Life Teen Abuses

[jbike]

Foundsheep: Nothing says you have to have your teens stand around the altar or say "The Mass never ends, it must be lived" for the dismissal.

As someone who has 10 years of youth ministry experience, you will be VERY hard pressed to find more orthodox teaching presented in a manor that teens can understand and relate to for the youth meetings after the mass.

You don't even have to call it LT if you don't want as far as I know.

God Bless your ministry!

[foundsheep]

Foundsheep:  Nothing says you have to have your teens stand around the altar or say "The Mass never ends, it must be lived" for the dismissal.

As someone who has 10 years of youth ministry experience, you will be VERY hard pressed to find more orthodox teaching presented in a manor that teens can understand and relate to for the youth meetings after the mass.

You don't even have to call it LT if you don't want as far as I know.

God Bless your ministry!

Thank you. Just got an email from them wanting me to visit a parrish that has it. Im gonna see for my self. A high school program with the exception of confirmation classes is non existent. For a retreat put on by our diocese this past weekend we had 65 junior highscoolers show up and represent for our parrish and on 6 high schoolers.

[Paladin D]

One of my pet peeves with current American culture is how nobody has to grow up.  College kids are expected to have little if any more maturity than high schoolers, and as long as 20 somethings hold a job, we don't expect much of them either.  By the time you hit thirty, you're expected to have a serious "relationship", but not neccessarily planning for the future.  Oh, and you can still party on the weekend (like its 1999!).

The point?  Simple.  People rise, or fall, to the standard that is set for them.  I praise God that LifeTeen is used to draw souls unto Himself.  However, surely teens can learn to worship God in a manner that also teaches them that rules are important, and meant to be followed.  If you want to sing Steven Curtis Chapman, or Amy Grant, or really sappy Jesuit choruses, go ahead.  If you want to invade the alter during the consecration, please don't.  It does matter.  Why not have "fun" activities immediately after Mass?  (not before, got to observe the 1 hour no food rule!).  I think the idea of LifeTeen is great.  But, please don't say that breaking the rules doesn't matter.  When will we hold people accountable?  At twenty?  At 30?

peace...

I totally agree.

[willguy]

Allright, I've been spectating this too much, so here's my thoughts.

I love Lifeteen. The effect its had in my life and the life of others I know is monumental. Also, I feel that the rules that it is accused of breaking are not taking away from the Mass, IMO. They are based on good ideas.

That said, I still think that they should follow the rules, and all the rules. So, here's my proposition. Show me where the GIRM or Missal says that what Lifeteen is doing is wrong, and I will write my diocese (I'd write my bishop but we currently don't have one, who should I send it to) urging that these abuses be stopped. Not that Lifeteen or LT Masses be stopped, but just that they conform to the the rules.

[Paladin D]

I'm not in Lifeteen, even though I would like to.

[notbilln]

Right on, cmom.

Life Teen could be all that it is and still be obedient to Church law.

So why isn't it?

This whole subject is like watching wile E coyote walk off of a cliff .. in slow motion.

While he's still defying the laws of gravity we debate why he's not falling.

Why isnt't he falling? What's wrong with Gravity? Doesn't he have mass?

You aren't wrong for asking questions and pointing out the error, but you have to have just a little patience. Sometimes it takes us time to figure things out. Sometimes we don't rush to judgement. Sometimes we take a more gradual path to our goals, to make sure that everyone comes with us.

Just wait, and you'll have your coyote pancake.

[foundsheep]

MEEP!MEEP!

[megrc]

There was a some Catholic youth convention, and they were playing music in the background (it was pretty nice), while the Priest was carrying the Eucharist in the Sun thing (forgot what it's called lol), and the teens were reaching out for it.  And a spotlight was focused on it, making it shine.

Saw it on the net, have to find out what it is.

Is that an abuse?

I don't agree with the way they do Benediction and Exposition, but that's because I was raised extremely traditional. I like the Life Teen message, but I don't like the was they put some of their things into practice.

Pal, I don't think it's abuse. I think it's all based on the priest and the bishop. I know that Fr. Stan Fortuna does things that my priest would never even think of doing, but that doesn't make them wrong.

[JP2Iloveyou]

Allright, I've been spectating this too much, so here's my thoughts.

I love Lifeteen.  The effect its had in my life and the life of others I know is monumental.  Also, I feel that the rules that it is accused of breaking are not taking away from the Mass, IMO.  They are based on good ideas.

That said, I still think that they should follow the rules, and all the rules.  So, here's my proposition.  Show me where the GIRM or Missal says that what Lifeteen is doing is wrong, and I will write my diocese (I'd write my bishop but we currently don't have one, who should I send it to) urging that these abuses be stopped.  Not that Lifeteen or LT Masses be stopped, but just that they conform to the the rules.

hey, I don't have time to find this for you right now, but if you go to www.ewtn.com and go to the Q & A section under the heading "Faith" at the top I believe, it's the first heading on the left, I know that, then look up old questions and type in Lifeteen, you will get all the answers you are looking for.

