Confession

[cmotherofpirl]

Yes Ellenita. In the Scriptures we read Jesus telling the Apostles "whose sins you forgivem they are forgiven, whose sins you bind, they are bound."

A priest absolves us of our sins in the name of God.

He can sit there all day but if nobody shows up...

JP2 my priest says Mass, weddings, funerals, funeral home visits for 2 parishes, visits the sick and elderly in all the nursing homes, covers the local hospital and motherhouse as well. We have confessions on Saturday before the 5pm Mass. These and the activities tat I know of, I am sure there are many more.

He thinks he has it relatively easy , he is elderly and says many other priests do twice as much.

[Ellenita]

Do you say a prayer of confession at the beginning of the mass? One is said at the start of the anglican mass and I always felt that if I genuinely meant what I was saying, it was OK to have communion.

[cmotherofpirl]

Yes that forgives our venial sins, but not our mortal ones.

Penitential Rite:

Priest: As we prepare to celebrate the mystery of Christ's love, let us acknowledge our failures and ask the Lord for pardon and strength.

or Coming together as God's family, with confidence let us ask the Father's forgiveness, for he is full of gentleness and compassion.

or My brothers and sisters, to prepare ourselves to celebrate the sacred mysteries, let us call to mind our sins.

[or similar words of introduction, followed by a period of silent reflection.]

Option A:

All: I confess to almighty God,

and to you, my brothers and sisters,

that I have sinned through my own fault,

in my thoughts and in my words,

in what I have done,

and in what I have failed to do;

and I ask blessed Mary, ever virgin,

all the angels and saints,

and you, my brothers and sisters,

to pray for me to the Lord, our God.

Priest: May almighty God have mercy on us, forgive us our sins, and bring us to everlasting life.

All: Amen.

Option B:

Priest: Lord, we have sinned against you:

Lord, have mercy.

All: Lord, have mercy.

Priest: Lord, show us your mercy and love.

All: And grant us your salvation.

Priest: May almighty God have mercy on us, forgive us our sins, and bring us to everlasting life.

All: Amen.

Option C: [The following or other invocations may be spoken by the priest or another minister, but the priest always gives the final blessing.]

Minister: You raise the dead to life in the Spirit: Lord, have mercy.

All: Lord, have mercy.

Minister: You bring pardon and peace to the sinner: Christ, have mercy.

All: Christ, have mercy.

Minister: You bring light to those in darkness: Lord, have mercy.

All: Lord, have mercy.

Priest: May almighty God have mercy on us, forgive us our sins, and bring us to everlasting life.

All: Amen.

At Communion we also have this:

Priest: This is the Lamb of God who takes away the sins of the world. Happy are those who are called to his supper.

All: Lord, I am not worthy to receive you, but only say the word and I shall be healed.

[Dave]

Do you say a prayer of confession at the beginning of the mass? One is said at the start of the anglican mass and I always felt that if I genuinely meant what I was saying, it was OK to have communion.

Yes, we do say a prayer of confession at the beginning of Mass. However, it will ONLY forgive venial sins. Mortal sins must be confessed.

[Ellenita]

OK Dave, I'm sure you explained the difference between those two types of sin in another thread but do you mind doing it again or reminding me which thread? Thanks!

I presume one sin is worse than the other, but surely God is concerned about all sin? How can we differentiate? I might like to imagine that He is more concerned with someone who has committed murder for example (a huge sin in my mind), but actually I think He is just as concerned about what I might consider 'lesser sins' which sadly I know exist in my life! I don't know that there is a greater or lesser sin in God's eyes.

[Norseman82]

Dave,

Move to Chicago. (edit: Now I'm going to have the line from that song "won't you please come to Chicago..." in my mind!!)

There is a church in downtown Chicago - St. Peter's - that offers confessions from 7:30 AM to 6:00 PM Monday-Friday and noon-4:30 PM on Saturdays. It's good for those of us who work downtown. There is also a parish staffed by Opus Dei that seems like half of Saturday is devoted to confession as well as a few spots during the week (as well as DURING Sunday mass!).

Edited November 2, 2003 by Norseman82

[Ash Wednesday]

It was pretty powerful coming from Cardinal Arinze, who is from Africa for those of you who don't know.

Yeah! He might be the next pope, too. That would be cool.

Anyway, sins do vary in gravity. Some sins are worse than others, but by no means does this mean that any sin should be accepted, or presumed to not matter to God. All sin matters to God, and one will be held accountable for all the sins they have committed.

