Good Friday Posted October 29, 2004 Author Share Posted October 29, 2004 [quote name='qfnol31']I'm sorry you don't like Bush very much, and I can sympathize with you (I don't necessarily care for his policies much myself). I just hope you choose someone other than Kerry, at least for this time.[/quote] I've contemplated obeying the church (if indeed the church has commanded me not to vote for Sen. Kerry, and I don't know that it has) by either voting for Michael Peroutka or simply not voting at all, but it just doesn't make a whole lot of sense. I've volunteered with the Kerry Campaign for quite some time now and encouraged countless others to vote for Sen. Kerry -- for every person I spoke to who wasn't going to vote for him, who now is, I am involved in their vote. I might as well cast my own, I've helped cast countless others already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qfnol31 Posted October 29, 2004 Share Posted October 29, 2004 Actually, if you're not sure, sometimes it can be best not to act, if you're very unsure about your conscience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest T-Bone Posted October 29, 2004 Share Posted October 29, 2004 [quote]and I can't stand his stuttering. [/quote] Remind me to never, ever, talk to you in person! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good Friday Posted October 29, 2004 Author Share Posted October 29, 2004 [quote name='qfnol31']Actually, if you're not sure, sometimes it can be best not to act, if you're very unsure about your conscience.[/quote] At one time, I was convinced by some here to vote for Bush. But see, that wasn't enough. Not only did I have to vote for him, but I had to like that I had to vote for him, and I had to like him too -- I had to like every one of his policies, because don't you know that all of his policies are closest to Catholic teaching? Yes, that's right, [i]all of them[/i]. Eventually, I decided that anyone who thinks that all of Bush's policies are closest to Catholic teaching is full of carp, and I decided not to vote for him anymore. I then decided to vote for Michael Peroutka. But then I was harrassed by the same ones who said I had to vote for Bush because a third party candidate can never win, and they said that a vote for Michael Peroutka was, in effect, a vote for Kerry. So what did I decide? I decided to vote for Kerry. It was the only option left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qfnol31 Posted October 29, 2004 Share Posted October 29, 2004 [quote name='Good Friday' date='Oct 29 2004, 12:30 AM'] for every person I spoke to who wasn't going to vote for him, who now is, I am involved in their vote. I might as well cast my own, I've helped cast countless others already. [/quote] But how awesome of a witness not to vote for him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qfnol31 Posted October 29, 2004 Share Posted October 29, 2004 [quote name='Good Friday' date='Oct 29 2004, 12:40 AM'] [quote name='qfnol31']Actually, if you're not sure, sometimes it can be best not to act, if you're very unsure about your conscience.[/quote] At one time, I was convinced by some here to vote for Bush. But see, that wasn't enough. Not only did I have to vote for him, but I had to like that I had to vote for him, and I had to like him too -- I had to like every one of his policies, because don't you know that all of his policies are closest to Catholic teaching? Yes, that's right, [i]all of them[/i]. Eventually, I decided that anyone who thinks that all of Bush's policies are closest to Catholic teaching is full of carp, and I decided not to vote for him anymore. I then decided to vote for Michael Peroutka. But then I was harrassed by the same ones who said I had to vote for Bush because a third party candidate can never win, and they said that a vote for Michael Peroutka was, in effect, a vote for Kerry. So what did I decide? I decided to vote for Kerry. It was the only option left. [/quote] I definately don't like all of Bushes policies. I should hope no one did (well, maybe his wife J/K). But yeah, I really disagree with a lot of what he says. I think he could do a much better job than he does! I don't know him in person, so I can't say I like him. He looks like a monkey, I get joy in that. Actually, as I write this, I remember something else. As Catholics we [i]cannot[/i] like all he says, and have to know that there is some evil we're voting for, but have to also recognize why we're doing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reelguy227 Posted October 29, 2004 Share Posted October 29, 2004 (edited) How can you volunteer for Kerry when he openly contradicts his own views ,just to appease women who dont know what is going in their lives to get an abortion ?????That is just plain disgusting!! And how he recieves the Eucharist without guilt