Seven77 Posted December 2, 2003 Share Posted December 2, 2003 A few weeks ago a JW came and he started talking about REV. and the 144,000 etc... after inviting him in the house i brought up the Eucharist and John 6 and kept bringing it back to the Eucharist. He's coming back tomorrow after reading up on it. I've been reading/studying Beginning Apologetics 1,2,3 by Fr. Chacon <spelling?> and Jim Burham. i think my notes are good on the Eucharist, Divinity of Jesus and i read about 144000 [they believe only 144000 are in Heaven while everyone else will have to be happy on a paradise on earth deprived of the Beatific Vision.. i really feel sorry for the JWs.). Anybody got any last minute tips? Please pray for me! Please pray for Mr. JML! Please do some small penance.. ! Peace God bless, 777 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God Conquers Posted December 2, 2003 Share Posted December 2, 2003 haha, I thaought this said talking to JEWS at first. Sorry, I don't know about talking to JW's. Beware, their bible is different than ours and carelessly (on purpose) translated. Also, you may find that you discussion is fruitless and you get frustrated. I hope this is not so, but remember to pray for them before hand. Those who do not have the spirit within them can not understand the things of the spirit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.SIGGA Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 Next time JWs comes to your door tell them to stop preaching their religion so they can be sure to be one of the 144,000. I wouldn't want to deprive them of being saved :P Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmjtina Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 Next time JWs comes to your door tell them to stop preaching their religion so they can be sure to be one of the 144,000. I wouldn't want to deprive them of being saved here is an article from Catholic Answers: http://www.catholic.com/library/are_they_a..._watchtower.asp and here are questions I found at NewAdvent hope it helps: :D What's a good way to steer a conversation with Jehovah's Witnesses who come to my door? Focus on John 6. This seems to do it every time--or, more properly, it seems to do something every time, and the something can be one of two things. If you're fortunate, your discussion of that chapter--it's the one in which Jesus promises the Eucharist and states emphatically that what appears to be bread and wine really will be his body and blood--will throw the Jehovah's Witnesses for a loop. Focus on Jesus' repetition; over and over he said we're to eat his flesh and drink his blood, and over and over he failed to tell his listeners he was speaking only metaphorically--for the simple reason that he wasn't. He was speaking literally, and his listeners knew it. First the Jews walked away, shaking their heads in disbelief. Then even some of Jesus' disciples left him, unable to accept the doctrine of the Real Presence. One particular person fell away here: Judas (see verse 64). It was here, in his disbelief in the Real Presence, that Judas first betrayed Christ. Yes, later he would be a thief and a traitor, but this is where his tragedy began. If you go through John 6 slowly, emphasizing what's really going on, the Jehovah's Witnesses will find themselves in a pickle. You'll show them how all the people mentioned in that chapter took Jesus literally--so why shouldn't we? If you bring the missionaries this far, end your exchange with an exhortation. Use the lingo they (and you) have heard elsewhere; they'll identify with it. Tell them they need to read the Bible. Say they should ask "Jehovah God" to give them the light to understand what John 6 really means. Tell them they have to "get right with God," and let them know that means going wherever the truth leads them. Tell them they have to trust God and follow him wherever he may lead them, even if that is somewhere they think they'd rather not go. All the above explains what happens if you're fortunate in you discussion with the Witnesses. Of course, things may go wrong--not drastically, not dangerously, but annoyingly. You may find that your consideration of John 6 produces no impression at all on the missionaries. If so, wait for their return and try again. My wife is studying with Jehovah's Witnesses, and they have convinced her that celebrating birthdays is a pagan custom and not something Christians should do. She refuses to allow our children to celebrate their birthdays. What should I do? Birthday celebrations are mentioned only a few times in Scripture, and nowhere are they condemned. Witnesses wrongly assume that celebrating birthdays is evil because the only two explicit biblical mentions of birthday celebrations are those in honor of a pagan, Pharaoh (Gen. 40:20-22), and a wicked man, Herod Antipas (Mark 6:21; cf. Matt. 14:1-12). To compound the issue, King Herod's birthday festivities were the occasion of sexual immorality involving the daughter of his brother's wife, Herodias, and led to the murder of John the Baptist. Witnesses wrongly reason that, because these biblical occurrences depict the celebrations of the births of wicked men, celebrating anyone's birthday is in itself sinful. You can demonstrate that this does not logically follow by showing that the Bible says that the birthday of John the Baptist would be the cause of "joy and gladness, and many will rejoice at his birth for he will be great in the sight of the Lord" (Luke 1:14-15). While this passage does not explicitly mention an annual celebration of John the Baptist's birth, it certainly allows for such an interpretation and at the very least demonstrates that it is good to celebrate the birth of a holy person. Why won't Jehovah's Witnesses accept blood transfusions, even when their lives are in jeopardy? Mainly because their founder, Charles Taze Russell, scrambled