Personal/private Communion?

[cmotherofpirl]

THe voice of sanity has arrived! :)

[Azriel]

THe voice of sanity has arrived!

I dunno about that. Eventually, its going to forgive my unpleasant disposition in the booty.

:D

[Paladin D]

Well I have to admit, I agree

You lost mine a long time ago Robyn.

But there is a way to gain it back.

Debate effectively.

Edited October 30, 2003 by Paladin D

[Anna]

Well I have to admit, I agree

What I've spoken has been plain and simple truth, not sugar coated, and not trying to be mean, but correcting and admonishing when necessary.

Neither of you has contributed to the subject of this TOPIC, but rather turned it into a personal attack session, filled with emotionalism.

You won't address the subject of the Eucharist, and if you wanna claim that it's because you don't respect ME, fine.

I think everyone who reads this thread can see that What you really refuse to respect is The Catholic Church's Teachings on John 6 and The Sacrament of the Eucharist. I refuse to get into your personal emotional swipes. It only takes the thread off TOPIC.

You say you came here to learn. OK, then, what have you learned about the EUCHARIST? About John 6?

If you can't (or won't) answer, then, as your posts on this thread display, you may just be posting here to push people's buttons. Some may respond to that, and that's positive or negative reinforcement for you, and any form of reinforcement is still reinforcement.

But what I've been saying is, this thread is NOT about YOU. It began as a discussion about the twisting of a very sacred ritual, and trying to explain why that is not only wrong, but unbiblical. I just don't consider rolling eyes and adolescent temper tantrums conducive to dialogue, and I've said so. So, in typical fashion, twist it around to mean something else, and cry fowl. Someone's sure to come running with a crying towel for you, but I say the thread's been hijacked with your melodrama, and you never addressed the TOPIC....and yes, I've already raised six teenagers, with six more to come. I do have lots of kids. I understand their behavior very well. I think I understand what this means. And I'm totally amused when you say "don't call ME childish--YOU'RE childish!!!! "*storms away, slamming door*....

Az, I know how much you hate confrontation, and nobody's gonna slug a preggie lady crossing herself. In fact, nobody's gonna slug anybody.

But respect is a two way street. Robyn's disrespect was obvious when she first posted , I may be blonde, but I don't need a brick wall to fall on my head to read that. It was demonstrated long before she typed the words!

Do I need anyone's respect here? Did I ask for any respect? No, not for myself, anyway. I don't need human respect, nor should I desire it. The only respect I do demand is:

Respect for the Most Holy Eucharist.

And I don't think that is too much to demand on a Catholic phorum of this caliber.

If someone repeatedly refuses to show respect toward My Lord and Savior, why would I even want their respect? I don't.

Pax Christi. <><

[Paladin D]

I have to agree with Anna.

[marielapin]

I have to agree with Anna.

Me too.

[cmotherofpirl]

Guys you must understand that our arguments ARE unanswerable.

Since they can't answer us, they get defensive.

What they cannot comprehend, they ridicule.

Teenagers do this all the time.

Dear non-catholic friends, if you aren't up to debate, and just want to visit thats fine.

We do that on the open mic thread all day and night.

But this is the debate board, so if you make an untoward comment, be prepared to defend your statements with facts, documents, scripture, and not your personal opinion.

[Katholikos]

I second what Anna said.

Christ said "I am the living bread that came down from heaven; whoever eats this bread will live forever; and the bread that I will give is my flesh for the life of the world" Jn 6:53

We've quoted scripture to the Sola Scriptura folks and still they won't answer the questions. I'll ask again:

Since Christ said his flesh that would be given for our salvation was BREAD (Eucharist):

Either the Crucifixion was merely symbolic, and

The Eucharist is merely symbolic, or

Both are very real.

Well, which is it?

Quote the scripture that says the Eucharist is symbolic. Don't just give us your opinion, but the scripture. And don't dredge up that tired, old "spirit and life" argument again. That one has already been demolished.

Ave Cor Mariae, Katholikos

[Azriel]

Guys you must understand that our arguments ARE unanswerable.

Since they can't answer us, they get defensive.

What they cannot comprehend, they ridicule.

Teenagers do this all the time.

Dear non-catholic friends, if you aren't up to debate, and just want to visit thats fine.

We do that on the open mic thread all day and night.

But this is the debate board, so if you make an untoward comment, be prepared to defend your statements with facts, documents, scripture, and not your personal opinion.

