Semalsia Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 [quote name='jasjis']We are not small willed animals. We can direct our will and choose our actions, even over our natural instinct.[/quote] Yes, behavior can be changed. Gays can have sex with the opposite sex, it's quite easy actually. But whether he/she likes it or not, depends on the sexual orientation. Just like straight people can have sex with the same sex, but will probably dislike it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rckllnknny Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 fidei.. quote..The word of God is universal, and speaks a glorious language. true. quote..not a matter of personal interpretation, or based on how you feel that day. ..evidence or proof of existing indifferential matters of interpretation...different denominations. ..come on.. that one was obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasJis Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 [quote name='Semalsia' date='Jul 14 2005, 06:37 PM'][quote name='jasjis']We are not small willed animals. We can direct our will and choose our actions, even over our natural instinct.[/quote] Yes, behavior can be changed. Gays can have sex with the opposite sex, it's quite easy actually. But whether he/she likes it or not, depends on the sexual orientation. Just like straight people can have sex with the same sex, but will probably dislike it. [right][snapback]643704[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Ah-ha! You've opened the door to changing or re-inforcing behavior based on concsience and sub-conscience perceptions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 [quote name='rckllnknny' date='Jul 14 2005, 06:39 PM']fidei.. quote..The word of God is universal, and speaks a glorious language. true. quote..not a matter of personal interpretation, or based on how you feel that day. ..evidence or proof of existing indifferential matters of interpretation...different denominations. ..come on.. that one was obvious. [right][snapback]643709[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Im not quite sure what you are getting at here, but I honestly dont care about anything to do with denominations. The Christian faith has none. There is one Lord, and one faith. We were given one faith. Any "denomination" of christianity is due to the rejection of legit authority and proclaiming one's self as the ultimate authority to what Jesus' message was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rckllnknny Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 (edited) jas..open window is a better way of looking at it. but if we could all look at it together and see we can look at it in the light of every possible way together at the same time. we would experience the virtous co-existance as harmonious balance. and all would be enlightend into the greater peace of which is God. but we are limited on a spectrum of time, but not by unlimited space. which is fulfilled by the prophecies of our Father who speaks only one language..which is..LOVE. THAT..unconditonal..is our common(sometimes hidden) bond...that we may always agree on. Edited July 14, 2005 by rckllnknny Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rckllnknny Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 ...which is Jesuss message. AMEN. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infinitelord1 Posted July 14, 2005 Share Posted July 14, 2005 [quote name='Semalsia' date='Jul 14 2005, 06:37 PM'][quote name='jasjis']We are not small willed animals. We can direct our will and choose our actions, even over our natural instinct.[/quote] Yes, behavior can be changed. Gays can have sex with the opposite sex, it's quite easy actually. But whether he/she likes it or not, depends on the sexual orientation. Just like straight people can have sex with the same sex, but will probably dislike it. [right][snapback]643704[/snapback][/right] [/quote] you have to ask yourself though.........and i am asking you personally semalsia, why cant you have sex with a man and enjoy it? If you are thinking because you are gay.........then that is not an answer since we dont know if people are genetically or physically in some way determined to be gay at birth. This is not enough reason to believe that you are gay and you cant change. This concept is based off of your own persception and feelings of reality. From a christian perspective, we have free will and we can change the way we are if we put effort into it, and if we desire it. "If you asketh you will recieveth". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Semalsia Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 [quote name='jasJis']Ah-ha! You've opened the door to changing or re-inforcing behavior based on concsience and sub-conscience perceptions.[/quote] You are confusing me. I thought I just stated the obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photosynthesis Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 [quote name='rckllnknny' date='Jul 14 2005, 08:34 PM']photo. except..your last sentence. i believe..faith alone, by grace, is the only way you will ever fall away from sin and lead you to Gods glorious good works. fidei..LOL..i understand. but it was the topic at hand that was relative. i already KNOW that you disagree. [right][snapback]643700[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Faith without works is dead. Jesus said that it is not enough to cry out "Lord, Lord." We need to do the will of Our Father. God remembers all of our good deeds and will reward us for them at the Last Judgment. St. Paul said in 1 Corinthians 13, that even if you have faith to move mountains, it is nothing without Love. You can speak in tongues, and miracles can be done through you, but without Love, it is worth nothing to God. Obviously belief is an important element of salvation, but as Bro. Adam's quote thingy says, "you can't preach creme and live skim milk." