Aloysius Posted July 24, 2005 Share Posted July 24, 2005 [quote name='RandomProddy' date='Jul 23 2005, 02:55 PM']Whilst I'm not going to argue the finer points of this on this forum, needless to say my old school (with very close connections to the C of E) has a unique view on this. And i'm not going to claim that view was taught to me Possibly, but then the democratic processes involved after the English Civil War, the repercussions of the Treaty of Westphalia and numerous other social upheavals and military actions contributed a lot to the rapidity of the Industrial Revolution. There are still quite a few monarchies in Europe btw. It's just none are even close to having the prestige.... [right][snapback]655868[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I know... and the claim I am making is that if it weren't for the destruction of english monasteries where monks were making incredible advances the industrial revolution would've happened in the sixteenth or seventeenth century. How's that for rapidity of the industrial revolution? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Semperviva Posted July 24, 2005 Author Share Posted July 24, 2005 wow- the poll is split exactly in equal thirds 7 7 7 MUST BE A REALLY PERFECT NUMBER Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jezic Posted July 25, 2005 Share Posted July 25, 2005 there is a feast day of Christ the king and if he is king, i will support a monarchy anyday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oik Posted July 25, 2005 Share Posted July 25, 2005 I clicked null vote. The third option is too general. As long as a ruler is just and moral and a Catholic (assentng,faithful). I however, think the type of government does matter. Centisimus Annus speaks about this. Socialism=No Communism=No Dictatorship=No Class system government=No Populist=No Corrupt Capitalism=No Anarchy=No (which is probably a Duh!) Monarchy would be fine as long as the ruler was moral and just (and some have been). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted July 25, 2005 Share Posted July 25, 2005 Oik, you grouped a lot of apples and oranges together there. some of those are economic systems, some of those are governmental systems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scardella Posted July 25, 2005 Share Posted July 25, 2005 Regarding the French Revolution, there's significant evidence that a lot of what we're taught about the French Revolution is, in fact, erroneous. There's a good book highlighting a good bit of this that I had to read for a French Rev. class. It's unfortunate that I don't still have the notes. It's called [i]The Guillotine and the Cross[/i] by Warren Carroll. Look it up, read it and be amazed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted July 26, 2005 Share Posted July 26, 2005 I like the idea of a private-sector-distributist (economically) monarchy (governmentally) with a strong, widespread, and influential squirearchy (influential over economics and government). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epinephrin Posted July 26, 2005 Share Posted July 26, 2005 [i]We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge, or gallantry, would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.[/i] - [b]John Adams, Oct.11, 1798[/b] [i] Address to the military [/i] The same problems with democracy are the same for monarchy. It's just that it's much easier to corrupt one man holding all the power. God rules very democratically. I don't see why we shouldn't try to fit his image. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ellenita Posted July 26, 2005 Share Posted July 26, 2005 [quote]There are still quite a few monarchies in Europe btw.[/quote] Belgium, Holland and Norway for example... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toledo_jesus Posted July 26, 2005 Share Posted July 26, 2005 Monarchies are open to tyranny of the minority, republics tyranny of the majority. It would be just as bad to have the unwashed masses control a country as it would to have an Emperor Adolf with Lords Goehring, Himmler and Rommel strutting around. Strike a balance so that the power corrupts evenly across the social spectrum... Ultimately, human attempts at government will always be flawed. The only perfect system is one in which the Authority is unimpeachable in all things, and only One has that quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted July 26, 2005 Share Posted July 26, 2005 [quote name='epinephrin' date='Jul 25 2005, 08:04 PM'][i]We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge, or gallantry, would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.[/i] - [b]John Adams, Oct.11, 1798[/b] [i] Address to the military [/i] The same problems with democracy are the same for monarchy. It's just that it's much easier to corrupt one man holding all the power. God rules very democratically. I don't see why we shouldn't try to fit his image. [right][snapback]658806[/snapback][/right] [/quote] God rules as an absolute monarch, the King of kings and Lord of lords. How in the heck can you say he rules democratically? God doesn't rule democratically at all. that was a very shallow critique of monarchies. Democracy follows the whims of the people, Monarchy is generally ruled by rigid tradition and strong landowners (which is why I said there should be a large and influential squirearchy (landowners)). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epinephrin Posted July 26, 2005 Share Posted July 26, 2005 [quote name='Aloysius' date='Jul 25 2005, 08:07 PM']God rules as an absolute monarch, the King of kings and Lord of lords. How in the heck can you say he rules democratically? God doesn't rule democratically at all.[/quote] He's certainly the Man, but we've been known to have free will at times... [quote]that was a very shallow critique of monarchies. Democracy follows the whims of the people, Monarchy is generally ruled by rigid tradition and strong landowners (which is why I said there should be a large and influential squirearchy (landowners)). [right][snapback]658814[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I'm not proud to say it, but we've seen by our past Popes how well that's held up. Popes became corrupt not because they represented religious leaders, but because they represented people wielding power they were not yet responsible enough for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aloysius Posted July 26, 2005 Share Posted July 26, 2005 a monarch doesn't forbid free will. God doesn't let the people have any say in how He rules the Universe, therefore He is a Monarch. He will grant favors to those who request them of Him (prayer) as any good monarch would, but all governing power over the universe is reserved to His Choice.. <disclaimer: I am not calling God a butterfly> If you really delve into history, you'll see that trouble-making monarchs tend to be more the exception than the rule. When tradition and land-owners are able to be the check to the monarch, it works out quite well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
toledo_jesus Posted July 26, 2005 Share Posted July 26, 2005 [quote name='Aloysius' date='Jul 25 2005, 08:18 PM']a monarch doesn't forbid free will. God doesn't let the people have any say in how He rules the Universe, therefore He is a Monarch. He will grant favors to those who request them of Him (prayer) as any good monarch would, but all governing power over the universe is reserved to His Choice.. <disclaimer: I am not calling God a butterfly> If you really delve into history, you'll see that trouble-making monarchs tend to be more the exception than the rule. When tradition and land-owners are able to be the check to the monarch, it works out quite well. [right][snapback]658831[/snapback][/right] [/quote] You mean when the monarch realizes if he messes around he won't have people dressing him anymore, and he decides not to rock the boat. I'm not convinced a monarchy in human hands is all that great. I like the American system of government, as it splits the power up and renders dictatorship somewhat less attainable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
epinephrin Posted July 26, 2005 Share Posted July 26, 2005 [quote name='Aloysius' date='Jul 25 2005, 08:18 PM']a monarch doesn't forbid free will. God doesn't let the people have any say in how He rules the Universe, therefore He is a Monarch. He will grant favors to those who request them of Him (prayer) as any good monarch would, but all governing power over the universe is reserved to His Choice..[/quote] Point made. [quote]If you really delve into history, you'll see that trouble-making monarchs tend to be more the exception than the rule. When tradition and land-owners are able to be the check to the monarch, it works out quite well. [right][snapback]658831[/snapback][/right][/quote] Nevertheless, there have been many, and some especially bad corrupt monarchs. And, even then, power is put into the hands of a select ruling class, all with similar interests, who are can have an appetite for corruption. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now