Does anyone know the details on...

[Aloysius]

: you rule! you're gonna have to help us plan our betrothal ceremony! I might be willing to break my full PM anonyminity for a few choice people on this most special occasion. my fiance is also excited by this concept of betrothal, and I didn't even tell her about the not being allowed to marry her sister or mother thing yet!

[jmjtina]

Al, I hope I'm on that select few!!!!

Let us know if you do it and tell us about it!!!!!!!!!!!

peace out my brother!!!

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='Aloysius' date='Sep 2 2005, 12:44 AM']: you rule!  you're gonna have to help us plan our betrothal ceremony!  I might be willing to break my full PM anonyminity for a few choice people on this most special occasion.  my fiance is also excited by this concept of betrothal, and I didn't even tell her about the not being allowed to marry her sister or mother thing yet!
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I would be greatly honored to assist in any way I can.

I'll be at St. Boniface most Sundays if you ever wanna meet up.

God bless you sir.

[franciscanheart]

[quote name='Luthien' date='Sep 1 2005, 10:36 PM']

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[jmjtina]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' date='Sep 3 2005, 04:31 AM']I would be greatly honored to assist in any way I can.

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me too primo? :

[phatcatholic]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' date='Aug 28 2005, 03:50 AM']phatcatholic:

Here are some links for you:
[url="http://www.catholicculture.org/docs/doc_view.cfm?recnum=2978"]http://www.catholicculture.org/docs/doc_view.cfm?recnum=2978[/url]
[url="http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/02537c.htm"]http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/02537c.htm[/url]
[url="http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09703b.htm"]http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09703b.htm[/url]

Here is the Roman Ritual online: [url="http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Oracle/6782/ritrom1.htm#mat5"]http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Oracle/6782/ritrom1.htm#mat5[/url]

Here is an Eastern Orthodox betrothal ceremony:
[url="http://www.reu.org/public/liturgys/WEDDINGMS.pdf"]http://www.reu.org/public/liturgys/WEDDINGMS.pdf[/url] (It's a PDF file by the way)

Here are some books to lookup at the library if anyone is that curious:
[i]De Benedictionibus[/i] (Libreria Editirice Vaticana, Vatican, 1993, page 79, n. 195)
[i]Book of Blessings[/i], (Liturgical Press, 1989)
Harper Collins Encyclopedia of Catholicism
[i]Preparation for the Sacrament of Marriage[/i], by the Pontifical Council for the Family
[i]The Betrothal Contract in the Code of Canon Law[/i], Chester Wrzaszczak (Washington, D. C.: CUA Press)
[i]The Roman Ritual[/i], Philip T. Weller
[i]Your Engagement Should be in Church[/i], Chester Wrzaszczak (St Louis: The Queen's Work)[right][snapback]702521[/snapback][/right][/quote]
thanks bro!!!

[argent_paladin]

This is why I love phatmass!! I would love to be betrothed (or is it "I would love to betroth?" or "I would love to ply my troth"? Is it active or passive or dependent on gender?)
Anyway, it is awesome. If anyone needs a cantor for their betrothal ceremony, I'd be happy to oblige!

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='argent_paladin' date='Sep 4 2005, 10:48 PM']This is why I love phatmass!! I would love to be betrothed (or is it "I would love to betroth?" or "I would love to ply my troth"?  Is it active or passive or dependent on gender?)
Anyway, it is awesome. If anyone needs a cantor for their betrothal ceremony, I'd be happy to oblige!
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I am utterly convinced that it is the only way to go.. Booklet to come out soon (or someday at least). I'm too busy.
I guess if I spent my phatmass time writing it I would be done in no time. hehe

I'll work on it some tonight..

[Laudate_Dominum]

[Theoketos]

Dude, I want to help. I think this could be a big hit in the Spanish Community if it is not already.

[IcePrincessKRS]

[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' date='Aug 27 2005, 04:05 AM']It is a type of engagement. The difference is that a standard engagement is an [i]intention [/i]to marry, whereas a betrothal is a solemn [i]promise[/i], before the Church, and blessed by the Church.

I think that it is fine to be engaged for six months and then get married, but I think if an engaged couple has to wait for a year or two before they can marry (maybe for practical reasons or something), they ought to consider getting betrothed.
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I wish we'd known about this when we got engaged. We had a year and a half long wait. I say Rock On to everyone who can do it and does do it now! :

And HOW AWESOME would these be as wedding bands? I know some people who have something similar.
[url="http://www.celtarts.com/rings.htm"]http://www.celtarts.com/rings.htm[/url]

Still looking for stuff on blessing the marriage bed, so far the only pertinent bit I've found is this:

[quote]As late as 1194 we find a record of a wedding celebration in Ardres, France where the priest was called in solely to bless the couple, sprinkle them with holy water, and cense the bridal bed (Duby, The Knight 18).[/quote]
[url="http://www.drizzle.com/~celyn/mrwp/mrwed.html"]http://www.drizzle.com/~celyn/mrwp/mrwed.html[/url]

[let_go_let_God]

Wow this is amazing. I spent part of my day with my boyfriend and he asked me "How long would you want to date before we might get engaged?" I told him probably no sooner that a year and a half (That would be next march).

If I remember correctly, the church asks that once a couple is engaged they should be married within two years of the start of the engagement; that would put it in the middle of my student teaching at the latest. By reading this, a betrothal would allow us to wait a bit longer untill I'm out of school. This is so awesome! I think that I need to send this to my boyfriend..... he really needs to join the pham.


[quote name='Laudate_Dominum' date='Aug 25 2005, 08:53 PM']2. Pursuit of higher education is contemplated by one or both of the contractants. Experience points to the hardships, material and moral, accompanying student husbands, wives and parents.
[/quote]


God bless-
LGLG

[IcePrincessKRS]

I just shared this with LD, but how cool is THIS? Its part of Czech marriage tradition:

"Before the marriage vows take place an infant is laid on the couple's bed, to bless and enhance their fertility."

[Laudate_Dominum]

[quote name='IcePrincessKRS' date='Sep 6 2005, 12:36 AM']I just shared this with LD, but how cool is THIS? Its part of Czech marriage tradition:

"Before the marriage vows take place an infant is laid on the couple's bed, to bless and enhance their fertility."
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I like the thing about incensing the wedding bed.

[Laudate_Dominum]

I just had this crazy idea of creating a website and apostolate which includes promotion of betrothal (or solemn engagement) in the Church (properly discerned of course) as part of its mission.

The booklet may just be the beginning...

Do you think this is enough to have a complete apostolate? It could be about providing information, advice, suggestions, recommendations, counsel, etc.. for Catholic lovers.

I know there are plenty of sites out there about chastity and one more couldn't hurt, but it would have a totally different feel. There are so many issues out there that don't even get discussed, and dating/courtship and engagement within the Church ought to be emphasized for Catholics.

Anyway.. just a thought.