liberals don't.