Marriages in the 1800s?

[Lil Red]

i dunno if that's the right date or not...but here's my question:

did the Church frown upon marriages back when 12-16 year old girls were marrying 35+ year old men? i mean, basically it's pedophilia, but back then they didn't think/know it was. what do you think?

[Guest Aluigi]

but back then a 12-16 year old girl was as mature and ready for marriage as she'd ever be.

i wouldn't think the Church frowned upon them.

think of the Holy Family, Mary married when she was like 13 and Joseph was obviously much older. granted, there was no sex, but still.

considering the girls getting married had gone through puberty and were sexually mature, doctors wouldn't even label that pedophilia by todays standards. there's another ilia that it could be classified under by todays's standards, but it's not pedophilia.

there was nothing wrong with those marriages back then. they'd be wrong now. what, did morality change? by no means. society changed and a 12-16 year old girl is not the same as a 12-16 girl was back then. i happen to think society has changed for the better in that regard, but that's historical arrogance assuming our modern times and cultures are inherently better than others times and cultures.

[Lil Red]

girls that age today have gone through puberty and are sexually mature...in fact, studies are showing that puberty for girls (at least, i'm not sure about boys) are getting earlier and earlier.

so why is it different now? i guess i just don't understand.

how did society change?

[Guest Aluigi]

life expentancy for one thing.

[cmotherofpirl]

In the 1800s, puberty wasn't occurring until around 16. By then most girls knew all the skills they needed for marriage. If they did go out to work, they did unskilled labor in factories, or did teaching or nursing etc. They did not need a college education and expected to be married and having children. Women only worked when they had no one else to support them.
Women wanted to marry older men, since that meant the man had worked long enought to establish themselves economically and could support a wife and children.

This is totally unrelated to pedophilia.

Edited November 24, 2004 by cmotherofpirl

[amarkich]

Ditto to CMom.

[Quietfire]

Agreed.

And again, women then were more mature.

Girls today are not always mature.
Grown up...yes.
Mature....questionable.
Think about it.
Just cause someone acts grown up and worldly doesnt necessarily make them mature.


Pax

[Thy Geekdom Come]

Let's be careful not to confuse "sexually mature" with "of childbearing age." I would argue that being sexually mature doesn't just include physical development, but emotional as well, and I think the vast majority of us can agree that neither men nor women are emotionally mature in our soceity until 17 at the very least (and these are likely those raised in good, traditional-value homes, well-educated, and with loving and stable parents...but even then, our media is probably one of the biggest factors), and the average being much closer to 20 or older.

[Guest Aluigi]

but in that society back then, it was different.

we should always avoid historical arrogancy whereby we assume the modern age is somehow culturally and morally superior to any other age.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

[quote name='Aluigi' date='Nov 24 2004, 08:30 PM'] but in that society back then, it was different.

we should always avoid historical arrogancy whereby we assume the modern age is somehow culturally and morally superior to any other age. [/quote]
Actually, I'm on your side...I was just saying that we can't equate the two...I know that times and cultures change.

[Guest Aluigi]

i figured that. your post just didn't mention the past one, only current, and if not clarified could sound like a condemnation of the past.

[cmotherofpirl]

[quote name='Aluigi' date='Nov 24 2004, 09:30 PM'] but in that society back then, it was different.

we should always avoid historical arrogancy whereby we assume the modern age is somehow culturally and morally superior to any other age. [/quote]
CS Lewis referred to this as "chronological snobbery".

[amarkich]

By the way, if this is of any value, the 1983 Code of Canon Law prescribes that a male must have reached the age of 16 to marry and a female the age of 14. As far as I know, this was not required under the 1917 Code (or any local canons that I am familiar with). If someone knows specifics, and if this is pertinent, please post them.

[Don John of Austria]

There is nothing wrong with any confirmed Catholic who has reached the age of Consent marrying any other Catholic who has reached that Age( and is also confirmed) it is not Perverse to find teenagers sexually attractive they are suposed to be sexually attractive that is the biologically appropriate age for such unions to be formed. God obviously didnt't think there was a problem with it since he chose a young teenager to be the Mother of our Lord. While Joseph and Mary did not have Sex it would have been normal if they had and certianly this was not frowned upon by God--- if it wasthere would be a Proabition about it somewhere in the Scriptures.