Do you accept

[KeenanParkerII]

yessir

[Ed Normile]

I voted no. I believe there is no salvation outside the catholic church, especially for those who would deny her truth. I believe in cases of ignorance they would have to rely upon the fount of endless mercy of Jesus, it does seems to be a pretty deep fount.

ed

[Ed Normile]

[quote name='reyb' date='24 January 2010 - 08:00 AM' timestamp='1264338022' post='2043370']
Please read [url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=37010&st=0"]No Salvation Outside Catholic Church[/url] and [url="http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/index.php?showtopic=69191"]One True Church[/url]


Please read your Church history. The Holy Scriptures was not written by Catholics much more to say your early Church fathers. They compiled it into one book which now we called 'The Holy Bible'.

Just for info.
[/quote]

Reyb, do you mean this in the sense that the early apostles were Jewish, as was Jesus? The apostles were and are the early fathers of the church, their very writings, or witness, are the New Testament, they did not compile it into the bible as we know it, that came later. As Jesus fulfilled the prophecies of the Old Testament, the old law, and set forth the new law, the New Testament which we now follow, his very words to his apostle Peter, in Peter the Rock, Matthew 16, 13-20 are absolutely the definitive word on the church.

ed

[reyb]

[quote name='KeenanParkerII' date='24 January 2010 - 10:56 AM' timestamp='1264348618' post='2043416']
yessir
[/quote]

Do you think Apostle Paul is also a 'Trinitarian'? Can you please show it to us through his letters? Do you know that Holy Prophets are Christians? Do you think they are 'Trinitarian'' too?

[KeenanParkerII]

[quote]Do you think Apostle Paul is also a 'Trinitarian'? Can you please show it to us through his letters? Do you know that Holy Prophets are Christians? Do you think they are 'Trinitarian'' too?[/quote]

It doesn't matter. Our Lord is trinitarian, and he checks them out. As the Bible tells us, we will grow in our knowledge of God (2 Pet 1:3). Our understanding includes you too reyb.

[reyb]

[quote name='KeenanParkerII' date='25 January 2010 - 09:03 AM' timestamp='1264428202' post='2044125']
It doesn't matter. Our Lord is trinitarian, and he checks them out. As the Bible tells us, we will grow in our knowledge of God (2 Pet 1:3). Our understanding includes you too reyb.
[/quote]

Ok. Thank You.

[KeenanParkerII]

You're welcome!

[Selah]

Yes

[Vincent Vega]

No.

[Catholic Fox]

No.

[JustJump]

I love that I'm the one maybe so far [img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/tomato.gif[/img]

My thought: only God knows.

The Church is run by humans. We aren't perfect, there's bound to be a mistake somewhere, maybe really big, maybe really small. However I'm Catholic because I agree and feel that it encompasses the Truth.

[Mark of the Cross]

[quote name='JustJump' date='02 June 2010 - 08:17 AM' timestamp='1275423462' post='2122226']
I love that I'm the one maybe so far [img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/tomato.gif[/img]

My thought: only God knows.

The Church is run by humans. We aren't perfect, there's bound to be a mistake somewhere, maybe really big, maybe really small. However I'm Catholic because I agree and feel that it encompasses the Truth.
[/quote]

Correct, but so are the ones who say no.[quote] 'The Church is run by humans. We aren't perfect, there's bound to be a mistake somewhere,' [/quote] and the works of evil, however failing in detail is one thing, but the ultimate end result is the prime consideration, which it will succeed in, because God will not let us stray too far and as long as the goal is reached it matters not if things are not perfect. Catholics throughout the world practice Mass in different ways. Have some failed and a few succeeded? I don't think so. The fact that we do it is the important thing.

[quote] Catholic because I agree and feel that it encompasses the Truth.[/quote] Truth will always remain victorious and therefore so will Christs Body on earth. The Catholic Church.
God would not call people such as me to become Catholic to see it fail. I feel he called me to it because it is the road, albeit rocky, which leads directly to whatever it is that he requires me to do.

Edited June 1, 2010 by Mark of the Cross

[JustJump]

[font="Times New Roman"][size="3"]Maybe I misunderstood the wording of the question...???[/size][/font]

[font="Times New Roman"][size="3"]"Do you accept that the Catholic Church could possibly be wrong?" Sure it could be, it's run by humans. Don't know on what or how big or how small, but I'm not going to claim it's perfect and never wrong. However I am Catholic because I believe the church encompasses the Truth.[/size][/font]

[font="Times New Roman"][size="3"]As for the last two parts of the question, I guess it's asking if you can both believe that the Church could be possibly wrong and also believe in Christ? Well I answered the above. And I still believe in Christ...

So those saying no are basically saying that you have to believe the Church is right in order to believe that Christ is true...?

So Christians that believe the Chruch is possibly wrong cannot believe that Christ is true?

[/size][/font]

[font="Times New Roman"][size="3"]Well I feel dumb because I'm rather confused...[img]http://www.phatmass.com/phorum/public/style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif[/img] [/size][/font]

[JustJump]

[quote name='Mark of the Cross' date='01 June 2010 - 06:43 PM' timestamp='1275432217' post='2122339']
Correct, but so are the ones who say no. and the works of evil, however failing in detail is one thing, but the ultimate end result is the prime consideration, which it will succeed in, because God will not let us stray too far and as long as the goal is reached it matters not if things are not perfect. Catholics throughout the world practice Mass in different ways. Have some failed and a few succeeded? I don't think so. The fact that we do it is the important thing.

Truth will always remain victorious and therefore so will Christs Body on earth. The Catholic Church.
God would not call people such as me to become Catholic to see it fail. I feel he called me to it because it is the road, albeit rocky, which leads directly to whatever it is that he requires me to do.
[/quote]


I never said that celebrating the mass in different ways fails or succeeds...And I agree that celebrating the mass as best we can is the important thing.

And I am a member of the Church because it encompasses the Truth, by which I was implying that I do believe that the Church's "end result" (big picture, main goal, etc) is right. I believe in God and I choose to follow Him. Yes, I think Truth is victorious. I don't think God would call people to the Church to see it fail either.

[Vincent Vega]

[quote name='JustJump' date='01 June 2010 - 07:41 PM' timestamp='1275435679' post='2122368']
So those saying no are basically saying that you have to believe the Church is right in order to believe that Christ is true...?
[/quote]
Correct. Kind of.

The question asks:
Do you accept that the Catholic Church could possibly be wrong, and Christ still is true, and nature is true?

Do I believe the Church could be wrong and Christ could still be the Son of God? No, I do not. If the Church is wrong, Christianity is wrong, and I am a non-believer.

Edited June 2, 2010 by USAirwaysIHS