Pastor Ed Rice.... Another Email To Me.

[Jake Huether]

Wow! I guess Ed was lying about screaning his "Catholic" mail. He responded to me.

Oh, well, if the Katholic church don't teach it then it must be a lie.

Charolett's the liar, Dr. Dawson is the liar, I'm the liar, my mom's a

liar, my uncle's a liar, of coarse Ian Paisely is your grandest liar,

everyone who points to your little church is a liar. I get it. Just

don't buy it.

Be sure I'll be studying what your little church teaches, but not from

their publications, not from your reterick, but from what the souls who

exit your masses counting beads say about how they will get to heaven.

That makes the best study about what the apostate katholic church

teaches. Try it some time. You would be enlightened about what your

church is really teaching.

Pastor Ed Rice,

And I responded to him:

Ed,

I don't understand why you wouldn't study the Churches official teachings, over what some people say about their own personal experiences within. If you listen to these people, then you are falling for the same mistakes they made when they descided to leave. You see, they might not have left had they known what the Church really teaches! Charolett is definitely a liar, because, as we pointed out, here testimony is chock full of contradictions to what the Church officially teaches, not to mention her lack of knowledge of Catholic terminology. Ian Paisely is most definitely a liar. Dr. Dawson, I'm not sure of. Your mom, most likely just confused - like yourself. If you study the official teachings and doctrines of the Church, you too will see how you've been lied too! I assure you, Charlett - if she exists - is simply harboring a resentment towards an experience she might have had with a priest or something. Priests are sinners, like you and I. But the Church? She is not.

Like I said, Ed, if you can prove to me that Charlett, Ian, your mom, Dr. Dawson, et al, are not 1) lying or 2) confused about what the Catholic Church teaches using the Catechism or any other official Church document, then I will leave the Church and my tithe is yours. Ed, I can draw the same conclusion about the Baptist Church. If you'd like, I will email you back with a list of people who have bad feelings about your church too! But that isn't the reason I don't subscribe to your beliefs. I understand the teachings of the Catholic Church, and I understand the teachings of your faith. And in these OFFICIAL teachings, not hearsay or hate statements, I have come to know the truth!

We don't worship statues Ed. We are commanded to love God with all our hearts! The Pope isn't called God, he never has called himself God! Any Catholic worth his salt knows this. If they believe that, then they are severely confused. And I fault them for that, because a copy of the Catechism costs only $20 at the local bookstore! No Catholic will tell you that Mary is the mediator between man and God. She merely prays with us like you and I pray for eachother.

Please Ed. Don't be fooled by the wolves who would love to destroy the Church. If you are compelled to listen to Charlett, then tell me, Ed. Why are you not compelled to listen to me. I'm a Catholic! I can attest to you that I LOVE Jesus Christ. He is my Lord and Savior. I eat drink and sleep Jesus. I read the Bible. I know the Scripture, Ed. If I found an error between what the Church teaches and what Scripture says, don't you think I would have left!? Or do you only believe the people who resent what they believe is the Church. Would you only listen to me if I had left the Church? Why? Because you are searching for any reason to dislike the Church! Ed, stop that. Search for reasons to LOVE the Church. Because the Church is the Bride of Christ! When you reject us, yes Ed, you reject Christ!

I encourage you to ask me questions regarding my faith, Ed. Am I not as good as Charlett, to bear witness to what goes on in the Church? Why do you believe her and not me. Why do you think that she was not lied to, yet you conclude that I am? Because I love what you hate! That's no excuse. Ask me, Ed. And I will tell you what Catholics believe (or in some cases - are supposed to have believed, yet didn't search their faith).

In Christ,

Jake.

[CatholicAndFanatical]

Happy Monday everyone, I hope your day is blessed.

I came back to work today to find an email from Mr Ed that just kinda, well.urked me really. I dont know if its just the day today, alot of stress today, not sure why..well I kinda do but thats not important right now. Anyway, Here is what he decided to write me.

****************** EMAIL FROM MR ED **************

You are quite wrong about me, but that is understandable, since I

write on this topic with a greater passion than on other topics because

God has used me to lead many Roman Katholics out the bondage of

confessionals and rosary beads and into the faith in Christ. God has

used this Baptist Preacher to convince those in religious bondage that

"For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves:

it is the gift of God:

Not of works, lest any man should boast." Eph 2:8-9

Let me address briefly 3 things. Briefly, because I am a Baptist

Pastor and only do this aspect of my study for a few min in the morning.

I do work 2 other jobs, and am not in the Pastorate for the money as

your friends have implied in their insidious responses. I don't know

whether you or Max, sikked such a volley of dogs onto my email address,

but I did manage to build fiddlers that dumps most Katholic bullitins in

my trash. Thus my new spelling of your church name, to get by my own

fiddlers. Three things.

