Socrates Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 [quote name='philothea' date='Jun 24 2005, 05:08 PM']If hot stuff agrees too, I'm heading for the hills. [right][snapback]622086[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Well just let me know if LittleLes agrees. That would indeed be a sign and a wonder! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
philothea Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 [quote name='Socrates' date='Jun 24 2005, 06:32 PM']Well just let me know if LittleLes agrees. That would indeed be a sign and a wonder! [right][snapback]622139[/snapback][/right] [/quote] If [i]that[/i] happens someone has hacked Phatmass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apotheoun Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 [quote name='LittleLes' date='Jun 24 2005, 04:03 PM']Careful now! What prescisely was the sin of Sodom? [right][snapback]622113[/snapback][/right] [/quote] The meaning of the phrase in my post is identical to that given in the tradition of the Church, which was reaffirmed in the CDF Instruction [u]Homosexualitatis Problema[/u], no. 6. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jezic Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 one last question, how does barring people from seminaries for being homosexual solve the problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Socrates Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 [quote name='jezic' date='Jun 24 2005, 08:53 PM']one last question, how does barring people from seminaries for being homosexual solve the problem? [right][snapback]622254[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Hasn't this been explained enough already? No homosexual seminarians, no homosexual priest scandals. People need to start facing the facts and using logic, rather than trying to be politically correct all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC Just Posted June 25, 2005 Author Share Posted June 25, 2005 [quote name='Socrates' date='Jun 24 2005, 09:18 PM']Hasn't this been explained enough already? No homosexual seminarians, no homosexual priest scandals. People need to start facing the facts and using logic, rather than trying to be politically correct all the time. [right][snapback]622289[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Exactly. Some of the bishops need to start using their authority and kick the heterodox out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 [quote name='MC Just' date='Jun 24 2005, 09:20 PM']Exactly. Some of the bishops need to start using their authority and kick the heterodox out. [right][snapback]622291[/snapback][/right] [/quote] See this is where I bristle. Because one has the capacity to sin does not make one heterodox. If a priest chooses to break his vows of celibacy, through hetero or homosexual actions, then he dissents from church teachings and he should be dealt with. I've known chaste and celibate men who struggled with homosexual attractions. They have been good and holy priests. I've known unchaste priests who packed up their girlfriends and moved them to their next assignment with them. I completely disagree that an attraction automatically makes one heterodox. Yes Ap there are sins that cry to heaven. But it is not the inclination that cries to heaven, it is the action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleLes Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 [quote name='MC Just' date='Jun 24 2005, 09:20 PM']Exactly. Some of the bishops need to start using their authority and kick the heterodox out. [right][snapback]622291[/snapback][/right] [/quote] RESPONSE: There's a serious priest shortage now. If those with "heterodox" beliefs were kicked out, how many priests would be left? But more importantly, what about the "heterodox" bishops? Do they get kicked out too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam42 Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 [quote name='LittleLes' date='Jun 25 2005, 08:27 AM']RESPONSE: There's a serious priest shortage now. If those with "heterodox" beliefs were kicked out, how many priests would be left? But more importantly, what about the "heterodox" bishops? Do they get kicked out too? [right][snapback]622769[/snapback][/right] [/quote] They should be rehabilitated....if possible and reconciled to the Church. I disagree with all who say that the "heterodox" should simply be kicked out. That is not the attitude that should be taken. What should be done is rehabilitation. If they cannot be rehabilitated, then they don't need to be kicked out, they have left. There is not a serious priest shortage worldwide. That is a myth perpetuated by the media. There is a shortage in the USA. For years we have sent missionaries out to other lands, perhaps they should now return the favor. Ebb and flow.....it is the nature of the priesthood. There are up times and there are down times.....as with everything else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC Just Posted June 25, 2005 Author Share Posted June 25, 2005 Then what should we do? keep saying "all we need is love" and let the evil people take over? like weve been doing in this country all along? We let the heterodox have their way with our church during the sick and disgusting 60's and 70's and we end up with the worst scandal in our history. It's time to stop using "love, humility and charity" as excuses to sit back and do nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC Just Posted June 25, 2005 Author Share Posted June 25, 2005 [quote name='hot stuff' date='Jun 25 2005, 07:19 AM']See this is where I bristle. Because one has the capacity to sin does not make one heterodox. If a priest chooses to break his vows of celibacy, through hetero or homosexual actions, then he dissents from church teachings and he should be dealt with. I've known chaste and celibate men who struggled with homosexual attractions. They have been good and holy priests. I've known unchaste priests who packed up their girlfriends and moved them to their next assignment with them. I completely disagree that an attraction automatically makes one heterodox. Yes Ap there are sins that cry to heaven. But it is not the inclination that cries to heaven, it is the action. [right][snapback]622766[/snapback][/right] [/quote] i'm talking about those in dissenter groups, priests, nuns and bishops, who somehow think they are going to form a "new church". Also, I'm talking about the liberal minded priests, nuns and bishops. Im not saying certain attractions make one heterodox. I'm saying certain ways of thinking and believing doees. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Eremite Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 Kumbaya my lord. Kumbayaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. Kumbaya my lord. Kumbayaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 I'm disputing how you are defining heterdox. The Church does not teach that inclinations towards sin makes one heterodox. If that were the case, we would all be in big trouble. Those who break their vows of celibacy need to be corrected. Those who abuse their power should be dealt with. To simply say anyone who struggles with a same sex attraction should be declared heterodox and expelled is not the right course of action. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MC Just Posted June 25, 2005 Author Share Posted June 25, 2005 [quote name='Eremite' date='Jun 25 2005, 08:57 AM']Kumbaya my lord. Kumbayaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. Kumbaya my lord. Kumbayaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa. [right][snapback]622826[/snapback][/right] [/quote] lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted June 25, 2005 Share Posted June 25, 2005 [quote name='MC Just' date='Jun 25 2005, 08:56 AM']i'm talking about those in dissenter groups, priests, nuns and bishops, who somehow think they are going to form a "new church". Also, I'm talking about the liberal minded priests, nuns and bishops. Im not saying certain attractions make one heterodox. I'm saying certain ways of thinking and believing doees. [right][snapback]622824[/snapback][/right] [/quote] Well that is a clear distinction that wasn't presented before. And while I agree that attractions don't make one heterodox, the statement was made to "Get rid of the homosexuals" That is too broad a stroke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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