Venial sin doesn't mean it's harmless. Multiple venial sin not kept in check can most certainly erode away at your soul and lead to mortal sin. I liken sin to plaque on your teeth. A little plaque doesn't seem like a big deal but in reality it leads to rotting your teeth to death, so you gotta keep those teeth clean.

I just went to the dentist -- errr... I mean confession... today.

At World Youth Day they had dozens of priests in private booths set up and hundreds of thousands of youth going to confession there. It was REALLY powerful.

If more people went to confession, priests wouldn't have to just arrange by appointment only. Let's pray that this happens. :(

[Dave]

Ellenita:

Mortal sin is any sin that involves grave matter and that you know (or at least ought to know) is gravely wrong and yet you choose to do anyway. If you commit one, you'll go to hell if you don't repent. In order for a sin to be venial, at least one of the criteria I just mentioned must be absent.

And here are some examples from scripture that show that some sin is greater than others (notice they often use terms like "great sin," and also notice how some sins are so severe they merit the death penalty, while other sins don't merit it):

"If any man see his brother sin a sin [which is] not unto death, he shall ask, and he shall give him life for them that sin not unto death. There is a sin unto death: I do not say that he shall pray for it. All unrighteousness is sin: and there is a sin not unto death." - 1 John 5:16-17

"Jesus answered, Thou couldest have no power at all against me, except it were given thee from above: therefore he that delivered me unto thee hath the greater sin." - John 19:11

"And the Lord said, Because the cry of Sodom and Gomorrah is great, and because their sin is very grievous..." - Genesis 18:20

"Then Abimelech called Abraham, and said unto him, What hast thou done unto us? and what have I offended thee, that thou hast brought on me and on my kingdom a great sin? thou hast done deeds unto me that ought not to be done." - Genesis 20:9

"He that smiteth a man, so that he die, shall be surely put to death." - Exodus 21:12

"And he that smiteth his father, or his mother, shall be surely put to death. And he that stealeth a man, and selleth him, or if he be found in his hand, he shall surely be put to death. And he that curseth his father, or his mother, shall surely be put to death. And if men strive together, and one smite another with a stone, or with his fist, and he die not, but keepeth his bed: If he rise again, and walk abroad upon his staff, then shall he that smote him be quit: only he shall pay for the loss of his time, and shall cause him to be thoroughly healed." - Exodus 21:15-19

"If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine." - Exodus 21:22

"If a man shall steal an ox, or a sheep, and kill it, or sell it; he shall restore five oxen for an ox, and four sheep for a sheep." - Exodus 22:1

"If the theft be certainly found in his hand alive, whether it be ox, or ass, or sheep; he shall restore double. If a man shall cause a field or vineyard to be eaten, and shall put in his beast, and shall feed in another man's field; of the best of his own field, and of the best of his own vineyard, shall he make restitution. If fire break out, and catch in thorns, so that the stacks of corn, or the standing corn, or the field, be consumed therewith; he that kindled the fire shall surely make restitution." - Exodus 22:4-6

"And if a man entice a maid that is not betrothed, and lie with her, he shall surely endow her to be his wife. If her father utterly refuse to give her unto him, he shall pay money according to the dowry of virgins." - Exodus 22:16-17

"Whosoever lieth with a beast shall surely be put to death." - Exodus 22:19

[Dave]

Hey Norseman, St. Peter's sounds like my kind of parish! :D

[Ellenita]

Dave and Ash Wednesday - thanks! :D I can see that there is a clear difference between sin. That's been really helpful.

But what happens if you are unable to go to confession at one of the designated times by the priest, and he won't see you outside those times (and I fully accept he might be extremely busy with other parish duties) and therefore you haven't through no fault of your own, been able to go to confession. It seems really unfair that in those circumstances you would be denied communion.

[cmotherofpirl]

Three things are necessary for a sin to be mortal:

1. Serious matter (things listed in this examination);

2. Knowledge or firm belief that the act is seriously wrong prior to committing the act;

3. Full consent of the will.

All three of these conditions must be present simultaneously for a sin to be mortal. This means that if you did not know the act was seriously wrong, then you are not guilty of having committed a mortal sin. If you did not will the act, e.g., if you were forced or if it was in a dream, if you were impaired or emotionally distraught or terrified, etc., you are not guilty of the act committed.

[JP2Iloveyou]

He can sit there all day but if nobody shows up...

JP2  my priest says Mass, weddings, funerals, funeral home visits for 2 parishes,  visits the sick and elderly in all the nursing homes, covers the local hospital and motherhouse as well. We have confessions on Saturday before the 5pm Mass. These and the activities tat I know of, I am sure there are many more.

He thinks he has it relatively easy , he is elderly and says many other priests do twice as much.

