Closure for the marijuana thread.

[point5]

Cooltuba...I enjoy reading your posts...keep up the good work homie. Truth is Truth whether you like it or not, and the truth is that many people spread lies about Marijuana.

That being said I don't smoke it anymore, but applaud you for your attempt to clear up misconceptions.

-peace

-Kiel

[cooltuba]

[quote name='point5' date='Dec 14 2004, 03:19 PM'] Cooltuba...I enjoy reading your posts...keep up the good work homie. Truth is Truth whether you like it or not, and the truth is that many people spread lies about Marijuana.

That being said I don't smoke it anymore, but applaud you for your attempt to clear up misconceptions.

-peace

-Kiel [/quote]
Thanks, man. It's nice to know at least someone appreciates it. It's really hard to find non-biased research using plausible-scenario studies; most of what I have I had to get hard copies of. The lies all started in 1937, when marijuana was first prohibited. I'll post the entire story later, but long story short:

During the depression, people in the south wanted a federal law passed that in some way discriminated against the Mexican population that was doing the menial jobs (that the whites needed now because unemployment was so high). They pushed for a law banning marijuana, but at that time the common opinion was that the govt. could not tell us what we can and cannot put in our bodies, so they passed a law requiring someone to purchase stamps in order to posses, sell, or traffic marijuana. They then didn't issue any stamps. Timothy Leary challenged the law in '69 I believe, on the basis that the law stipulated that one must have the marijuana in-hand to get the stamps, and having it in-hand without stamps made it illegal, therefore the law was illegal. The supreme court agreed, but by then the government had decided that it could in fact tell us what we couldn't put in our bodies, and added marijuana to the banned substances list the next day.

The most famous propaganda was "Reefer Madness" in which a young boy is depicted bludgeoning his mother to death with a frying pan because he was "insane on the reefer". PARENTS WARN YOUR CHILDREN!!!!!1 Haha. Ahh, propaganda. Good times.

On a more personal note, Jas, sorry about the all caps and large font earlier. I was in a pissy mood this morning. I'm still kinda in a bad mood, but I shouldn't have taken it out on you. Again, my sincerest apologies.

Kiel, thanks again. I shall continue with the debate whenever Jas posts his full report.

Peace all,

Tim

[cooltuba]

[quote name='Kilroy the Ninja' date='Dec 14 2004, 02:50 PM'] Please, please, let's all be done with this thread...soon. [/quote]
I'm gonna keep posting every day just to annoy you. J/k. I'll see it through until the debate is over. Be that tomorrow, next year, 2008, whenever. I'm persistent, and I've devoted a lot of my time to getting the real facts on marijuana, and I'll continue to expose the biased research and non-plausible studies and give results of scientifically sound studies until there is no more to discuss.

Peace,

Tim

Edited December 14, 2004 by cooltuba

[cooltuba]

[quote name='jasJis' date='Dec 13 2004, 08:39 PM'] Though nobody has probably died from THC overdose

Just like alochol overdose is rare [/quote]
Not probably, never. It's physically impossible, unless ingecting pure, synthesized THC. One would have to inject 15 grams of pure THC (something like 1500cc; I don't recall the weight of one cc of thc) or smoke 5 pounds in an hour. The lungs do not have the capacity to breathe in the smoke from 5 pounds of marijuana in an hour, even if marijuana smoke was all that was breathed (in which case the person would die of suffocation before THC overdose).

From [url="http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/PEOPLE/outreach/safesobr/15qp/web/idalc.html"]http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/PEOPLE/outreach/s.../web/idalc.html[/url] :

Until the 1990’s, deaths due to alcohol poisoning were largely ignored by the media. Families who lost a child due to AOD (alcohol overdose) suffered in silence. College campuses, where a great many of the deaths occurred, sought to avoid adverse publicity. Death certificates said “cardiac arrest” or “asphyxiation.” Medical examiners sometimes chose to tell a grieving family, “It was a freak accident,” rather than “Your son/daughter drank him/herself to death.”

In 1994, a Federal law was passed requiring colleges to publish all student deaths. Finally, these tragic AOD stories are in newspapers and on national television; stories like the one about a 16-year-old cheerleader in Illinois who died after drinking a bottle of schnapps on a friend’s dare.