Agreed.

Oh, and for the record. My post was not directed towards just the Catholics, which seems to be the prevelant assumption. I was speaking to everyone on this thread.

Especially me. I do that. I like to talk to myself. Sometimes I even answer.

[cmotherofpirl]

As long as one of you wins the argument Az you're doing fine.

[Anna]

And I should have been much more brief.

I should have said:

"I do not desire respect for myself, only for My Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ, Truly Present in the Most Blessed Sacrament."

Pax Christi. <><

[IcePrincessKRS]

I'm in total agreement with Anna, Likos, Paladin, and Marielapin.

I also agree with you Cmom, our arguments ARE unanswerable. But that doesn't mean that our Non-Catholic friends have to resort to ridicule and disrespect. Get defensive, fine. Don't reply, fine. But if you are replying keep on topic and show a little respect. We are, after all, discussing the Most Precious Body and Blood of our Lord Jesus Christ.

[BLAZEr]

Ok . . . I've re-read and re-read this thread and I can't find where Freaky was too out of line. The eye-rolling thing back on page 1 was by Robyn and I'm almost postitive it referred to Katolikos' post. I remember reading it before he deleted it and I think that's what she was rolling her eyes at.

Either way, she herself says that, so I take her for her word.

Now, This whole thing keeps getting out of hand. I think CMom is right, and I also think that we are sometimes bullies.

When you have the truth on your side, the whole Truth of Jesus Christ, and you have 2000 years of Church Fathers and Church Teachings and Saints to back up the Church, its easy to destroy half truths and inconsistencies. Our non-catholic Christians brothers and sisters have 500 years of Theology TOPS!! And what's more, many are in Christian Churches that are only 50 to 100 years old. That's not much to rely on.

That being said, in our attempt to "exterminate" heresies, we are also poisoning the well of Charity. What's more important, more essential to our salvation? That we make some understand that their belief in private communion is false or that we treat them with love and respect and fully appreciate their human freedom and dignity. Christ does not force anyone to believe, he respects our freedom, shouldn't we be imitators of him?

I'm not saying we shouldn't "hold fast the rod" and be strident and clear in our defense of the truth. However, if someone rolls their eyes at Jesus in the Blessed Sacrament, we should pray fro them and sacrifice for them and love them. And after we do that, we should rest confident in the Truth. Explain again more clearly why this "thing" that looks like bread and tastes like bread is really the Sweetest and most Glorious Body and Blood, Soul and Divinity of Our Lord Jesus Christ.

We can be bullies, bludgeoning the half truth with our Clubs of Full Truth. But maybe it's time we put down our clubs and "beat them into plowshares" or bridges, even, to help our brothers and sisters come to know the Fullness of the Gospel in Jesus Christ, Head of the One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Church.

***I know I am often less than Charitable, but conviction grows out of confession, so we must all try harder!

[cmotherofpirl]

AMEN

[Anna]

BlAZEr,

Katholikos' deleted post was much like the one I had posted above it, both of us quoting John 6. Whether posting rolling eyes at mine or at Likos, is irrelevant,

for they're not rolling their eyes at us and our opinions, (I could handle that!) but at Christ and His Church.

Maybe they don't see this, so it needed to be pointed out.

The Eucharist is the Source, Summit and Center of Catholic Life, and it is worth standing up for. When people REFUSE to show respect for the teachings after many, many explanations and Bible references, it is obvious that they are no longer doing so out of ignorance, but out of refusal. (See Freaky's Conclusions thread. She knows what we believe, she simply rejects it.)

The remaining posts in question don't address the Eucharist at all.

They're just hijacked the whole thread, boasting about themselves and criticizing us as persons. Not even mentioning our beliefs.

This isn't about us as persons; it's about what we believe in being mocked, and standing up against THAT.

I hate to belabor this.

May I just suggest: RESPECT JESUS IN THE BLESSED SACRAMENT, or the Church Militant will become extremely militant!!!!!!!!!!!!

Two things you don't diss in my face without me becoming very defensive: The Blessed Sacrament, and the Blessed Mother.

Fair warning.

It is an Act of Charity to admonish the sinner.

Letting serious offenses go in the name of peace, love, charity, tolerance doesn't fit this situation. If I don't stand up for the Most Holy Eucharist, then I stand for nothing at all.

Pax Christi. <><