One final note, I've mentioned quite a few times on here that I have quite a few ties to the Diocese of Lincoln, NE. If you go there, I can assure you, you will find Mass offered properly to children, young adults, adults, college students, everyone. There are little if any abuses in their Masses, mostly because of their bishop. Yet, their youth are among the most energetic and on fire in the country. They had the largest diocesan group travel to World Youth Day in the world with over 500 participants, including over 20 priests and the bishop. So, please, don't tell me that young people cannot get fired up for their faith without having liturgies full of abuses.

[Katholikos]

This whole subject is like watching wile E coyote walk off of a cliff .. in slow motion.

While he's still defying the laws of gravity we debate why he's not falling.

Why isnt't he falling? What's wrong with Gravity? Doesn't he have mass?

You aren't wrong for asking questions and pointing out the error, but you have to have just a little patience. Sometimes it takes us time to figure things out. Sometimes we don't rush to judgement. Sometimes we take a more gradual path to our goals, to make sure that everyone comes with us.

Just wait, and you'll have your coyote pancake.

The point is, young people learn what they live. When it's demonstrated to them that the rules of the Church don't matter, don't expect them to believe that they do matter in other areas of their lives when they're adults.

That's why I say, we need a sociological study of the long-term effects of Life Teen.

CCC 1124 The Church's faith precedes the faith of the believer who is invited to adhere to it. When the Church celebrates the sacraments, she confesses the faith received from the apostles -- whence the ancient saying: lex orandi, lex credendi. . . The law of prayer is the law of faith: the Church believes as she prays. Liturgy is a constitutive element of the holy and living Tradition.

CCC 1125 For this reason no sacramental rite may be modified or manipulated at the will of the minister or the community. Even the supreme authority in the Church may not change the liturgy arbitrarily, but only in the obedience of faith and with religious respect for the mystery of the liturgy.

(emphasis added)

The LT liturgy has been changed, modified, and manipulated arbitrarily, at the will of the minister or the community, and the laws of fasting are [sometimes] disregarded.

These rules aren't new. LT just doesn't concern itself with the Church's liturgical laws. For example, "blessings in lieu of Communion" was invented by the priests at St. Tim's and has been taught to parishes all over the entire country and overseas as well.

And it matters. Because the way we pray profoundly affects our beliefs -- lex orandi, lex credendi. Every gesture, posture, has meaning.

And someone telling me 'if you don't like LT, you don't have to attend' is the same illogical argument as, 'if you don't like abortion, your wife doesn't have to have one.' No, I don't attend LT regularly. But as a faithful Catholic, I'm deeply concerned about issues impacting the future of the Church.

JMJ Likos

[nippy316]

The next SS planning meeting is Thurs., Nov. 20, 6pm in the Adult Ed building.  It's about The Real Presence in the Blessed Sacrament (and God in the Sacraments), and the Real Presence in the Mass.  Looking forward to seeing you there.

Sweet. I'll be there.

[nippy316]

Well, the teens at my church don't even know that they're "breaking the rules". The majority of them don't know much at all about the mass. That is, until Mr.T gets them in his confirmation class! And as Mr.T said, our pastor is VERY conservative, and he allows it.

It's our liturgical abuses, even though it has been pointed out many times by Mr.T that the bishop has discretion, blah blah blah...

Why is everyone so concerned about Lifeteen masses? If you don't like them, don't go to them. Whatever you think about Lifeteen, it brings teenagers closer to Christ.

Wow...I just quoted myself. I must be real special.

Okay, I've changed my mind, and I hope I didn't upset anyone, because my post wasn't intended to sound rude. As long as our pastor allows it, I'm not going to argue with the litugical abuses. I trust his judgment over mine.

[BLAZEr]

The abominable practice of giving "blessings in lieu of Communion" started at the Life Teen masses in Mesa and has been exported all over the country and overseas.  The other abuses mentioned -- e.g., standing around the altar at the consecration, the added ending, etc. -- are also part of the model for LT Masses.

Sorry to break it to you, but this did not start at Lifeteen . . . this started in the Ecumenical movement in the 1970's where non-catholics were present at Catholic Masses and we didn't want them to feel left out, so they invited them up for a blessing from the priest rather than communion . ..

I think it's BS . . . but I don't think it would be too bad for someone to come up to adore Christ (if they were non catholic, in mortal sin, or couldn't recieve for some reason) and then the priest were to Hold up the Blessed Sacrament and say somehting liek "Receive Jesus in Your Heart" . . . so they could make a spiritual communion . . . cuz quite frankly people staying in the pews and having to crawl over them to get communion is annoying . . . but that's not the only reason, I just think it would be a nice gesture . . . if the Church says no, then no . . . I can see why Blessings shouldn't happen at that time thouhg . . .

BY THE WAY!! What really chaps my ass (my poor donkey gets so dry, I need to give him more water) . . . is when EXTRAORDINAY ministers of the Eucharist put their hands on kids and give them little blessings or make the sign of the cross on them!!!!

Arghh . .. don't they realize they might have some particles of the Blessed Sacrament on their fingers????? Don't the realize they don't have any authority to bless???? Don't they realize it looks stupid????!!!!! Makes me so mad~!!!!!!

[littleflower+JMJ]

nm

[notbilln]

You know Euchristic ministers are supposed to stand. My first time, I kneeled. the other EM next to me told me to stand. I'm not just saying.