DancesforLove Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 Ok so say you are married and your spouse decides they want a divorce, you do not and believe divorce is a sin. Yet there is no way around the divorce because of the spouse, what does this do to the unwilling party? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 Chels, my parents went through this same situation. My mother wanted a divorce from my dad and he did not want to go through with it. He fought hard to try and have her work with him to get things straightened out but her mind was made up. The reason for my mother filling for divorce was because she was having an affair and thus wanted to end her marriage with my dad. I'm still really unaware of where this puts him in the eyes of the Church. But I've been told many times that since he has vowed not to remarry and he doesn't date that he is okay and is allowed to receive Communion. Anyone else know anything on this manner ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phatcatholic Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 colette............did they end up having the divorce? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 [quote name='phatcatholic' date='Dec 30 2004, 11:46 PM'] colette............did they end up having the divorce? [/quote] yeah they ended up having the divorce against my father's wishes. They've been divorced for about 9 years now. It was rather a very messy situation especially when you add in the factor of two kids and having to move 1200 miles away. My father has told me time and time again that he only married for one time and one time only at that was for life so he vowed never to get married again and as of yet he hasnt. My mother on the other hand married the man she had an affair with. This is all very personal stuff but I'll freely talk about it if it'll help anyone out. I've talked with a my priest and a few people who are much more versed in this area of the Church and explained to them the situation. Since a divorce can be forced upon someone against their will there is nothing that they can really do but try and work it out and practically plead to not go through with it. But sometimes it ends up happening anyway. But it's my understanding that the party who did not want the divorce and fought to keep the marriage and was forced into the divorce is not held accountable. And so as long as they stay celibate thereafter then they are able to receive Communion. However if that person wished to marry again they would have to file for an annulment that way they would stay in the good graces of the Church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phatcatholic Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 that's interesting...........i didnt' know a divorce could be forced on someone. movies and stuff make it look like it won't go thru until both parties "sign the papers." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StColette Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 Well, they both do have to sign the papers, but after battling it for a year there's nothing you can really do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phatcatholic Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 [quote name='StColette' date='Dec 31 2004, 12:21 AM'] Well, they both do have to sign the papers, but after battling it for a year there's nothing you can really do. [/quote] well, could you not just refuse to sign the papers? (sorry, maybe i'm missing something obvious) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lil Red Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 what would that accomplish though? that other person could grow to resent you even more....and especially if you have kids, that could get particularly nasty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DancesforLove Posted December 31, 2004 Author Share Posted December 31, 2004 Actually your father is free to remarry Jen. If I am wrong (I do not think I am about this) please correct me. Your mother would be at fault because she remarried but actually she was the one who would be living in sin because she commited adultery so she is not allowed to get married but your father, since he did not commit adultery would be free to remarry. I am almost positive that is the Bible and Church's teachings... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benedict Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 Without an annulment, her father is married to her mother until death. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DancesforLove Posted December 31, 2004 Author Share Posted December 31, 2004 Yes but I am saying if one person cheats on the other, the cheater is the sinner and the one who was cheated is allowed to remarry. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
journeyman Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 I'll throw my uninformed two cents into the ring I think the teachings on marriage call for one marriage . . . period. The unfaithful person violates those vows during the marriage. Ending the marriage is a civil matter, not a church matter. So even if not at fault, after the civil divorce, in the eyes of the church, the marriage still exists, and neither party can remarry. The church allows an annulment of the marriage where there was some impediment to having entered into the marriage in the first place . . . which has the result of making the marriage as if it didn't happen (that is only between the spouses - any children are still children of the marriage) Impediments are things like coercion, incapacity (being unable to recognize the seriousness of the vow) . . . there's a whole list of them in the Code of Canon Law As long as your Dad is living celibate, he has not violated his marriage vows, and remains "in good standing" (as it were) with the church The act of obtaining a civil divorce is not the sin - the church recognizes separations as being valid in some situations - and I think would recognize there are some situations where divorce is the only course of action available - the sin comes in entering into a new relationship or a new marriage - that relationship is adulterous (because marriage is forever - absent the annulment) or that marriage is bigamous (also adulterous) and on the "what if you just don't sign the papers" . . . signing papers works if the divorce is an "agreed upon" resolution to the litigation . . . if you don't agree, then there is a trial, and the court awards a divorce . . . so if one party is dead set on getting a divorce, and the other is opposed, the one who wants the divorce can wait out whatever the requirements of the state are for a "no-fault" divorce, and they will get it. Divorces generally only go to trial today in states with "fault" rules that make it financially worth the kind of litigation that paints the other party in the worst possible light . . . it isn't good for the relationship, it is terrible for the kids, and generally one spouse or the other ends up thinking the "system" has beaten up on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fides_et_Ratio Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 [quote name='DancesforLove' date='Dec 31 2004, 02:31 AM'] Yes but I am saying if one person cheats on the other, the cheater is the sinner and the one who was cheated is allowed to remarry. [/quote] We had a similar discussion about this in my thread (Divorce in the OT and NT.. or something like that), and came to the opposite conclusion. I'd disagree with you here. Being a victim of adultery does not free one from the marital bond. It is a bond until death, even if one or neither party acknowledges its existence. An annulment would have to be recognized first. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benedict Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 [quote name='DancesforLove' date='Dec 31 2004, 12:31 AM'] Yes but I am saying if one person cheats on the other, the cheater is the sinner and the one who was cheated is allowed to remarry. [/quote] That is a common Protestant interpretation of a pair of Bible verses but it is not the teaching of the Church. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phatcatholic Posted December 31, 2004 Share Posted December 31, 2004 [quote name='DancesforLove' date='Dec 31 2004, 01:31 AM'] Yes but I am saying if one person cheats on the other, the cheater is the sinner and the one who was cheated is allowed to remarry. [/quote] this is incorrect. it doesn't matter who sinned or who is at fault. w/o an annulment you can't marry. period. [b]Canon 1085 §2[/b] Even though the previous marriage is invalid or for any reason dissolved, it is not thereby lawful to contract another marriage before the nullity or the dissolution of the previous one has been established lawfully and with certainty. [b]Canon 1141[/b] A marriage which is ratified and consummated cannot be dissolved by any human power or by any cause other than death. Canon law does allow for a separation or civil divorce (see [url="http://www.intratext.com/IXT/ENG0017/_P44.HTM"][b]Article 2[/b][/url]) but the sacramental bond of marriage remains, unless it is determined by the Church to have never existed in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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