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infinitelord1 Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 semalsia, seriously........why cant you have relations with a man and like it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photosynthesis Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 [quote name='infinitelord1' date='Jul 14 2005, 09:14 PM']semalsia, seriously........why cant you have relations with a man and like it? [right][snapback]643794[/snapback][/right] [/quote] that is a really inappropriate thing to say to someone. The Church doesn't teach that people with same-sex attraction need to be attracted to members of the opposite sex. In fact, if you read Fr. Benedict Groeschel's book, The Courage to be Chaste, he emphasizes chaste celibacy as the best way to overcome same-sex attraction. It is very hard to change sexual orientation, which (depending on what you think) develops throughout one's lifespan. It's very hard to undo 12, 20, 40 years of sexual development. all people, including homosexuals are called to follow Jesus and embrace God's will for them. That does not necessarily involve matrimony. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 [quote name='photosynthesis' date='Jul 14 2005, 07:21 PM']that is a really inappropriate thing to say to someone. The Church doesn't teach that people with same-sex attraction need to be attracted to members of the opposite sex. In fact, if you read Fr. Benedict Groeschel's book, The Courage to be Chaste, he emphasizes chaste celibacy as the best way to overcome same-sex attraction. It is very hard to change sexual orientation, which (depending on what you think) develops throughout one's lifespan. It's very hard to undo 12, 20, 40 years of sexual development. all people, including homosexuals are called to follow Jesus and embrace God's will for them. That does not necessarily involve matrimony. [right][snapback]643809[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I know where this is going to go from here, and I suggest, photosynthesis, that you brace yourself. I have been in this discussion with him before, and its not a pretty one. No offense meant to you, infinitelord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
infinitelord1 Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 (edited) im sorry i dont see it as inappropriate at all. Sex is not an innappropriate thing if it is used in its correct context. It is a natural process in which god intended for love. My question is valid........if semalsia doesnt want to answer them that is fine. She can express her opinion that she doesnt want to talk about it........and i will respect that. They certainly dont need to be attracted to the opposite sex i agree........where i am going with this is.........my opinion is that they can if they want to.......most homosexuals feel they cant........my mother is a homosexual.........she will testify that she had feelings for the opposite sex..........so have i. Edited July 15, 2005 by infinitelord1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fidei Defensor Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 [quote name='infinitelord1' date='Jul 14 2005, 08:00 PM']im sorry i dont see it as inappropriate at all. Sex is not an innappropriate thing if it is used in its correct context. It is a natural process in which god intended for love. My question is valid........if semalsia doesnt want to answer them that is fine. She can express her opinion that she doesnt want to talk about it........and i will respect that. They certainly dont need to be attracted to the opposite sex i agree........where i am going with this is.........my opinion is that they can if they want to.......most homosexuals feel they cant........my mother is a homosexual.........she will testify that she had feelings for the opposite sex..........so have i. [right][snapback]643856[/snapback][/right] [/quote] But see, the point is, someone with SSA cant willfully have meaningful feelings for the opposite sex for the purpose of a relationship and marriage, ultimately leading to sex. If they could, then this whole debate about SSA is useless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
photosynthesis Posted July 15, 2005 Share Posted July 15, 2005 [quote name='infinitelord1' date='Jul 14 2005, 10:00 PM']my opinion is that they can if they want to... [right][snapback]643856[/snapback][/right] [/quote] I disagree with your opinion. Regardless of whether homosexuality is genetic, environmental or both, sexual orientation is not a conscious choice. It is possible for homosexuals to live chaste lives, and I encourage you to look into Courage and other related ministries for you and your mother. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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