Madame Vengier Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 (edited) There are also Koranic texts (or Hadith, sorry I'm not sure which but it's one of them) which give permission for Muslim men to commit rape against "kafir" (infidels, unbelievers) women. Basically, when it comes to the infidels all bets are off. This is not at all diffcult to imagine when you understand that some of the teachings of Islam lower infidels to the status of animals (apes and pigs). In some sense the ideology is similar to that of the Nazis, who dehumanized the Jews in order to be able to torture and kill them. This deals in the psychological realm as well as the spiritual. I'm not smart enough to explain this--maybe someone will come along and do a better job--but there is something about the natural inability to do harm to another human being. Somehow, the human has to be DE-humanized first. It's the same with rape. Men can rape women when they have begun to see them as something less than human. But in the case of Islam it is a total theology that extends to all unbelievers. Edited May 23, 2008 by Madame Vengier Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 23, 2008 Author Share Posted May 23, 2008 [quote name='mortify' post='1537924' date='May 22 2008, 06:30 PM']Understand that Muslims regard this Muhammad as the *best* human being that ever lived, as the model for *all* mankind. I shudder at the thought.[/quote] Yes. In the hadith he is portrayed as the exemplar of humanity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mortify Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 [quote name='Apotheoun' post='1537959' date='May 22 2008, 07:48 PM']Yes. In the hadith he is portrayed as the exemplar of humanity.[/quote] The quran itself calls him a model for all mankind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 23, 2008 Author Share Posted May 23, 2008 An excerpt from Steven Runciman's book, [u]The Fall of Constantinople[/u]: "Five days after the fall of the city [the Sultan Mehmet] gave a banquet. In the course of it, when he was well flushed with wine, someone whispered to him that Notaras's fourteen-year old son was a boy of exceptional beauty. The Sultan at once sent a eunuch to the house of the Megadux to demand that the boy be sent to him for his pleasure. Notaras, whose two elder sons had been killed fighting, refused to sacrifice the boy to such a fate. Police were then sent to bring Notaras with his son and his young son-in-law, the son of the Grand Domestic Andronicus Cantacuzenus, into the Sultan's presence. When Notaras still defied the Sultan, orders were given for him and the two boys to be decapitated on the spot. Notaras merely asked that they should be slain before him, lest the sight of his death should make them waver. When they had both perished he bared his neck to the executioner." [page 151] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 23, 2008 Author Share Posted May 23, 2008 An interesting debate. Sadly the majority of the audience holds a position that is contrary to human freedom. [url="http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/1623.htm"][u]Muslim Scholars Debate Apostates in Islam[/u][/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouisvilleFan Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 [quote name='LouisvilleFan' post='1537705' date='May 22 2008, 06:36 PM']Mad V's rackin' up a big ol' ignore list! [mod]--Era Might[/mod][/quote] [quote name='StColette' post='1537774' date='May 22 2008, 07:30 PM']I don't know either lol[/quote] Oh, I thought that was a common enough saying... [mod]--Era Might[/mod] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 23, 2008 Author Share Posted May 23, 2008 [quote name='LouisvilleFan' post='1538047' date='May 22 2008, 07:33 PM']Oh, I thought that was a common enough saying... [mod]--Era Might[/mod][/quote] This post is off topic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouisvilleFan Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 [quote name='Madame Vengier' post='1537825' date='May 22 2008, 08:31 PM']And out of all those people I have 5 on ignore. I don't see what the big deal is.[/quote] Strangely, hardly anyone finds it necessary to put even one person on ignore, much less five. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 23, 2008 Author Share Posted May 23, 2008 [quote name='LouisvilleFan' post='1538053' date='May 22 2008, 07:35 PM']Strangely, hardly anyone finds it necessary to put even one person on ignore, much less five.[/quote] I have never put a person on ignore, but your post has nothing to do with the topic of this thread. I will report any further off topic posts to the moderators. