philothea Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 [quote name='cmotherofpirl' date='May 6 2005, 09:32 PM'] Michael the catechism contains infallible teachings, and the pope called it a sure norm of the faith. Do not argue against the Catechism of the Catholic Church. [/quote] I have seen several arguments against the Catechism here lately. I find it really hard to fathom! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelFilo Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 (edited) However, it is still falliable. But the Catechism isn't the topic at hand, the point is that the Catechism doesn't contain anything that would contradict the constant teaching of the Church, non-Catholic worship is displeasing to God. If it did, then it would really be JPII's word about the Catechism against what past popes have proclaimed... God bless, Mikey Edited May 7, 2005 by MichaelFilo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q the Ninja Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 In which case you follow the current Pontiff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Q the Ninja Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 Michael...I would say that you have a little bit more to learn about the nature of infallibility...Don't throw away the Catechism because it is infallible...This follows what is being discussed in the "Excute Them!" thread. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelFilo Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 The point is irrelevant. This isn't a discipline. This is a matter of Faith. Why would non-Catholic worship be displeasing to God until now? That isn't even developmental... thats just contradictary. My point is, where in the Catechism does it claim that non-Catholic worship is at least "ok" with God. Whether I have something to learn about the Catechism or not is still not important to the fact, it is NOT infalliable. I won't through it out, it is a sure guide to my Faith. However, I cannot accept it as the sole guide to my Faith, and must instead put it up to the constant teachings of the Church. Remember, the Third Fatima secret hints to an apostasy that starts from the top. We must be ever-vigilant. God bless, Mikey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 Michael you are not allowed to pick and choose from the Catechism. Our Holy Father talked about this before you were born. Please be careful of being a "Cafeteria Catholic" The Church states that protestants, Jews and Muslims are afforded a portion of the Truth . However we are talking about Protestant music here. Again I will state that much of Christian music can be removed from Christian worship services. Much of the music does not promote schismatic ideas for the mere fact that much are written about personal faith. Sola Scriptura and Sola Fide cannot apply. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam42 Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 Ok gang, enough railing on Mikey....try building him up and teaching him. He isn't that far from being right....try some teaching and not beating....he is not Littleles. Cam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 Then stick around so we can beat up on you! Please give me a quote where I beat up on the boy. It was not my intent nor do I believe was exhibited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corban711 Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 [quote name='hot stuff' date='May 6 2005, 03:20 PM'] Corban I think you're ok! I believe you may find that the whole "sola fide" argument and "displeasing God" argument has quieted down. Humming El Shaddai is not a grave offense. I could be wrong.. [/quote] thank you kindly same to you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
corban711 Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 back to the original topic...on which protestant christian songs contradict Catholic doctrine...i know there are some that contradict the teachings of the Church out there. i would be willing to bet though, that if you read the lyrics to most any of those songs on that top 25 list you would not find doctrinal problems without reading into the lyrics. for the most part, these songs are simple prayers of praise to God for what He has done for us. and that is very good. but there are SO many different protestant hymns and songs. it could be very easy to pick out a song and say "oh that's not right" and it would be very easy to pick out a song and say "well this one is good and correct theologically too" because most of these songs don't have to do with doctrines they seperated from the Church over. we could have a thousand page thread saying "well what about this song?" from both sides of this issue. and i don't really think this discussion will go very far for that very reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam42 Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 [quote name='hot stuff' date='May 7 2005, 12:22 AM'] Then stick around so we can beat up on you! Please give me a quote where I beat up on the boy. It was not my intent nor do I believe was exhibited. [/quote] Gee....did I say hot stuff stop beating up Mikey? No....don't get mad at me. Teach him if you think that he is wrong...don't just rail him and tell him he is wrong....why is he wrong? Cam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cam42 Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 [quote name='Mrvoll' date='May 3 2005, 06:40 PM'] What non-catholic christian songs contridicts the catholic docturine? Please ignore the spelling [/quote] OK, hot stuff..... Answer that question. That is the topic. Amazing Grace does it as do literally thousands of other Protestant hymns......so what? Answer that question and teach Mikey.... Cam Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 Teach just Mikey? Unless I've misread the thread, Cam Sr could use some teaching on this as well. Most Christian songs don't violate doctrine. Why don't they? Because most of them deal with personal praise of God. God is Infinite Good God's creatures are good because they derive their measure of being from God. [quote]CCC2639 Praise is the form of prayer which recognizes most immediately that God is God. It lauds God for his own sake and gives him glory, quite beyond what he does, but simply because HE IS. It shares in the blessed happiness of the pure of heart who love God in faith before seeing him in glory. By praise, the Spirit is joined to our spirits to bear witness that we are children of God, testifying to the only Son in whom we are adopted and by whom we glorify the Father. Praise embraces the other forms of prayer and carries them toward him who is its source and goal: the "one God, the Father, from whom are all things and for whom we exist."[/quote] Even protestant praise contains a measure of good. Closer Walk with Thee Father I adore You We Come to Praise You etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichaelFilo Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 Thank you. And if it comes from someone who is "outside of the house" they "shall perish", "are unholy", and "have profaned". There is no reason to argue that the songs themselves are not good, because they are. Once it comes from a non-Catholic mouth, then it is no longer pleasing to God. Even if it were just "God is Good" it is a lie, since they reject God's Church. God bless, Mikey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaime Posted May 7, 2005 Share Posted May 7, 2005 Sigh... From UNITATIS REDINTEGRATIO [quote]But in subsequent centuries much more serious dissensions made their appearance and quite large communities came to be separated from full communion with the Catholic Church-for which, often enough, men of both sides were to blame. The children who are born into these Communities and who grow up believing in Christ cannot be accused of the sin involved in the separation, and the Catholic Church embraces upon them as brothers, with respect and affection. For men who believe in Christ and have been truly baptized are in communion with the Catholic Church even though this communion is imperfect.[/quote] And further on [quote]Their faith in Christ bears fruit in praise and thanksgiving for the blessings received from the hands of God. Among them, too, is a strong sense of justice and a true charity toward their neighbor. This active faith has been responsible for many organizations for the relief of spiritual and material distress, the furtherance of the education of youth, the improvement of the social conditions of life, and the promotion of peace throughout the world.[/quote] Their faith in Christ bears fruit in praise and thanksgiving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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