Festival of Praise

[zwergel88]

Its been a while since I have posted here, but I just had a question for all of you...


Last night I was invited to attend something called a "Festival of Praise," so I went and to be perfectly honest it kind of freaked me out. Everyone there was Catholic, but it just didn't seem like a very Catholic thing. At first there was singing with pop rock type songs that had religious lyrics and then there was Adoration however it was unlike any I'd ever been to. A priest walked around with a monstance while the music continued to play, and people were singing and had there hands up in the air and were praying out loud. Afterward, people went up to be "prayer over," and some got really into it, and said that it was something like an out of body experiance.

Now this whole thing made me rather uncomfortable, and so I just sat quietly and didn't much participate. This took place at a Catholic university, but to me it just seemed rather Protestantish in the way people expressed themselves. Now it's worth pointing out that I was raised as a Protestant (I was baptized Catholic, and obviously I am Catholic now), so I have vivid memories of being at Protestant services and seeing people express themselves in exactly the same way, hands raised, praying out loud, and the similarites between those and what took place last night were frightening.

I really hope that I haven't offended anyone. I dont' think that doctrinally there is anything wrong with these festivals, in just seems a little unorthodox to me. Personally, at Adoration I prefer to hear [i]Tantum Ergo[/i] or something like that, and up until last night have only seen people praying quietly and reservedly. As a result I was just a little bit taken back by the whole thing.

Do you guys have any thoughts on this? Does anyone agree that this event doesnt sound completely Catholic in nature?


***If you were at this festival of praise or like to go to them, and I have just completely insulted you, I apologized profusely***


Anna

[zealousrap]

I go to FUS and go to FOP's every month...you must realize that we are a Franciscan charismatic community...you described it very well. You should read some of Scott Hahn's books, he was protestant for years and years before his conversion to Catholicism, and he explains what brought him to the Catholic Church and compared it to the Protestant faith. Mabe that will help you better understand the charismatic nature that you have witnessed. Personally, I find it much easier to express myself to Christ in an animated way, to worship with mind and body. our FESTIVAL of PRAISE...keep in mind those words because that is why we gather, is a very opportune time to do so. I hope I helped in any way.

[Ash Wednesday]

[quote]and said that it was something like an out of body experience[/quote]

Now that seems a little weird. I would hope that nobody's attempting "astral projection" because that's new age nonsense.

I'm not big on the charismatic movement, myself. I'm a Tantum Ergo kind of person, too. I don't know the theological ramifications of it's Catholicity so I withold judgment. But it's still personally not my thing.

I would be interested in hearing what others have to say.

[Mogmog]

I'm with zealousrap on this. It sounds pretty typical of the Charismatic movement. People touched by the Spirit in this movement tend to want to praise their heart out in the fashion you described. If this is happening properly it should not detract from the various sacramental and devotional practices in the Church but indeed fuel one's desire for them. This quote doesn't concern worship style, but it is something John Paul the Great said about the movement in general:

[quote]The emergence of the Renewal following the Second Vatican Council was a particular gift of the Holy Spirit to the Church. It was a sign of a desire on the part of many Catholics to live more fully their Baptismal dignity and vocation as adopted sons and daughters of the Father, to know the redeeming power of Christ our Savior in a more intense experience of individual and group prayer, and to follow the teaching of the Scriptures by reading them in the light of the same Spirit who inspired their writing. Certainly one of the most important results of this spiritual reawakening has been that increased thirst for holiness which is seen in the lives of individuals and in the whole Church.[/quote]

Perhaps it isn't for everyone, but I hope that those who don't share in this experience will be charitable towards those that do.

[IcePrincessKRS]

I know that for the most part the FOPs are totally orthodox, but like Anna and Ash I am really uncomfortable with the Charismatic movement in general. Its not my thing, it makes me feel "protestantish" because I've only ever encountered that sort of thing in a protestant setting until pretty recently (within the past couple years), Catholic worship/prayer has always been much more of a traditional and reverent thing to me. I definately don't mean to degrade or put down anyone who does partake in Charismatic praise and worship, I'm just trying to explain how I feel in that setting and why I don't feel that its for me.

[Fides_et_Ratio]

In a sense... things like FOPs don't bother me. (heck, I own Gregorian Chant and "praise & worshippy" CDs--though I usually hide the latter)

But, the majority of people I know who attend and enjoy FOPs and other charismatic events can be very judgmental and super-sensitive to reactions against it. Also, those whom I know seem to be entirely too dependent upon them and attached to emotions and living on a "spiritual high" to ever make any real progress. And my only real encounter with a priest highly involved in the charismatic type stuff didn't turn out so well... he informed me that he supported it because it "ENTICES people to go to Mass"-- and when I questioned his choice of words, he stood by "entice".

Thus, I am hestitant and critical of it. I don't like FOPs (or really any other charismatic gathering). But that's just my opinion.

[zwergel88]

[quote]I'm not big on the charismatic movement, myself. I'm a Tantum Ergo kind of person, too.[/quote]

[quote]Its not my thing, it makes me feel "protestantish" because I've only ever encountered that sort of thing in a protestant setting until pretty recently[/quote]


I'm glad you guys understand what I mean about these things being a little bit uncomfortable. LIke I said before, it's not that I see anything wrong with them, I just think they're kind of weird.