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 23, 2008 Author Share Posted May 23, 2008 [url="http://www.memritv.org/clip/en/0/0/0/0/0/0/1775.htm"][u]Leader of the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine - General Command, Ahmad Jibril, Salutes Suicide Bombers and Slams PA Negotiators[/u][/url] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouisvilleFan Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 [quote name='Apotheoun' post='1537856' date='May 22 2008, 08:55 PM']I started this thread so that people in the U.S. could be exposed to the propaganda going out over the airwaves in the Islamic world. I studied Islam as a part of my history degree, and I have become concerned because Americans in particular know nothing about the history of Islam. Americans also seem to be completely oblivious to the destruction of various Christian cultures perpetrated in the name of Mohammad, and which is still going on in parts of the middle east today.[/quote] Thanks for explaining this. Just seeing a bunch of videos posted with explanation about what they are here for smelled of discrimination and racism to me, so I wasn't sure what you were going for. The questions I've asked were honest questions, but clearly Mad V's style of response proved rather ineffective at helping any of us. [quote name='Apotheoun' post='1537933' date='May 22 2008, 09:34 PM']Rape occurred throughout the city, both of women and young girls, and even of boys. They did other acts as well in the Churches in order to make fun of Christ.[/quote] And, if I can ask a question about this... the obvious counter argument from a Muslim is going to be that Christians did the same stuff. How do you show that we're actually different? For every St. Francis, there were a hundred rapists and murderers on "our side." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 23, 2008 Author Share Posted May 23, 2008 The difference is that killing apostates is not a doctrine of Christianity, while it is a doctrine of Islam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouisvilleFan Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 [quote name='Madame Vengier' post='1537902' date='May 22 2008, 09:21 PM'][b]Louisville Fan[/b], this may be good for you if you have the 100 minutes to spare becuase it deals with the questions you have asked, in a straightforward and calm manner. I understand you don't like information that you pereceive as too harsh on Muslims, etc. I understand that, so this may be something more suitable for you.[/quote] I'll watch it over the next few days, but I'll read the [url="http://ourbeacon.com/index.php?p=29296"]rebuttal[/url] that's posted in the comments section. In the process of learning about Catholicism, I checked out everything from Calvinism to Dignity/USA, and I think it's only fair to be as equitable with the various opinions regarding Islam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madame Vengier Posted May 23, 2008 Share Posted May 23, 2008 [quote name='Apotheoun' post='1538054' date='May 22 2008, 08:36 PM']I have never put a person on ignore, but your post has nothing to do with the topic of this thread. I will report any further off topic posts to the moderators.[/quote] Apo, just to let you know (and this will be deleted later, so don't worry) I tried to message you but it said your box was full, so I messaged a moderator who said she would look into it. I suggested/offered that a moderater could come in and delete all this off-topic stuff and streamline the thread back to the way it should be because you were right, this should not have happened. It just might take a day, b/c moderator was busy tonight. Don't worry--this is going to get cleaned up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted May 23, 2008 Author Share Posted May 23, 2008 (edited) [quote name='LouisvilleFan' post='1538068' date='May 22 2008, 07:54 PM']And, if I can ask a question about this... the obvious counter argument from a Muslim is going to be that Christians did the same stuff. How do you show that we're actually different? For every St. Francis, there were a hundred rapists and murderers on "our side."[/quote] Of course there are individuals who have not lived up to the teaching of Christ, and there are even many people who have committed horrible acts in the name of Christ, but their actions do not reflect the teaching of Christ or the Church. In Islam, on the other hand, those who commit these vile acts of depravity are doing so under the command of the Prophet Mohammed as recounted in the book of Jihad in the various hadith collections. Clearly, individuals in both religions can be either good or bad, depending upon their actions, but that is not the central issue; instead, the central issue is that the teachings of Mohammed, as compared to the teachings of Christ recounted in the Gospels, if lived as Mohammed intended, ultimately leads to the deaths of those who object to his fatalistic religion. Edited May 23, 2008 by Apotheoun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now