bishop consent, mortal sin, and the eucharist

[dairygirl4u2c]

hi ho

[Socrates]

If the bishop thinks he can "mend" Church doctrine, he is a heretic.

[Apotheoun]

A man is required to assent to the teaching of his bishop when his bishop teaches in line with the Church's Magisterium (i.e., the Pope and all the bishops), understood not simply synchronically, but diachronically. In the hypothetical case proposed in this poll the teaching is contrary to the constant doctrine of the Church and thus a man is not required to assent to it; in fact, in this hypothetical scenario a man would be required to resist the error proposed by his bishop because the error in question encourages an act of sacrilege.

God bless,
Todd

[dairygirl4u2c]

Well I ask because I know of a prestiguous one of high rank who says that it's okay. Would you recommend that the persons he tells that to contact his superior?


(or in a hypothetical sense, if the pope were to do that, you might want to refer to one down, ironically)

Edited February 2, 2005 by dairygirl4u2c

[Mrs. Bro. Adam]

The Pope wouldn't, though. Every time the Pope declares (explains) doctrine, it is done through the Holy Spirit, who is unerring, and would be in line with Church doctrine.



A question for you, dairygirl4u2c:


Why say 'hi-ho' when you have yet to prove a single point, or even come close to providing a valid point?

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='dairygirl4u2c' date='Feb 2 2005, 02:28 PM']Well I ask because I know of a prestiguous one of high rank who says that it's okay.[/quote]
Whoever he is, no matter how prestigious he may be, he is promoting error.

[quote name='dairygirl4u2c' date='Feb 2 2005, 02:28 PM']Would you recommend that the persons he tells that to contact his superior?[/quote]
I would speak to the person and if necessary I would go to his superior so that the matter could be cleared up.

[quote name='dairygirl4u2c' date='Feb 2 2005, 02:28 PM'](or in a hypothetical sense, if the pope were to do that, you might want to refer to one down, ironically)[/quote]
It is a dogma of divine and catholic faith that the Pope cannot teach error, thus the hypothetical situation does not apply in the case of the Pope. The Roman Pontiff, in the exercise of his Extraordinary Magisterium, and even in the exercise of his Ordinary Magisterium, cannot propose heresy as truth.

God bless,
Todd

[Mrs. Bro. Adam]

Boy...you said that much better than I could, Todd.

[Apotheoun]

[quote name='Mrs. Bro. Adam' date='Feb 2 2005, 02:46 PM'] Boy...you said that much better than I could, Todd. [/quote]
Thanks for the compliment, but you're doing a fine job yourself in explaining the doctrine of the Church in all of Dairygirl's polls. Keep up the good work.

God bless,
Todd

[Mrs. Bro. Adam]

Thanks...believe it or not, it's the first time really defending our faith. I just hope I continue doing an acceptable job

[StColette]

[quote name='Mrs. Bro. Adam' date='Feb 2 2005, 04:56 PM'] Thanks...believe it or not, it's the first time really defending our faith. I just hope I continue doing an acceptable job [/quote]
You're doing an awesome job Teresa

[dairygirl4u2c]

[quote]The Pope wouldn't, though. Every time the Pope declares (explains) doctrine, it is done through the Holy Spirit, who is unerring, and would be in line with Church doctrine.[/quote]

Shouldn't you be saying that the pope could error, but that's only a private thing?


I could make a point out of all of this if you wanted. It'd go back to the development of doctrine thing.. "outside the Catholic Church" vs "not outside" then comparing it to this.


I only said hi-ho cause I'm asking random questions. I have no point to prove.

[Mrs. Bro. Adam]

dairygirl:

It doesn't say there is no salvation outside of the Catholic Church, it says outside the Church. Capital C refers to the family of God... no one can have salvation if they do not have faith, through grace, in God.

Here's the skinny:


The Pope [b]can[/b] error, that is, in his personal life, he is not perfect, he's human. What he [b]cannot[/b] error on is doctrinal issues.

[dairygirl4u2c]

well if he kept it secret, then it wouldn't meet the criteria. he only has protection when hemakes a proclamation for all to hear.

but anyway, this isn't the point of the thread.

the point was really none. sort of to see what you'd say without the backing you to the wall. and then see what you say after i've back you to the wall with the bishop's position.

i'm not trying to prove anything per se really though as I said.

[dairygirl4u2c]

[quote]Church. Capital C refers to the family of God... no one can have salvation if they do not have faith, through grace, in God.[/quote]

I'd also challenge you to show the context of that when it was promulgated.

I have secondary evidence being the Traditionalists and many many conservative catholics don't agree with that Catholic as you describe it thing. But you're not an advanced apologetic and I'm feeling lazy.

And no this does not mean that my laziness proves I'm avoiding.

Anyone here that wants to show me some context or reasons to back up their tsance that the "no salvation thing" was for those without God in a general sense can do it. And then I'll put the effort into responding.

I've tried so many times and everyone avoids the issue and makes simple statements.

Edited February 2, 2005 by dairygirl4u2c

[Mrs. Bro. Adam]

[quote name='dairygirl4u2c' date='Feb 2 2005, 05:17 PM'] well if he kept it secret, then it wouldn't meet the criteria. he only has protection when hemakes a proclamation for all to hear.

but anyway, this isn't the point of the thread.

the point was really none. sort of to see what you'd say without the backing you to the wall. and then see what you say after i've back you to the wall with the bishop's position.

i'm not trying to prove anything per se really though as I said. [/quote]
Any proclamation that the Pope makes concering doctrine it is made publicly, thus, a proclamation.


I may not be 'advanced' as you cal it, however, I do know my faith.