I'm sure he is overworked. But, I still say that if a priest is not hearing confessions at LEAST once a week, he is not doing his job. I mean, a deacon can cover weddings, funerals, and baptisms (ideally, it would be a priest, but we don't live in an ideal world). A layman or woman can vist the elderly in the nursing homes and people in hospitals. They can also take Communion to them. However, only a PRIEST can hear confessions. If someone is dying and in need of Anointing, that is a totally different scenario. I don't think that one hour a week will kill any priest though. I know many priests who do all that you mentioned and hear confessions for four or five hours a week, even more sometimes. And think, some people still say priests should be married. Sheesh!

[Norseman82]

I'm sure he is overworked. But, I still say that if a priest is not hearing confessions at LEAST once a week, he is not doing his job. I mean, a deacon can cover weddings, funerals, and baptisms (ideally, it would be a priest, but we don't live in an ideal world). A layman or woman can vist the elderly in the nursing homes and people in hospitals. They can also take Communion to them. However, only a PRIEST can hear confessions. If someone is dying and in need of Anointing, that is a totally different scenario. I don't think that one hour a week will kill any priest though. I know many priests who do all that you mentioned and hear confessions for four or five hours a week, even more sometimes. And think, some people still say priests should be married. Sheesh!

I just thought of something when I saw your post.....

With all the talk about what is the role of laity in the church, maybe we lay people should look upon asking for a greater role not as a matter of a power grab, but rather offering our services so that the ordained priests can concentrate on matters that only they can do, like saying mass and hearing confession....

[Ash Wednesday]

The 1983 Code of Canon Law indicates that the same requirement applies today. "A person who is conscious of a grave sin is not to . . . receive the body of the Lord without prior sacramental confession unless a grave reason is present and there is no opportunity of confessing; in this case the person is to be mindful of the obligation to make an act of perfect contrition, including the intention of confessing as soon as possible" (CIC 916).

The requirement for sacramental confession can be dispensed if four conditions are fulfilled: (1) there must be a grave reason to receive Communion (for example, danger of death), (2) it must be physically or morally impossible to go to confession first, (3) the person must already be in a state of grace through perfect contrition, and (4) he must resolve to go to confession as soon as possible.

Basically if you're in danger of dying or something really major, and a priest cannot hear your confession, and you very truly are sorry for your sins, you can receive communion. But this also means you have every intention of going to confession as soon as possible.

If a man went off and committed adultery, or a woman had an abortion, both knowing full and well that these were grave sins and by doing so, they were turning their backs on God. Our sins are not just a matter between us and God. Our sins hurt the entire Church, the Body of Christ as well. (Look at the pedophile priests as a prime example) This is where confession comes in, to not only heal ourselves, but the church as well.

If someone was repentant from their mortal sin and wished to go to confession and a priest wasn't able to hear it (for example he had to go and give someone last rites), they still aren't to receive communion until a priest is available. (Again unless it was something of a serious situation like danger of death).

One practical reason for this, I think, is because if a truly repentant soul who had committed mortal sin went to communion anyway (without grave circumstances) even if the priest wasn't available, I think they would end up putting it off needlessly anyway, or not see the point of confession at all in the first place. It would diminish the sacrament of reconciliation's importance, and the Eucharist's importance and sacredness as well.

In my experience, many people who have flat out turned their backs on God in mortal sin, and yet repented, did not WANT to receive communion until they went to confession and spilled their guts, no matter what. When one realizes the gravity of their sins, it is a very humbling experience. Reconciliation is a concrete reminder that though we have sinned, we ARE forgiven, and we can move on! (So often it's easy for our past sins to haunt us, confession rids us of this and helps us move on)

For most of us, it would be somewhat difficult NOT to find a priest available to hear a confession. To me the problem nowdays isn't the availabilty of priests to hear confession, it's getting people to go to confession.

An alternative until that time when one can worthily receive communion (I mean, we are talking about being united with the true body and blood of jesus here) is to make a spiritual communion, a prayer (or prayers if you wish) that you pray though you do not physically receive communion. You receive the Lord spiritually, just not sacramentally. There are a lot of wonderful prayers for this -- it's something that the saints embraced.

Anyway, this is my understanding of the whole shebang :D ...can anyone else verify? Grazie!

Edited November 2, 2003 by Ash Wednesday

[jbliss145]

You might surprise the Church into offering weekly confession if you call and ask them to put you down for an "appointment" every Saturday. (Or whatever day)

I think the lack of regularly offered confession is a lack of Catholics wanting regularly offered confession. Now's your chance to make a positive change. Just a thought.

God Bless,

Catholic