Dave Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 shrines/devotions to people. i'm not a fan. you knew that. What's wrong with honoring Our Lady and the other saints? It's not exactly honoring God when we ignore those who followed Him to a heroic degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
littleflower+JMJ Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 okay theres a st. therese the littleflower shrine in san antonio..haven't been there yet but i plan too... but a catholic friend from another board was able to go visit St. Therese's House, room, church, convent..everything!! adn she took really good pics..... its soo pretty....i hope to go one day....and see all those beautiful places, rome....fatima..lourdes.....everywhere!! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VeraMaria Posted October 30, 2003 Author Share Posted October 30, 2003 okay theres a st. therese the littleflower shrine in san antonio..haven't been there yet but i plan too... but a catholic friend from another board was able to go visit St. Therese's House, room, church, convent..everything!! adn she took really good pics..... its soo pretty....i hope to go one day....and see all those beautiful places, rome....fatima..lourdes.....everywhere!! :D What about we save a lot of money and go all together on a world tour called "catholic world"??? We'll get to go to Africa, the Holy Land, Japan, Asia (we can volunteer at Mother Teresa's homes in India :D !!!), Europe, South and North America....and visit all the cool Catholic sites there!!! And then we'll have so many interesting observations and impressions we'll write a book about it!!! hehehehe, it doesn't matter that this trip would probably happen when we have enough money, which means when we're old and wrinkly and retired.... :D :D :D More of Vera's wishful thinking.... :rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 shrines/devotions to people. i'm not a fan. you knew that. sorry if i offended. THese are Churches dedicated to Saints of God, the clouds of witnesses in Revelations. You don't have beautiful churches you can attend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Huether Posted October 30, 2003 Share Posted October 30, 2003 shrines/devotions to people. i'm not a fan. you knew that. sorry if i offended. So, still, why does that merit "scaryness". If you're not a fan, then I would've expected something like: "dumb" "whatever" "not a fan" "big deal" But "Scary"? Why Scary? Do you think we're doing something bad that would put our souls in danger? Somehow I don't think you are just "not a fan". Please tell us what you really think, and why. And then we can defend what we do, so that you might be enlightened. Devotion to the Saints can be likened to Devotion to Michealangelo's paintings! You aren't giving glory to the paintings. In your admiration for the paintings the honor actually goes to Michealangelo! He wouldn't tell you to stop looking at the paintings and look at him! That's silly. Same with God! He wants us to see his Glory in creation! If he didn't, why would we even have eyes!? You are a hypocrite! Look at your avatar. Are you not honoring the yankee's? Is that not a "shrine" showing your devotion to the yank's. You know that isn't the intent of your admiration of the yank's, don't you? We dont' build up a shrine and worship it! It isn't a golden calf, Mulls. It's the serpent on a staff! It's a cherib on the Ark! Why don't you stop on by one of the "scary" shrines and see what goes on INSIDE! All the Glory is for God. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulls Posted October 31, 2003 Share Posted October 31, 2003 i'll pass. but thanks for enlightening me of my hypocritical nature. i'll take a long, hard look in the mirror now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted October 31, 2003 Share Posted October 31, 2003 Mull swhy did you use the word scary? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.SIGGA Posted October 31, 2003 Share Posted October 31, 2003 (edited) i'll pass. but thanks for enlightening me of my hypocritical nature. i'll take a long, hard look in the mirror now. Why is a statue or a shrine of the Virgin Mary scary as opposed to the Jefferson or the Lincoln Memorial? If you ever visit there, those shrines go further and call themselves temples. We honor our the heroes of our faith in the same manner nations honor their heroes b/c their examples must be lifted up to be an example and a witness for everyone to follow. Like Jefferson risked his life and creditablity for American freedom, so did the young Virgin Mary risk her reputation and her life by saying ''Yes'' to God's call to be the