amazes me ,abortion is murder ,and thats all their is to it ,Kerry is Pro Choice ,Bush is Pro Life ,you pick the one who is pro life not the one who is for the murder of people who are just developing ,im sick of this countries liberalism and its pro choice movement!!! Ask yourself one question Good Friday ,are you glad you werent aborted while growing ? If you are glad that you werent aborted and have the ability to live a life, stand up for the individuals who dont have a chance to live their lives ,and vote George W. Bush this Tuesday ,he did sign the the bill to ban Partial Birth Abortion ,and so what if hes not Catholic ,hes sure the hell more of a Christian then Kerry is, and claims to be . Thats all I have to say for now, hopefully you will vote for Bush ,but thats your decision not mine . Ill be Praying for you to make the right decision .Its in Gods hands right now ,His will be done . Amen God Bless, Ricky. Edited October 29, 2004 by reelguy227 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reelguy227 Posted October 29, 2004 Share Posted October 29, 2004 [quote name='Balthazor' date='Oct 28 2004, 08:10 PM'] Just thought I would contribute some info Ricky The decision to legalize abortion was based on a prior case involving a maried couple and birth control. In the 1965 Griswold v Conneticut case the court ruled that governmental bans on birth control , based on the right to privacy. Before this in some states it was illegal for a doctor to prescribe birth control. Later on in ROe v Wade, this precident, of right to privacy, was used to legalize abortion. So the church was right.......birth control lead to abortion, and thus the culture of death thrives. Balthazor [/quote] I got that Info from Fr. Pavone ,you know the guy on EWTN ,who is the spokesperson for Priests for Life ,Im sure he knew what he was talking about when he said it . God Bless, Ricky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest T-Bone Posted October 29, 2004 Share Posted October 29, 2004 (edited) Edit: Post Deleted Edited October 29, 2004 by T-Bone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qfnol31 Posted October 29, 2004 Share Posted October 29, 2004 No ad hominem attacks please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CatholicforChrist Posted October 29, 2004 Share Posted October 29, 2004 (edited) GF, can you explain to me why you wouldn't vote for Peroutka (or, better yet, write in Buchanan)? Specifically, though, why you wouldn't vote for Peroutka. To be honest, to me, Bush and Kerry are two sides of the same coin. They are both working in the spectrum of the same basic ideological and social policies and contingencies in American politics. They have very different personal ideologies, but, with the amount of influence each of them would actually have in this system, they are essentially the same on almost every issue. The only major impact they can have is in appointing judges, which I am sure you would rather have Bush doing than Kerry. I am not telling you to vote for Bush (as you said you would not--and I think and hope you were exaggerating by saying that you would disobey God in any respect, obviously if you understood what that entailed, you would never say such a thing), but I am asking you to consider voting for Peroutka or another small party candidate. If you address the situation, why would you not vote for Peroutka? Just because some ignorant people on this website told you that you have to vote for Bush (and agree with him)? You do not have to vote for Bush (and you definitely don't have to agree with his erroneous policies--abortion for rape, incest, mother's life; limited stem cell research; and some of his other social policies), but you should vote for the most Catholic candidate. I think you and I agree that Peroutka represents the Catholic ideals more than any other candidate who is nominated by a party this year. Please do not let pro-Bushers confuse you of who is the candidate that promotes Catholic ideals most fully. Edited October 29, 2004 by CatholicforChrist Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aluigi Posted October 29, 2004 Share Posted October 29, 2004 t-bone and reelguy, cool it. we are having a discussion here and your comments are not exactly helping. yes voting for abortion is wrong and there are no proportionate reasons to 4000 babies per day dead, but let the discussion continue in a civilized manner please. i know you mean well, but that outburst contained nothing that GF hadn't already heard before, and you can't just repeat stuff enough times that it makes him believe it. that said, i really don't believe Bush would reinstate the draft. His plan for the military is to pull out of WWII hotspots and invest in unmanned weaponry in order to avoid any draft need. I know John Kerry says he'll make like 2 new divisions of the