AtheistAlex Posted February 22, 2005 Share Posted February 22, 2005 [quote name='Socrates' date='Feb 21 2005, 01:14 PM'] That is agnosticism, not atheism. Agnosticism says that we cannot know if there is a God. Atheism means one beleives there is no God. [/quote] The idea of Agnosticism as a separate faction from Atheism has been, to me, a way to divide people with many times, common interests. Agnosticism, as I have it, is actually known to many as "weak" atheism, with "there is no God" atheism known as "strong" atheism. Atheism, simply put, is a lack of belief in a God or gods. It is unfortunately, defined differently by the dictionaries online. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Ryan- Posted February 23, 2005 Share Posted February 23, 2005 I see the arguement that a person needs an eventual reckoning at the end of his/her life in order to ensure they have some motivation to be objectively good as fallacious. (I realize this is actually a central concept to a lot of people here, and I apologize if my opinion offends). People are motivated and restricted by any number of things, often times simple emotional investment (which is ironically, pretty hard to define). I could have an affinity for frogs, and thus not torture and maime them, and that would be a morality of sorts. It might be arbitrary, but it would still be what is commonly defined as a set of morals, it may even have a lot in common with the set of morals laid out in your bible. (Obviously, not the frog bit, but in a more detailed hypothetical case this could be true) If someone believes something identical to you, but for completely different reasons, do you condemn the person or the motivation? (or even that?) It seems like there is a lot of labeling going on here that divisivly attacks people or groups of people, and it's both a little sad and somewhat amusing at the same time. I suspect Melchisedec and Socrates would react to many situations in our society similarly, if not identically. With some key differences, at least key to the both of you, but probably not to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Ryan- Posted February 23, 2005 Share Posted February 23, 2005 Also, as an agnostic, I don't agree with the idea that Atheism and Agnosticism are the same things. I don't claim to know if there's a God, nor do I care if there is one. I think that's intrinsically different than saying with authority that there is no God. On religious matters, we probably have less in common than you'd think, as I tend to be completely apathetic (I'm here for the pool jam) until it starts to affect something im responsible for, but in my mind I don't seperate religious motivations for people doing things I don't like from secular ones. I'm not sure if we're typical of athiesm and agnosticism, but at least I can add a little empyrical fuel for the fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtheistAlex Posted February 25, 2005 Share Posted February 25, 2005 Understood. I am saying this: Atheism is only, merely, and nothing more than, a LACK of belief in a God or gods. This means one doesn't have to really care at all to be an atheist. They just need to NOT believe. And that's possible from a great many perspectives, and under that definition, agnosticism is quite obviously a faction of atheism. Agnosticism is to LACK supernatural knowledge, so it is, in reference to religion, a section of atheists that do not profess a knowledge of God's existence. Oh, and hey Ryan, wassup! Making cake for one, Alex Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catalyst Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 (edited) Disregarding everything that everyone else said because I don't want to read what everyone else said. Here is a random fact; Atheism is a religion in its self, as you do worship something. You may think man is the highest form of being or how much you meditate on the oppoisite sex...every single believe is a religion on its own, however truth is not relative and there is only one Truth and one way and one life. Jesus. Edited March 1, 2005 by Catalyst Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God Conquers Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 Atheism is the belief in the absence of a God... hence a theism: no belief in God It isn't a non-belief, or not caring. If that is how you define yourself, then it is possible you are agnostic and not an atheist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burnsspivey Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 [quote name='Catalyst' date='Feb 28 2005, 08:16 PM'] Disregarding everything that everyone else said because I don't want to read what everyone else said. Here is a random fact; Atheism is a religion in its self, as you do worship something. You may think man is the highest form of being or how much you meditate on the oppoisite sex...every single believe is a religion on its own, however truth is not relative and there is only one Truth and one way and one life. Jesus. [/quote] Even if what you are saying was true, atheism would not be the religion in such a situation. The belief in '"man" as the highest form of being' or 'meditation on the opposite sex' would be something separate from atheism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melchisedec Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 (edited) [quote name='Catalyst' date='Feb 28 2005, 08:16 PM'] Disregarding everything that everyone else said because I don't want to read what everyone else said. Here is a random fact; Atheism is a religion in its self, as you do worship something. You may think man is the highest form of being or how much you meditate on the oppoisite sex...every single believe is a religion on its own, however truth is not relative and there is only one Truth and one way and one life. Jesus. [/quote] Its very clear that you have no idea on what your talking about. Can you answer this? Is nothing something? If so, than what is nothing? Atheism is just a lack of belief. You can convince yourself its a religion because your mind cannot comprehend a lack of theist beleif. How can atheist worship when it means: WORSHIP 1. The reverent love and devotion accorded a deity, an idol, or a sacred object. 2. The ceremonies, prayers, or other religious forms by which this love is expressed. All of the above being contrary to atheism. Have a sip of your jones town punch. Edited March 1, 2005 by Melchisedec Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
God Conquers Posted March 1, 2005 Share Posted March 1, 2005 Catalyst, I think you are describing secular or atheistic humanism. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catalyst Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 you must have faith to believe that there is no God...it goes both ways. Thats why its a religion. You put you faith into a theory. Its why Christianity isn't a religion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AtheistAlex Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 What has this become? What are you guys talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Melchisedec Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 [quote name='Catalyst' date='Mar 2 2005, 07:05 PM'] you must have faith to believe that there is no God...it goes both ways. Thats why its a religion. You put you faith into a theory. Its why Christianity isn't a religion. [/quote] Your getting dumber by the minute. God requires faith because there is NO proof of a god. let me spell it out for you again corky: Faith: Belief that does not rest on logical proof or material evidence So I do not believe in a god because there is no proof or material evidence of one. So Atheism does NOT require faith. And you contradicted yourself too. Christianity IS a religion. It relies heavily on faith of the bible among many things. Atheism relies on logic and reason, religion relies on faith. I dont expect you to comprehend, but the record must be set straight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burnsspivey Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 [quote name='Catalyst' date='Mar 2 2005, 07:05 PM'] you must have faith to believe that there is no God...it goes both ways. Thats why its a religion. You put you faith into a theory. Its why Christianity isn't a religion. [/quote] Please, do explain what kind of faith you have to have in order to believe that there is no supreme being. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catalyst Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 (edited) alright, you say there's no cement evidence that God exists. You should also know there's no cement evidence that He doesn't. You base your beliefs on logic and reason? You seem to need to think about that statement a little bit harder as a man who reasons has no need to call another a name for the lone reason to try and belittle another and build youself up. This isn't a school yard. yes atheism needs faith because its strong belief in a theory only. Not facts. Its a faith or a strong belief that there is no God, especially when all of creation is a testimony of Him. you one of those types who believe that truth is relative to the person? i didn't contradict myself by the way. There's just a lack of understanding between us. Edited March 3, 2005 by Catalyst Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Catalyst Posted March 3, 2005 Share Posted March 3, 2005 no proof bro? come by me, we'll hang out and i'll take you places as words can only take us so far and actions say the rest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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