Remove Intoxicated Drivers (RID) began working on the problem of AOD in 1992. Based on discussions with victims’ families and county medical examiners, RID estimates as many as 4,000 deaths occur each year from alcohol overdosing: drinking too much alcohol too fast. Families learn, in the most difficult way, that alcohol can be a lethal drug.

Teenagers are particularly vulnerable to AOD. Of the first 8 cases RID discovered, half were 16 years old or younger. At least half were first-time drinkers and had never been drunk before. Five were put to bed by friends or their own parents to “sleep it off,” only to be found dead in the morning. Their friends or parents didn’t know that if a person drinks too much alcohol quickly before falling asleep, the alcohol will shut down breathing and heart functions and kill a person within a few hours.

Until now, the lack of public information about AOD has been a national failure. The following information literally saves lives. It could save a friend or maybe even you.



4000 deaths/year isn't exactly "rare". You just don't hear about it too often.

Peace,

Tim

*edit* please go to that page and read the whole article. BTW...all of the pictures of teens/kids on that page are people who died from AOD. Tell their families it's "rare".

Edited December 14, 2004 by cooltuba

[Kilroy the Ninja]

I'm just sick of you guys justifying vices.

I've known people who have screwed their lives up with alcohol. I know people who have screwed their lives up with tobacco.

My own sister has screwed her life up with weed.

I'm just sick of the justification of vice and gluttony.

Yes, yes, in moderation ANYTHING can be a pleasure, an occasional clove cigarette, the once-in-a-while, or even once-a-day sniffer of brandy, and, as some of my other friends like to, the occasional doobie.

But enough is enough! This is not the place to fight about drugs! Not a Catholic website! If you really want to devote your life to that sort of thing, do so, but I can't see why it should be here.

Nobody is going to be brought over to either side here. It's reached a stalemate.

The title of the thread is "Closure". The only closure I see left here is the agreement to disagree.

[cooltuba]

[quote name='Kilroy the Ninja' date='Dec 14 2004, 06:01 PM'] I've known people who have screwed their lives up with alcohol. I know people who have screwed their lives up with tobacco.

Yes, yes, in moderation ANYTHING can be a pleasure, an occasional clove cigarette, the once-in-a-while, or even once-a-day sniffer of brandy, and, as some of my other friends like to, the occasional doobie.

But enough is enough! This is not the place to fight about drugs! Not a Catholic website! If you really want to devote your life to that sort of thing, do so, but I can't see why it should be here.

Nobody is going to be brought over to either side here. It's reached a stalemate.

The title of the thread is "Closure". The only closure I see left here is the agreement to disagree. [/quote]
I agree with you that (mostly) anything in moderation is not a bad thing. I also agree that tobacco and alcohol and marijuana and a host of other things can screw up lives.

I disagree that this is not the place to [i]discuss[/i] (not fight about) this issue. This is the debate section of the phorum, and this kind of discussion is what it is meant for.

I don't devote my life to marijuana; I am in school to become an RN, and before that, I devoted two years of my life to God studying at Holy Trinity Seminary. The origin of my interest in the subject stems from a paper I wrote while I was in highschool about propaganda. Some of the best examples I could find were what people claimed to be propaganda about marijuana. I looked into it further, and before I knew it, I was awash in false statements and outright lies about the harmful effects of the drug. I won't lie, I've tried it (after highschool and before Seminary), and I never had the urge to do another drug, didn't have a problem quitting, and if it were legal, I'd probably smoke occasionally. I'm not really interested in arguing the legalization issue, Jas Jis is. I just want to point out the lies circulating about the health risks.

If Jas has no arguments that I want to refute in his full post, then fine, it will be over. But, if he posts misleading or false information, I will refute it. Why don't you just ignore the thread from now on; no-one is forcing you to read it.

Peace,

Tim

[Kilroy the Ninja]

[quote name='cooltuba' date='Dec 14 2004, 06:35 PM'] Why don't you just ignore the thread from now on; no-one is forcing you to read it.

