A new accusation against the Church

[Paladin D]

A few people that I'm currently debating with, believe the Catholic Church should not continue building grand cathedrals or parishes, and even sell the existing ones. Why? So that money can be used to help the poor, since it is our mission to help the poor. They view such magnificant places of worship as mere luxuries, things we can live without. We can just worship in places that aren't as costly.

I can't use the hypocrite argument, because they don't share the same morals, and are practically using our morals against us.

How would you respond?

[dUSt]

I'd respond by saying that even the poor would prefer to worship God in a grand cathedral rather than a gym.

[MichaelFilo]

Cathedrals, as a bastations of the Catholic Church are a dominant sign of the Catholic might and power. These Cathedrals, in their awe inspiring grandeur lead to the conversion of many, as they tend to have a massive amount of Faithful attending (due to their size). Just the gathering of such faithful is a blessing upon this world, for God will always be with the faithful and more so even with many of them. Cathedrals do not in themself have the end of aiding the poor, and as Catholics we are called to do more than just aid the poor. We have many missions, all stemming from our root mission, that is to do as Christ wills. The Cathedrals serve a purpose other than that of aiding the poor.

God bless,
Mikey

[Socrates]

In the middle ages, rich and poor alike contributed to the building of the magnificent cathedrals. They are a testament to the faith of the entire Catholic community.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Paladin D' date='Feb 9 2005, 10:14 PM'] A few people that I'm currently debating with, believe the Catholic Church should not continue building grand cathedrals or parishes, and even sell the existing ones. Why? So that money can be used to help the poor, since it is our mission to help the poor. They view such magnificant places of worship as mere luxuries, things we can live without. We can just worship in places that aren't as costly.

I can't use the hypocrite argument, because they don't share the same morals, and are practically using our morals against us.

How would you respond? [/quote]
So if we sell everything off, where will we worship God?
A cathedral is a small bit of heaven where the Body Blood Soul and Divinity of Jesus Chrsit resides on earth.
Where would they suggest we put HIM?

[Mr. Cube]

I've heard that one before; I just laugh and tell people that, AFAIK, the Church is in the red from helping the poor, that many of the clergy and all the religious are poor, and that those living in glass houses shouldn't throw stones -- they haven't given up everything to feed the poor.

[Ash Wednesday]

People forget that if we sold the Church's beautiful works, they would probably go to a private collection somewhere. But with the Church, these beautiful works are everyone's.

I really like the gym answer, too. That's a good one!

[MagiDragon]

i've heard this one before. ask how much would the Church get if it sold that stuff? the answer i believe is something like $.32 per person in the world. I think the beauty of these buildings is worth much more than that.

Peace,
Joe

[Norseman82]

And just how liquid of an asset is St. Peter's in Rome anyway?

[thessalonian]

It's not new. It's as old as the Church. I wouldn't respond this way but this verse always comes to mind when I hear that arguement:

John 12
[2] There they made him a supper; Martha served, and Laz'arus was one of those at table with him.
[3] Mary took a pound of costly ointment of pure nard and anointed the feet of Jesus and wiped his feet with her hair; and the house was filled with the fragrance of the ointment.
[4] But Judas Iscariot, one of his disciples (he who was to betray him), said,
[5] "Why was this ointment not sold for three hundred denarii and given to the poor?"
[6] This he said, not that he cared for the poor but because he was a thief, and as he had the money box he used to take what was put into it.
[7] Jesus said, "Let her alone, let her keep it for the day of my burial.
[8] The poor you always have with you, but you do not always have me."


We give honor and glory to God by the Cathedrals. They inspire awe in the faithful and that awe also inspires charity. I happen to attend one of those 1970's stripped down parishes. No statues, the crusifix is in the back where it is hard to see. Nothing fancy at all. I find it ironic that this parish is struggling financially right now. I also see a great lack of understanding of the Catholic faith among the people. The two are connected I think and thus the lack of motivation toward charity.

God bless

Edited February 10, 2005 by thessalonian

[Mary's Knight, La]

Hopefully in the building and designing of the cathedrals the architects and workers used the limits of their God given skill to return a gift to Him. Who could be a better steward of such gifts?

as has also been said before cathedrals are not just luxuries they serve as focal points for catholics in the area. Should a diocese go so broke as to have to close most of its parishes the faithful will always be able to join with their catholic family there.

but i think the simplest reply is the church predates your friends' births and moreso their ability for rational thought. If having cathedrals for hundreds of years hasn't hampered its mission already, then it will probably continue to survive with them just fine.

[God Conquers]

lex orandi, lex credendi.

How we worship is how we believe. Do we believe in a mighty, great and beautiful God, or a God that smells like gym shorts?

Cathedrals remind us of God's place in our lives and in the world, and that we all share in a part of that, rich and poor alike.

Cathedrals provide a refuge of peace and beuty for ALL people.

Cathedrals allow us to worship God as He deserves to be worshipped.

They should compell us to give MORE to the poor, they do not prevent anyone from giving (and this includes the Church, from which cathedrals are the base of its pastoral mission).

[Dave]

I suggest reading "Ugly as Sin" by Michael S. Rose. It's an excellent book that exposes the reasons given for uglifying (is that a word?) churches and what can be done about it.

[quasimodo]

The church's mission is a LOT more than helping the poor. Witnessing to the Glory of God is another aspect of her mission. These great works of art are a testament to the faith of those who have gone before us and we owe it to them to preserve their testimony and witness.


-Tradition is the democracy of the dead.

[Paladin D]

Another thing came up.

Since Cathedrals are primarly a testimony and for the glory of God, would this contradict the humbleness of Christ and what Christians should be? If Christ is humble, then having a cathedral dedicated to Him would contradict that message.

My response at the moment may be: "Christ was humble, but this does not deny the fact that His status is that of a king, especially the Son of God. Wealth does not determine one's humbleness."

Your thoughts?



Question: Is the God the Father, humble?

Edited March 8, 2005 by Paladin D