army or something like that... anyway, from where I sit it seems more likely to me personally that Kerry would institute a draft (not saying he's going to, just with his plan it seems more likely) than Bush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good Friday Posted October 29, 2004 Author Share Posted October 29, 2004 [quote name='The New Guy I Don't Know']How can you volunteer for Kerry when he openly contradicts his own views ,just to appease women who dont know what is going in their lives to get an abortion ?????That is just plain disgusting!! And how he recieves the Eucharist without guilt amazes me ,abortion is murder ,and thats all their is to it ,Kerry is Pro Choice ,Bush is Pro Life ,you pick the one who is pro life not the one who is for the murder of people who are just developing ,im sick of this countries liberalism and its pro choice movement!!! Ask yourself one question Good Friday ,are you glad you werent aborted while growing ? If you are glad that you werent aborted and have the ability to live a life, stand up for the individuals who dont have a chance to live their lives ,and vote George W. Bush this Tuesday ,he did sign the the bill to ban Partial Birth Abortion ,and so what if hes not Catholic ,hes sure the hell more of a Christian then Kerry is, and claims to be . Thats all I have to say for now, hopefully you will vote for Bush ,but thats your decision not mine . Ill be Praying for you to make the right decision .Its in Gods hands right now ,His will be done . Amen[/quote] See? They've made my case for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Good Friday Posted October 29, 2004 Author Share Posted October 29, 2004 [quote name='T-Bone']Remind me to never, ever, talk to you in person![/quote] I don't have a problem with people who have a speech impediment, but Bush's stuttering (taken together with the rest of his attitude problems) annoys me. If his other, more serious flaws didn't exist, I probably wouldn't care about the stuttering. [quote name='CatholicforChrist']GF, can you explain to me why you wouldn't vote for Peroutka (or, better yet, write in Buchanan)?[/quote] I've considered voting for Peroutka, but that's been so discouraged by Catholics that it seems almost as bad as voting for Kerry. I've been told and told again that voting for a third party candidate has the same effect as voting for Kerry, because it takes a vote away from Bush in favor of a third party candidate who has no chance of winning. The argument did make sense. But I would vote for Peroutka instead of Kerry; I will not vote for Bush. You'd think they'd at least accept Peroutka as an acceptable alternative to Kerry, but it seems that they haven't. But then again, it doesn't really matter what [i]they[/i] accept, does it? It only matters what the church and Christ will accept, and they are neither the church nor Christ. [quote name='Aluigi']that said, i really don't believe Bush would reinstate the draft. His plan for the military is to pull out of WWII hotspots and invest in unmanned weaponry in order to avoid any draft need. I know John Kerry says he'll make like 2 new divisions of the army or something like that... anyway, from where I sit it seems more likely to me personally that Kerry would institute a draft (not saying he's going to, just with his plan it seems more likely) than Bush.[/quote] The draft is a reality facing us if policies in Iraq don't change. Bush is pulling from the Individual Ready Reserve, and that is, without question, a last resort step before the draft. There's little question in my mind that Bush would reinstitute the draft, and then I'll be in prison (because I will not be in Iraq). I generally don't like Presidents who will land me in prison for their private wars. Sen. Kerry may have no choice but to reinstitute the draft, but at least if he changes policy in Iraq, there may be [i]some chance[/i] that the draft would not start up again. I see no chance of it under a second Bush term, and I'm finding it increasingly difficult to vote for a man who will try and fail to send me to my death, and to vote for a man who will try and succeed at sending many of my friends and even family members to their deaths. Maybe it's selfish of me, but I find these people more important than fetuses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Aluigi Posted October 29, 2004 Share Posted October 29, 2004 Peroutka is a viable option for a faithful Catholic. Kerry is not. I personally don't believe people should vote for Peroutka, but it is a good alternative to Kerry. What do you say of Bush's plans to resturcture the military pulling out of WWII hotspots and stuff? His investing in unmanned weapons? I think Bush can and will avoid using a draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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