[/quote]
Actually, as a Moderator on this Phorum, it [b]is[/b] my responsibility to read the threads posted here.

Yeah, cause ignoring problems makes them go away.

[IcePrincessKRS]

[quote name='Kilroy the Ninja' date='Dec 15 2004, 12:41 AM'] Actually, as a Moderator on this Phorum, it [b]is[/b] my responsibility to read the threads posted here.

Yeah, cause ignoring problems makes them go away. [/quote]
Ditto. Other posters here have the option of ignoring threads, we don't.

[cooltuba]

[quote name='Kilroy the Ninja' date='Dec 14 2004, 11:41 PM'] Yeah, cause ignoring problems makes them go away. [/quote]
Sorry, I didn't know you were a mod. Just because this thread is a problem for you doesn't mean that it's a problem for everyone else. Please show some charity and don't be condescending to me. I have nothing but respect and love for you, at least try and give me the respect of not mocking me. I prayed for your sister when I read that she has problems with marijuana, and come back to find you being condescending to me about my suggestion that you don't look at something that causes you pain/frustration/whatever. Not cool.

Thanks,

Tim

[Kilroy the Ninja]

Try not to be so flippant about illegal drugs.

It doesn't really bother me. I've never been considered cool.

Thank you for your prayers. You are in mine.

[cooltuba]

[quote name='Kilroy the Ninja' date='Dec 15 2004, 12:33 AM'] Try not to be so flippant about illegal drugs.

It doesn't really bother me. I've never been considered cool.

Thank you for your prayers. You are in mine. [/quote]
I am not flippant about illegal drugs. I do not approach the subject with disrespectful levity or casualness. I realize that this is a serious matter, and I am trying to discuss it with the seriousness it deserves. I certainly have never advocated the use of illegal drugs in any of my posts.

I'm not trying to say that you're "uncool" or anything; I've never been considered cool, either.

Thank you for your prayers, also.

Peace,

Tim

[IcePrincessKRS]

[quote name='cooltuba' date='Dec 15 2004, 01:23 AM'] Sorry, I didn't know you were a mod. Just because this thread is a problem for you doesn't mean that it's a problem for everyone else. [/quote]
Just try to keep in mind that as mods we also have to make a judgement call at times as to whether or not threads are turning into problems and put a stop to it before it gets worse. Just because its not a problem for you doesn't mean it isnt for other people--people will message mods and use the report button and not post publicly that they have a problem with a particular thread or comment. dUSt has trusted us with that duty and if we feel that its best to close a thread (even if you don't like it) we're just doing our jobs. Kilroy is doing her job when she points out that this has come to a stalemate, etc.

[cooltuba]

[quote name='IcePrincessKRS' date='Dec 15 2004, 12:49 AM'] Just try to keep in mind that as mods we also have to make a judgement call at times as to whether or not threads are turning into problems and put a stop to it before it gets worse. Just because its not a problem for you doesn't mean it isnt for other people--people will message mods and use the report button and not post publicly that they have a problem with a particular thread or comment. dUSt has trusted us with that duty and if we feel that its best to close a thread (even if you don't like it) we're just doing our jobs. Kilroy is doing her job when she points out that this has come to a stalemate, etc. [/quote]
I do realize that you have jobs to do. Has this thread in particular been reported? Just curious.

This has not come to a stalemate, though. I'm still waiting for a reply from Jas Jis.

This thread was never meant to be of the magnitude it has grown to. I started the thread to put some closure to the other thread, and to ask people to stop spreading lies about marijuana. If you read my first post, you can see that that was my intent. Jas Jis wanted to discuss it, though, so that is what we are doing.

Please don't close this thread because it has come to a "stalemate". All I'm trying to do is point out that this issue is clouded by bad science and ingrained lies that people have been taught since childhood. Marijuana is not the harmful drug it's been made out to be by our government and various special interest groups since the late '30s.

From the bottom of my heart, thank you for your moderatorship; I know it takes time and effort.

Peace,

Tim

[point5]

what is the problem with this thread?

[cooltuba]

I don't know, but apparently they've been pm'ed or it's been reported using the "report" button. *says a Hail Mary for non-closure*