Era Might Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 (edited) I would add that I support the drinking age. Most 18 year olds are not mature Catholics, and it is wise to curb alcohol consumption. But, as I said, the law was made for man, and there can be legitimate exceptions, in tune with the spirit of the law. Remember the example given by the Lord, about Moses eating grain I think on the Sabbath. Edited December 12, 2005 by Era Might Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laudate_Dominum Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 [quote name='Era Might' date='Dec 11 2005, 11:29 PM']I would add that I support the drinking age. Most 18 year olds are not mature Catholics, and it is wise to curb alcohol consumption. But, as I said, the law was made for man, and there can be legitimate exceptions, in tune with the spirit of the law. Remember the example given by the Lord, about Moses eating grain I think on the Sabbath. [right][snapback]821276[/snapback][/right] [/quote] :applause: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam42 Posted December 12, 2005 Author Share Posted December 12, 2005 [quote name='Era Might' date='Dec 12 2005, 01:24 AM']A. I disagree. "What is life to a man who is without wine?" The Scripture calls alcohol the "life" of man. Life is a great good. B/C. We will have to disagree. As the Lord said, the law was made for man, not man for the law. Wine was also made for man, and there is nothing immoral about it. St. Thomas noted that a burdensome law can be disobeyed, absent scandal or grievous wrong. The prohibition of "life" (aka wine), in the private life of responsible adult, is undue. As for scandal, I would not say anyone seeing you consuming alcohol is scandal, but the consideration that they would be grievously scandalized. D. I will disagree about the nature of a Liturgical law and the legal age for alcohol consumption. They are incongruous. But if your conscience says you must follow the letter of the law at all times, do what you feel you must do. Incidentally, the Eastern Churches abide by the principle of oikonomia, the spirit of the law. Canon Law, for example, is a guide, rather than an absolute demand. No, my position, like most moral questions, isn't black and white. Which is why every man must discern difficult questions for himself, with the guidance of the Church, and, as I said, a trusted Priest. [right][snapback]821271[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Scripture doesn't call alcohol a great good. It calls wine a great good. It is a fallacy to equate that wine=life=alcohol=life. Alcohol is, AT BEST, a by product of the process by which wine is made. I would like for you to show me where it says that Scripture says SPECIFICALLY, alcohol=life. It doesn't. It is a real stretch to make that move. Speaking to that point, the alcoholic content in the ancient world is not the important issue. So much so, that it is understood that alcoholic beverages were cut with water to dilute the potency of the drink. That is why wine is cut with water during the Mass. So, I assert that it is the fallacy of ignoring a common cause to assert that wine=life, therefore alcohol=life. Precisely because wine (A) is taken to be the cause of alcoholic content (B) when there is, in fact, a third factor (fermentation process) that is the cause of both wine (A) and the alcoholic content (B). Nope. You are wrong. Alcohol is not the great good, wine is. Alcohol is simply a by product of the fermentation process which creates the good, which is wine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam42 Posted December 12, 2005 Author Share Posted December 12, 2005 [quote name='Era Might' date='Dec 12 2005, 01:29 AM']I would add that I support the drinking age. Most 18 year olds are not mature Catholics, and it is wise to curb alcohol consumption. But, as I said, the law was made for man, and there can be legitimate exceptions, in tune with the spirit of the law. Remember the example given by the Lord, about Moses eating grain I think on the Sabbath. [right][snapback]821276[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I am glad that you agree with my position. We agree about the support of the drinking age. And we agree that most 18 year olds are not mature enough. And we agree that it is wise to curb alcohol consumption. And we agree that the law was made for man, not vice versa. And we agree that there can be legitimate exceptions, which I have also spoken to (medicinal use). However, simply allowing an underage person to drink because he is subjectively thought to be mature enough is not a sufficent and legitimate reason. I do remember why Moses was allowed to eat grain on the Sabbath. I believe that it was a matter of life and death. I don't believe that allowing a underage person to drink socially is a matter of life and death. However, it is good to see that we agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homeschoolmom Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 How did this thread end up discussing underage drinking? That thread was closed! The topic of [i]this[/i] thread is "Is alcohol a drug?" Discuss! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laudate_Dominum Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 [quote name='homeschoolmom' date='Dec 12 2005, 06:44 AM']How did this thread end up discussing underage drinking? That thread was closed! The topic of [i]this[/i] thread is "Is alcohol a drug?" Discuss! [right][snapback]821365[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I agree.. The underage drinking discussion belongs in a pub. Preferrably in a country which would allow Jeff and Al to be served. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homeschoolmom Posted December 12, 2005 Share Posted December 12, 2005 And with that, we will bid this thread adieu. To celebrate, the drinks are on me! Chocolate milk for EVERYONE!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 You know, I was just thinking about this thread and how utterly idiotic Cam was being in it, and how stupid it was to close it when things were still unresolved. Getting drunk is fun, I don't care what anyone says. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 Baileys Irish Cream ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Extra ecclesiam nulla salus Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 just to add a little something: most trads have no problem with underage drinking. *please don't responsed with we are not trads because i know that. it was just an interesting fact* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homeschoolmom Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 PLEASE don't open threads that I close. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 no one asked the advice of the [mod]hey, play nice -cmom[/mod] trad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Extra ecclesiam nulla salus Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 why does a regulator, have to moderate another regulator from insulting me? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
homeschoolmom Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 Al... KNOCK it OFF. quit opening closed thread. And if you just upped Cam's warning level, I am going to have to speak to you in private.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted April 1, 2006 Share Posted April 1, 2006 : yeah right, miss [mod]personal attack -Az[/mod] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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