Mother of Christ. Our statues of martyrs and saints are not fairy tales; they are real people and many of them gave their lives so that you and me can have honor of knowing Jesus, and it doesn't matter if you are Catholic or not. Shrines are holy places where people are honored and venerated, not worshiped. Your comment was offensive to some b/c you are insulting a shrine of the Virgin Mary who many Christians hold very dear to their hearts; if I called a picture of your mother scary you would probably want to hit me. Edited October 31, 2003 by M.SIGGA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mulls Posted October 31, 2003 Share Posted October 31, 2003 i already apologized Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nocturnal1 Posted October 31, 2003 Share Posted October 31, 2003 Hello everyone, With regard to Vera's post. The shrine she speaks about is "La Ermita de la Caridad del Cobre". It is a shrine to "Our Lady of Charity". She is referred to as "La Virgen de la Caridad del Cobre", or The Virgen of Charity (for a literal translation), or 'Our Lady of Charity". The shrine was built by Cuban refugees who came to the US during the 1960's and early 1970's with the help of the Archdiocese of Miami. Ermita means hermitage and Cobre is the town where the apparition took place and her statue was placed. "La Virgen de la Caridad del Cobre" is the Patron Saint of all Cubans. HISTORY OF THE VIRGIN OF THE CHARITY - Father Jordi Rivero Alonso de Ojeda and the first conquerors of Cuba tried to dominate themselves the Indians. These repulsed them and the Spaniards had to flee crossing mounts and bogs to save their lives. Thus they arrived at the Indian town of Cueiba in the zone of Jobabo. The Indians when seeing them in so badly been had compassion of them and they helped to them. In gratefulness Alonso Ojeda it constructed a small hermitage with branches of trees, possibly first in Cuban ground. There it placed an Image of Our Lady who was his appraised property. It fulfilled therefore the vote that had made give the Image if it left safe that situation. It taught to the Indians to say to the "Bird Maria" and that expression propagated so fast between the Indians who but late Cuba was gotten to know like the island from the "Bird Maria". There is no reason to think that the image of the Virgin of the Charity was that that will appear later. But the Virgin already was made present in Cuba preparing the way. The great education: The Virgin wanted that the evangelización did not divide of the great power but from humility and gratefulness. Without including/understanding the religion very well, the Indians of that place venerated the Image and maintained the hermitage with great care when Ojeda left. Thus it happened when the Father arrived from the Houses at the town of Cueibá. In century XVI it increased in Cuba the young of the cattle. It was necessary for the Spaniards in way towards the new territories. In 1598 the operation of copper in mountains of the Eastern region of the island began. To 15 leguas of the mines the Spanish government established the cattle ranch of Varajagua or Barajagua that counted on much cattle. For that reason the salt was necessary that prevented the corruption with the meat. The finding Around year 1612 or at the beginnings of 1613, two Indian brothers went to look for salt in the bay of Nipe and a negrito of nine or ten years . Juan de Hoyos, Rodrigo de Hoyos and Brown Juan were called respectively, known by the tradition like "the three Juans". While they went by the salt happened the appearance of the statue of the Virgin. There am the story of Brown Juan here, dice in 1687, when it was eighty and five years old: "... having ranchado in French key that is in the middle of the bay of Nipe towards good weather to go to the salt mine, being a morning the barren sea they left of this French key before leaving the sun, the this Juan and Rodrigo de Hoyos and this declarante, embarked in a canoe for the this salt mine, and separated from this French key they saw a white thing on the foam of the water, that did not distinguish what could be, and approaching more seemed to them bird and dry branches. These Indians said "seems a girl", and in these speeches, arrived, they recognized and they saw the image of Our Lady the Santísima Virgin with a Boy Jesus in the arms on a small tablita, and in tablita happiness great letters which read this Rodrigo de Hoyos, and said: "I am the Virgin of the Charity", and being its clothes of clothes, they were admired that they were not dunked. And in this, full of joy, they took only three thirds of salt and they came for the Cattle ranch of