another thread on exorcisms.......

[infinitelord1]

i must admit that the whole idea of graments and objects blessed by priests does seem a bit primeval to me. I think its a strange, mystical belief. Do you really believe that a child molester could grant an item the power of god? Not to say all priests are child molesters........but im sure it has happened were a priest was and blessed an object like this.

[Fidei Defensor]

[quote name='infinitelord1' date='Aug 12 2005, 06:41 PM']i must admit that the whole idea of graments and objects blessed by priests does seem a bit primeval to me. I think its a strange, mystical belief. Do you really believe that a child molester could grant an item the power of god? Not to say all priests are child molesters........but im sure it has happened were a priest was and blessed an object like this.
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Blessings, and anything that requires the priest to be the minister, is not based off of the priest's personal holiness. It is God working through the priest. So a blessing of an object or person, is simply God working through the priest, so no matter what the state of his soul is, the blessing is still valid.

[infinitelord1]

so a man, being a priest, can envoke god? specifically by giving an item a power of god?

[Semalsia]

[quote]So a blessing of an object or person, is simply God working through the priest, so no matter what the state of his soul is, the blessing is still valid.[/quote]

Does it have to be a priest? If yes, then why? Wouldn't God be able to work through any person?

[Fidei Defensor]

[quote name='Semalsia' date='Aug 12 2005, 07:01 PM']Does it have to be a priest? If yes, then why? Wouldn't God be able to work through any person?
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Yes, God can work through anyone.

I am going to have to let someone else answer the rest.

[Fidei Defensor]

[quote name='infinitelord1' date='Aug 12 2005, 06:51 PM']so a man, being a priest, can envoke god? specifically by giving an item a power of god?
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Anyone can envoke God. We envoke him when we make the sign of the cross. We can simply envoke him by calling to him. Priests, though, by virtue of their ordination, have been granted the special gift to be able to be a minister of God's blessing. This means that when they bless you, you are actually recieving a blessing directly from God, through the minister.

A priest does not "give an item power of God", but rather, he marks it with a blessing of God. It is this blessing that has the power, not the actual item. One could say, its like carrying around God's blessing, when you have a medal or such blessed by a priest.

[infinitelord1]

[quote name='fidei defensor' date='Aug 12 2005, 08:20 PM']Anyone can envoke God. We envoke him when we make the sign of the cross. We can simply envoke him by calling to him. Priests, though, by virtue of their ordination, have been granted the special gift to be able to be a minister of God's blessing. This means that when they bless you, you are actually recieving a blessing directly from God, through the minister.

A priest does not "give an item power of God", but rather, he marks it with a blessing of God. It is this blessing that has the power, not the actual item. One could say, its like carrying around God's blessing, when you have a medal or such blessed by a priest.
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so i could get a piece of bazooka joe buble gum and have it blessed? what i am getting out of this.........it doesnt matter what the items is.

dont you think that by envoking god that we are demanding that he come to us? Its like a matter of our choice not his.......it seems like.

[Fidei Defensor]

[quote name='infinitelord1' date='Aug 12 2005, 08:26 PM']so i could get a piece of bazooka joe buble gum and have it blessed? what i am getting out of this.........it doesnt matter what the items is.

dont you think that by envoking god that we are demanding that he come to us? Its like a matter of our choice not his.......it seems like.
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I suppose you could have gum blessed, but I dont think there would be any benefit, unless you didnt chew it. The purpose of having blessed items (sacramentals) is to have God's presence with us to remind us of his love. Or in the case of certain medals or items, to show demons that we belong to God, and to help ward them off. Again, though, it is the blessing its self, not the actual item.

When we envoke God's name, we are asking him to come, not necesarily demanding it. I think that God welcomes us to call on him, though.

[infinitelord1]

well, now that you answered all my questions i guess i have nothing more to say about talismans and such.

[Crispy]

this is a very nice article about exorcism in general. WARNING: material and descriptions are rather disheartening. avoid reading at night.

[url="http://www.crisismagazine.com/november2003/hoopes.htm"]The Dark Backward: Demons in the Real World[/url]

[Sarah_JC]

Thanks Crispy, great article.

[Semalsia]

[quote name='Crispy'][url="http://www.crisismagazine.com/november2003/hoopes.htm"]The Dark Backward: Demons in the Real World[/url][/quote]

Creepy story.

[quote name='Demons in the real world']Another victim—a well-known Catholic leader respected for his pragmatism—said, “My most frequent encounters involve black shadows and figures that I see out of the corner of my eye…. I’ll see something in my peripheral vision.[/quote]

Those are demons? Ok, jumping beds I can understands, but really? I mean, even I see shadowy figures all the time (seem to like my bed, hah). Funny that you can never get a good look, isn't it. Just like those whispers that you hear when alone, you can never make out any words. Hardly anything to freak out about. And those are demons?

You know, when I was small I used to be afraid of the dark and those other things (the shadowy figures, the feeling you are being watched), which made sleeping very hard sometimes. I got over that instinct, after realizing and really convincing myself that there is really no one there to harm me. Nowadays I actually like it in the dark.

[qfnol31]

St. Benedict medals only work because of the blessing.

[Fidei Defensor]

[quote name='Semalsia' date='Aug 13 2005, 07:47 PM']Those are demons? Ok, jumping beds I can understands, but really? I mean, even I see shadowy figures all the time (seem to like my bed, hah). Funny that you can never get a good look, isn't it. Just like those whispers that you hear when alone, you can never make out  any words. Hardly anything to freak out about. And those are demons?

You know, when I was small I used to be afraid of the dark and those other things (the shadowy figures, the feeling you are being watched), which made sleeping very hard sometimes. I got over that instinct, after realizing and really convincing myself that there is really no one there to harm me. Nowadays I actually like it in the dark.
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No one can say that, yes, those are demons, or no, just something you imagined. There are many reasons why someone may see things or hear things. Fear itself can produce these effects. That is not to say, though, that it couldnt be demons. Demons do wierd things.

And I also enjoy the darkness. I find it relaxing.

[infinitelord1]

the thought of talismans with the holy spirit in it scares me. Still sounds like a primitive belief. I am sorry.