Thanks for all your thougts guys, I'd still like to hear what others have to say.

[Phikoz]

sometimes these events put too much focus on "feelings". God will not always give you "feelings" so i am afraid that if someone is too dependent on it they will begin to loose faith fast. that is where contemplative prayer and meditiation take over and bring a better discipline to your prayer life and you don't have to always have these "feelings" of God rushing over you.

God is sometimes very subtle.

just my opinion, i am sure these events help a lot of people, i just pray it isnt their only source of prayer.

[Luthien]

Ive been to many charismatic gatherings, and I can see how abuses arise. But, I must say that the thing that changed my faith was adoration of that nature, where the priest processes and music is played, like Steubenville East. It made me realize what the Eucharist really was.
I mean, your parents and priest tell you its the Body of Christ, but when you're 13 years old, you may not fully realize it. After I experienced one of these adorations, my view of my Church was enhanced. I also can say that my faith is not based off of a feeling. I learned that its when the feeling isn't there is when you need to pray hardest. But I still think that this type of praise is not a bad thing.

Just my 0.02 cents...

[jiyoung]

my experience with this stuff is similar to luthien's. it's good, but there's more to Catholicism. for me it was sort of something that brought me into the Church. "enticed" me...hehe. but it's like surface stuff...there are deeper undercurrents, much stronger ones. i think it's beautiful how these are different ASPECTS of faith. i've been favoring quiet adoration and stuff these days, but i like the charismatic stuff too. it's just different levels, i guess.

[jezic]

it seems like they are hit and miss... some people like them some don't. It is alright.

I want to go to one. If that helps any, never been to anything even close though.

The out of body thing is strange, but my only point that i want to add is that it is not total non-sense. There is a lot of heresy in new age stuff, don't get me wrong, but the mind and body are connected and more active than most realize.

FOP's seem cool, but i do agree that some people take it the wrong way and then expect the feeling things to continue and when they don't they loose faith. So it is a two-edged sword.

[zwergel88]

I see what you guys are saying. Maybe what I'm trying to say is that I just do not see the purpose of the form of expression these things take. I don't think that throwing one's hands up in the air, or shouting loud prayful interjections serves any purpose except to draw one's attention toward ones self. It' just seems to me like alot of what goes on a FOP's is just a display or something.

The whole thing just frightens me a bit. When I heard people talking about their experiances after ward it sounded like they were talking about voodoo or something.

Like I said before, I don't mean to offend anyone, I am just trying to make sense out of a strange event.

Edited May 9, 2005 by zwergel88

[Brother Adam]

Hey,

I'd get "A key to the Charismatic Renewal In the Catholic Church" by Msgr. Vincent Walsh. It has the marks from the Church declaring them error free. I just got it, it only is $6 new, and maybe it will help you. I don't necessarily agree with some of the theology, especially 'slain in the spirit' and 'praying in tongues'. The best explanations for it are quite lacking both biblical and traditional evidence. I find losing complete control of your facilities hard to justify. It’s why we denounce drunkenness. But I won’t go so far as to say it is definitely wrong. There are instances when tongues may be exercised within certain biblical guidelines especially that the gift is truly there.

Praise and worship though, the act of lifting your hands in worship is something I don't have a problem with. The point isn't for you to focus on them, the point is for them to worship God, and for you to also worship God. They don't intend for you to be paying particular attention to that act, I don't think.

Edited May 9, 2005 by Brother Adam

[Mickey's_Girl]

Interesting topic! I attended "charismatic" Protestant churches my whole life and was mostly okay with it (the theology presented in my church seemed correct to me, and I figured the rest was a stylistic choice). I was never the *most* demonstrative person, however (I did speak in tongues once, though, and I felt that it was the Holy Spirit).

Now that I'm Catholic (new convert) I think I would be weirded out by a charismatic experience like the one you describe. Not because I think it's wrong, but because I'd feel some serious cognitive dissonance (too much like my old church). That said, I may check something like that out when I've been Catholic for a while.

I don't miss it, but I can see how (especially for cradle Catholics) it would be a "renewal". I think balance is the key: don't give up the substance for the experience. Keep both.

MG

[Nicole8223]

I have been to a lot of FOP's and I was in a prayer community for 8 years that did something like that just about every Friday night. I left the group, for other reasons, but since leaving last August, many things seem different.

I would identify myself as Charismatic in the sense that I am open to the gifts of the Holy Spirit. I believe the same gifts that were given to the Apostles are available to us. The gift of tongues, prophesy, healing, all of these things are real gifts.

I have seen many people who have gone way too far, though. Being a teenager when I got involved, I was heavily influenced by the emotions of the group I was in. I think in many cases, the charismatic renewal has too much warm and fuzzy and not enough basic Catholic truth.

I don't know if I am biased...I had a VERY bad experience in this prayer group, and it has really had a major effect on me.

So, anyway, I do understand what you mean, and while I think that many of the things that happen at the FOPs are valid and real movements of the spirit, I also think it becomes too much if these people don't learn how to experience Christ without raising their hands and praising him out loud.