to come up with a unique set of doctrines that would stand out from the pack. He didn't seem to care which biblical teachings he embraced and which he rejected, so long as the resulting doctrinal pastiche would be exotic. Rejecting blood transfusions on "biblical" grounds is one of the odd tenets that make the Watchtower a truly odd organization. Witnesses cite two verses as bases for their position: "You shall eat no blood whatever, whether of fowl or of animal, in any of your dwellings. Whoever eats any blood, that person shall be cut off from his people" (Lev. 7:26-27); "For the life of every creature is the blood of it; therefore I have said to the people of Israel, You shall not eat the blood of any creature, for the life of every creature is its blood; whoever eats it shall be cut off" (Lev. 17:14). Besides being inconsistent by retaining this particular Old Covenant prohibition while ignoring others, such as circumcision (cf. Gen. 17:2-14) and kosher dietary laws (cf. Deut. 14:3-21), Witnesses misunderstand what these passages are talking about. In both Leviticus 7 and 17 the prohibition is against the eating of blood, not reception of blood through transfusions (a medical procedure which was developed only within the last century). Witnesses ignore the fact that in a single passage in Leviticus the Lord prohibits the eating of both blood and fat: "It shall be a perpetual statute throughout your generations, in all your dwelling places, that you eat neither fat nor blood" (3:17). Yet the Watchtower does not condemn the eating of fat, and no Jehovah's Witness would feel any moral compunction against eating a bag of fried pork rinds or enjoying a nice, fatty cut of prime rib. This is a good example of the Watchtower's selective "theology." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmjtina Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 let us know what happened!!!!!!!! ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katholikos Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 I like to challenge their name -- they seldom if ever hear this. They are very big on calling God by the right name (i.e., Jehovah). But the scholars who translated the Revised Standard Version (a Protestant Bible) say: "The form "Jehovah" is of late medieval origin; it is a combination of the consonants of the Divine Name and the vowels attached to it by the Masoretes but belonging to an entirely different word. The sound of Y is represented by J and the W by V, as in Latin. For two reasons the Committee [of RSV translators] has returned to the more familiar usage of the King James Version: (1) the word "Jehovah" does not accurately represent any form of the Name ever used in Hebrew,and (2) the use of any proper name for the one and only God, as though there were other gods from whom He had to be distinguished, was discontinued in Judaism before the Christian era and is entirely inappropriate for the universal faith of the Christian Church." The RSV scholars further say that "it is almost but not quite certain that the Name was pronounced "Yahweh." From the Preface to the RSV They're stymied when I ask them where we got the Bible. May God be with you! JMJ Likos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VeraMaria Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 Please do some small penance.. ! Peace God bless, 777 i will. i broke my ankle sailing today :ph34r: . i'll offer up some of the pain for u and mr. JML!!!!! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 here's a great site that helps: Questions, Questions, Questions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phatcatholic Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 as in almost every apologetics occasion, dave armstrong's Biblical Evidence webpage is very helpful. in his "Heresies, Occult, and New Age Movement" section, found here: http://ic.net/~erasmus/RAZ159.HTM he has a section on Jehovah's Witnesses. this should be very helpful. pax christi, nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vectoris Lux Lucis! Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 One thing that might help you is that it is a firm teaching of Jehovah's witness that hell does not exist. You may find that to be funny, and I did too the first time I learned it, but it's true and extremely false according to scripture- and can be proved quite easily. You might bring that up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seven77 Posted December 3, 2003 Author Share Posted December 3, 2003 wow! thanks alot Pham! those sites really help! will let yall know how it goes... he's coming at around 1pm east thanks Vera, that is a great thing you are doing... God bless you for it! and may He choose to allivieate <sp> some of the pain. God bless you all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phatcatholic Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 make sure you tell us how it goes, Seven Good Luck and God Bless, nick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paladin D Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 Isn't the RSV used by Catholics? Or did we use the translation but included our 7 books in it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katholikos Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 Recommended: Answering Jehovah's Witnesses by Jason Evert, published by Catholic Answers in 2001 (888)291-8000 (to order) www.catholic.com Evert is on staff at Catholic Answers and is really a great young apologist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLAZEr Posted December 3, 2003 Share Posted December 3, 2003 I recommend hiding behind your couch and making your kids get down on the ground and whisper until they go away. That's what we used to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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