Barajagua... " The administrator of the Real term of Copper Mines, Don Francisco Sanchez de Moya, ordered to raise a hermitage to place the image and settled down to Rodrigo de Hoyos like chaplain. One Rodrigo night went to visit the Virgin and noticed that it was not there. A search without success was organized. To the following morning, and for the surprise of all, the Virgin was again in her altar, without it was possible to be explained, since the door of the hermitage had remained closed all the night. The fact repeated two or three times more until those of Barajagua thought that the Virgin wanted to change of place. Thus it was transferred in procession, with great pain for them, to the Parochial Temple of Cobre. The Virgin was received with repique of bells and great joy in her new house, where they located it on the greater altar. Thus she got to know itself like the Virgin of the Charity of Cobre. In Cobre the disappearance of the Virgin was repeated. They thought then that it wanted to be on mountains of the Masterful Mountain range. This was confirmed when a called girl Apolonia raised until the hill of the copper mines where her mother worked. The girl was persecuting butterflies and gathering flowers when, on the top of one of mountains she saw the Virgin of the Charity. The news of the small Apolonia caused great commotion. They believed, other no, but the girl stayed signs in her testimony. There they took to the Virgin. From the appearance of the statue, the devotion to the Virgin of the Charity propagated with amazing rapidity by all the island in spite of the difficult communications. It was in Cobre, in 1801, that the miners, encouraged by the Father Alexander Ascanio, obtain the freedom by Real Certificate of the 7 of April. With the years a greater enclosure was acquired to construct a new sanctuary that could welcome in the increasing number of travelling, becoming the inauguration, with the transfer of the Virgin day 8 of September of 1927. During the independence war, the troops entrusted the Virgin of the Charity. She is not that it is possible to be seen the Virgin like an ally in the war. But well it, like mother, suffers and she worries about all, she looks for La Paz between his children, finally when the hearts do not allow another thing him, looks for to attenuate hatreds and to foment the reconciliation and the pardon. After the independence war, the veterans requested to the Pope that declared the Virgin of the Charity of Cobre, pattern of Cuba. In signed document day 10 of May of 1916 by the Cardinal Wafer Bishop, Its Sanctity Benedicto XV acceded to the request, declaring to the Virgin of the Charity of Main Cobre Pattern of the Republic of Cuba and fixing its festividad the 8 of September. In 1977, the Pope Pablo I SAW elevates to the dignity from Basilica to the National Sanctuary of Our Lady of the Charity of Cobre. During the months of preparation for the visit of the Pope Juan Pablo II to Cuba, ten travelling images of the Virgin of the Charity crossed the different dioceses from the country with great answer of the town. The Virgin of the Charity was crowned by S.S. Juan Pablo II as Queen and Patron of Cuba Saturday 24 of January of 1998, during Santa Misa who celebrated in her apostolic visit to Santiago of Cuba. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- The Virgin of the Charity in exile The Cubans exilados in Miami because of the Comunism, having undergone enormously by the separation or deaths in their families, by the loss of the mother country and of everything what they had, prepared themselves for the first celebration of the Celebration of the Virgin of the Charity in exile. For that reason they wished to have an suitable image of the Virgin. Providencialmente, same the 8 of September, from 1961, while already thousands met in the Stage of Miami to celebrate the Mass, arrived at the airport from this city the image of the Virgin of the Charity coming from Cuba. It was the image of the Parish of Guanabo in the Arquidiócesis of Havana. It had been put in a home in the embassy of Italy and passed through the One in charge of Businesses from Panama to his embassy by request of the Cubans. That celebration of deep emotion, presided over by the Archbishop of Miami, became a tradition that continues until today. After the first celebration, the Virgin began a route of the campings for the exilados Cuban children who were without their parents. The Arquidiócesis de Miami welcomed and took care of of fourteen thousand children in those first years of exile. The Cubans organized themselves to construct a Hermitage to the Virgin of the Charity in exile . The first stone of the