George Bush

[Phatmasser777]

[quote name='Winchester' date='Dec 12 2004, 10:45 AM'] Phatmasser, let me respond in kind.

Up yours.

That is the amount of thought you apparently put into your post, the amount of thought you put into over simplifying your oppositions opinion and bolstering your obvious guilt over supporting a man who lost. [/quote]
For a 'Scholar' you sure do smell of elderberries at judging a persons character. Im not even American, Thank God! I didnt support either, but Id rather see Bush out and have someone else in.

[Phatmasser777]

Just reading over the posts, I found this:

- SAVE TH UNBORN CHILD, SAVE IT.

*Now the child is born*

- "How do we care for it?" Who cares its alive, SAVE ANOTHER UNBORN CHILD SAVE IT.

Its a One-Way Plan.

[InHisHands381]

[quote name='MagiDragon' date='Dec 12 2004, 09:42 PM'] i know a woman who was one of the nurses for a week. She had some truly horrific stories. one of the young women came in under duress from her family. She kept trying to talk them into not doing it, but the 'doctor' wouldn't listen. She screamed as long as she had a voice.

also, one thing they do to encourage people to have abortions is to tell a woman who *isn't* pregnant that she *is.* they then 'abort' the non-existent baby, and charge the woman full price . . . plus she has to face the emotional backlash of *thinking* she killed her child.
[/quote]
That's horrible...

[Don John of Austria]

[quote]Don you have crossed the line from judging the action to judging the person's soul.
[/quote]

I never judged anyones soul, nor Have I judged their Fate, I have stated the Fact that the Law of God is written on everymans heart. It is this Idea that is the Basis for Culpability in Natural Law. If you don't like it then well Take it up with Saint Paul when you die.

[Phatmasser777]

Dont mean St. peter?

Anyways its just a belief about the Law of God in mans heart, no real factual evidence.

[the protector]

Kudos to those of you who have expanded your world views. I may not agree with you on everything, but I do appreciate the fact that you haven't turned your head away from the atrocities of the current administration. It is clear that many of your fellow forum members have.

At the present, I grudgingly support the right to an abortion. It is mostly due toa population crisis that will gain momentum in the coming years. I don't live in a fantasy world with endless natural resources. That being said, I do agree that you can't just throw contraceptives and perform frivolous abortions to solve the population problem. Studies show that increased economic equality for women do wonders to curb population growth.

The current world population lies somewhere around 6 billion. The earth's carrying capacity is measured by some at around 2 billion. Planet earth is in overshoot. We've been able to sustain this bloated population due to cheap energy from oil.

A lack of cheap energy is another crisis waiting in the wings. It may much sooner than you think. However, the impending economic collapse has the potential to extend this peak through demand destruction. Maybe that we shock us into living simpler lives and consuming less resources.

If the average child per woman were 1.5, we could reach the goal of 2 billion within 100 years. Unfortunately, we haven shown little to no desire to mediate our growth. In that case, nature will correct the problem, which won't exactly be peaches and cream.

[qfnol31]

Hmm, you're definately not from the U.K.

So why not practice NFP? I'm not worried about overpopulation.

[the protector]

[quote]So why not practice NFP? I'm not worried about overpopulation. [/quote]I'd definately prefer that. I hear it is more effective, as well.

Not worried about overpopulation? You really should be. Think of Mother Nature aborting 4-5 billion of her children. It's called a die-off. The world's population will decrease to a more sustainable level whether we tackle the crisis or not. It can be a slow process, like centuries. However, it can also be a short process, like several decades. The current political and enviromental conditions definately make that shorter, more unpleasant die-off a possibility.

Check out this thread from the peakoil.con forums. I think it best explains the relationship b/t the population and energy crises.

[url="http://peakoil.com/fortopic1687.html"]Leibig's Law; Why there will be a die-off?[/url]

Edited December 13, 2004 by the protector

[qfnol31]

Do you know anything about Thomas Malthus or his idea about this?

[Don John of Austria]

[quote]Dont mean St. peter?

Anyways its just a belief about the Law of God in mans heart, no real factual evidence. [/quote]

NoI mean St. Paul he's the one that said it. And I would argue that it is a fact, that it is provablethat All men have a natural understanding of Right and Wrong and that it takes a disordering of Nature to confuse or suppress that Natural knowledge.

[MagiDragon]

[quote name='the protector' date='Dec 13 2004, 03:42 AM'] Not worried about overpopulation? You really should be. Think of Mother Nature aborting 4-5 billion of her children. It's called a die-off. The world's population will decrease to a more sustainable level whether we tackle the crisis or not. It can be a slow process, like centuries. However, it can also be a short process, like several decades. The current political and enviromental conditions definately make that shorter, more unpleasant die-off a possibility.

Check out this thread from the peakoil.con forums. I think it best explains the relationship b/t the population and energy crises.

[url="http://peakoil.com/fortopic1687.html"]Leibig's Law; Why there will be a die-off?[/url] [/quote]
50 years ago the earth could support 60 billion people using existing farmland. Today, technology has improved, we can support even more people. There's not really a population crisis, there's just a lot of people that are using food as a political tool to control those under them.

according to modern economics: people, on average, increase the per capita production of the world. Granted, each person only increases things by a tiny fraction of a percent, but a tiny fraction is still a net increase.

I suspect that by the time the earth *does* start to become overpopulated we'll be able to use off-planet farming. We've got a long time before we have to worry about that though. It'll take at least 5 generations, prolly closer to 20.

Peace,
Joe

[hyperdulia again]

Don you don't think the fall has clouded our ability t discern right from wrong at all.

BTW, I have said on ths forum before that women who have had repeated abortions would after abortion was made illegal definitely constitute a threat to society and that the death penalty might very well be used without violating Church Teaching.

[Don John of Austria]

hyper not really not if we make the attemp to discern, it is our own desires which cloud the judgement, not our lack of understanding.

[Phatmasser777]

[quote name='Don John of Austria' date='Dec 13 2004, 10:54 AM']
NoI mean St. Paul he's the one that said it. And I would argue that it is a fact, that it is provablethat All men have a natural understanding of Right and Wrong and that it takes a disordering of Nature to confuse or suppress that Natural knowledge. [/quote]
Nope. For example, Christians see suicide as a sin. Shinto's, Certain Zen Buddhists see it as a duty. There is nothing to say that your moral basis is any superior than their moral basis. Its all a matter of belief.

[Don John of Austria]

Welll their is something to say that my moral basis is superior to their moral basis, but I will have to adressthat tomorrow as the hour is late.