provisional chapel put the 20 of May, of 1967 and Santa Misa was celebrated. The 21 of May, of 1868 Archbishop Carrol de Miami, orders the foundation of the Brotherhood of the Virgin of the Charity to reunite the devotee ones to honor to the Virgin and with her to evangelizar. In the same year the peregrinations of the 126 municipalities of Cuba began that have continued organizadamente since then. The 2 of December, of 1971 the Hermitage of the Virgin of the Charity was dedicated . It presided over Kroll cardinal, Archbishop of Philadelfia, then president of the Conference of Bishops of the United States, with the presence of Archbishop Carroll de Miami and the bishops Stopper Masvidal (exilado of Cuba) and Gracida. In September of 1987, when visiting Santo Padre Juan Pablo II Miami, the image of the Virgin of the Charity was transferred to the residence of McCarthy Archbishop to preside over the deprived Chapel of Santo Padre. The Pope, in his homily, mentioned the Virgin of the Charity. Miami has citizens of all the Hispanic countries. From years 80, in addition to the Cuban municipalities, they also peregrinate to the hermitage of the Virgin of the Charity of form organized, all the countries brothers of the Spanishness during the month of October. McCarthy Archbishop, the 14 of May, of 1994 solemnly consecrated the altar of the Hermitage that underneath keeps visibly the first stone. This stone contains land of the different provinces from Cuba that were fused with water that arrived in a raft in which the fifteen crew perished whom they looked for to escape of Cuba. The Hermitage was extended and a precious chapel of the Santísimo was added that was blessed by the Archbishop of Miami, Juan C. Favalora the 21 of May, celebration of the Ascent of the Gentleman. In Santa Misa who the Archbishop celebrated that day in the hermitage, I elevate the brotherhood to Archconfraternity of Our Lady of the Charity. The devoted ones of the Virgin have managed to propagate nonsingle the devotion to the Virgin of the Charity, but to make of the Hermitage a center of evangelización of world-wide irradiation. The main instrument of the Virgin for the work of the Hermitage has been from the beginning Monsignor Agustín Roman, today auxiliary bishop of Miami, always helped by the Sisters of the Charity who ministran in the Hermitage and the Archconfraternity. By the way, Agustin Roman just retired this summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VeraMaria Posted October 31, 2003 Author Share Posted October 31, 2003 Hey, thanks Nocturnal1!!!! Have you ever been there?? I live really close to it!! :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jake Huether Posted October 31, 2003 Share Posted October 31, 2003 I feel bad. I didn't mean to say that you were a hypocrite. Even though that's how it came out. If you read the line right below, I stated that YOU KNOW why you are devoted to the yanks, and that it isn't "scary". So, I just wanted to know why you would cosider devotion to the Mother of our Savior "scary", yet devotion to the yankees not? Sorry if I cause any bad blood. I just don't like when people poke in with one word-ers, and leave no explenation. It drives me bonkers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nocturnal1 Posted October 31, 2003 Share Posted October 31, 2003 Hi Vera, Yes, I go to the 'Ermita' all the time because I can view the Blessed Sacrament whenever I need to and also, they have confessions all day, everyday. This really conforms to my crazy schedule. I'm in the Gables by "Little Flower" which is my Parish Church. Take Care and God Bless, Angel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nocturnal1 Posted October 31, 2003 Share Posted October 31, 2003 Hello all, I also agree with M.Sigga regarding the Lincoln, Jefferson, and Washington Memorials. I consider THOSE a bit scary because of their Masonic influences. Just take a good look at the architecture and the surroundings and you'll see Masonic symbolism everywhere. Now THATS scary! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VeraMaria Posted October 31, 2003 Author Share Posted October 31, 2003 Hi Vera, Yes, I go to the 'Ermita' all the time because I can view the Blessed Sacrament whenever I need to and also, they have confessions all day, everyday. This really conforms to my crazy schedule. I'm in the Gables by "Little Flower" which is my Parish Church. Take Care and God Bless, Angel OH MY GOSH!!!! It's a small world, that's my parish!! I live like 3 minutes from the Church, on the Granada Golf Course!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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