1) I do read the emails that get by my new fiddler, especially if they

are from you or from Max. Thus you owe me that $5. Send it to Good

Samaritan Baptist Church, POBox 99 54 Main St. Dresden NY 14441. Thanks

2) You did not read well. Charlotte Wells spoke this testimony of her

entering a convent in 1910. This is not a farbication of anti-catholic

plotters, it is a transcript of one of the audio recordings of her

testimony. I heard the testimony with my ears 10 years ago. I listened

to her for over an hour and heard the question and answer session which

followed in a Baptist Church where she spoke. You may casually dismiss

this because of a cloister count or nursing assumption, but not this

Baptist Preacher, and neither do the myriads of soul winners that I give

this tape to. If you read the transcript you find that she never said

there was 180 nuns in a Cloistered Convent, but in the wing she was in

shortly after entering, she was not yet in bondage in the Cloister, if

that is what you call it. Charlotte Wells, was not let out of the

convent to do nursing in a hospital, she escaped prior from there prior

to working in a hosp. I'll not ask nor expect you to read the

transcript carefully to detect your misconceptions. I know you are VERY

eager to dismiss it and call it a lie. I'll let you do so. Just

don't get mad at me and call me an unstudied pigheaded biased liar when

I point out that your 'proofs' that a recorded testimony is fabricatoin

and lies are trite. Your 'proofs' are as trite as your knowledge of the

testimony I heard and you scanned.

3) I am not interested in your tithe, nor the Roman Catechism. Does

your Catechism, in its Apostolic Creed, its 7 Sacraments, its Decalogue

or its Prayer include disertation about rosary beads, worship of Virgin

Mary, praying to dead saints, purgatory, buying candles, confessionals

or getting to heaven by good works? No. I know it does not. I am not

as dumb as you have been told. Can I go to Penn Yan, NY, stand outside

St. Michaels Roman Catholic Church on Saturday night and ask 230 people

coming out of mass what the Roman Catholic Church has taught them about

how to get to heaven. Do any of the 230 know they can have their sins

forgiven by Christ, know they are born-again in Christ, know that he has

given them eternal life and know that they have a home in heaven for all

eternty. No. None. Not one. Tell me what the catholic church

teaches. I say with a resounding voice it teaches exactly what Sister

Charlotte Wells was taught. I say that, not because of the number of

nuns in or not in a cloistered convent, but because I have asked the

230+ what the Roman Catholic Church has taught them and they echo her

testimony. Can you hear their lost cries over the reading of your

catechism.

Let me make an assumption about you. Let me assume that you have

tasted of the saving grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, you are a

born-again believer in the saving blood of Jesus Christ and you have

called on him with your mouth, asked him to save you according to Romans

10:9-10. Given that, and I pray that it is true, let me give you this

advice. Don't spend all your time calling us liars, spend some time

fixing the mess that is in your pews. I know there are unsaved

unrepentent sinners in the pews of our Baptist Churches. That, consumes

much of my time and effort. But I do consider them without excuse, they

have easy access to the truth of Gods salvation through Jesus Christ,

they are taught that no work of righteousness on their part will attone

for their sin, no sacrament, no baptism, no membership, no tithe, ONLY

the blood sacrifice of God's only begotten Son will attone for their

sin. They have heard it over and over, they are without excuse. The

pews of St. Michaels have never heard such truth. It is not preached

there, but a horrible lie is preached there. While I have breath I'll

be preaching it to Catholics, I'll stand on the street in front of their

masses and tell them of Christ love and sacrifice. Don't pretend they

hear it there in St Michaels. I know better. I love Catholics. They

need to hear and head what is in the creeds you espouse. They are not

hearing it, they are counting beads, praying to saints, hoping in

priests and fathers and do not know The Priest. Ok call me liar. Call

me stupid, untrainable, and ignorant, refuse to hear, swamp my email,

attach my web page, demean my name. See my heart. Learn the lie that

is leading millions of Roman Catholics to a devils hell. I will only

preach to the 230 in Penn Yan, I'm only one Baptist Preacher and my

hands are quite full with the Baptists around here. But my heart yearns

for the untold millions that are still untold. Many of them cross

themselves and leave Sat night mass with no hope. They sit in pews you

have greater access to than I. My focus is not on your Catholics. It

is on the unchurched. But the sheer vast number of decieved catholics

is staggering to me. Never mind reading Charlotte's testimony to find

the technical error that allows you to dismiss the whole thing. See

what she was taught about Christ and her relationship with him. I know

that that was 100 years ago and the Catholic church has evolved way past

that barbarism as it become the Modern Roman Catholic Church. But the

false teaching about a personal relationship with the redeeming Christ,

does this false teaching still permiate the remade new and improved

Catholic Church? It sure does in Penn Yan NY, it sure does in Rome, NY,

in Rochester NY it does, in Geneva it does. I do my best to tell them

the truth about the saving grace of Jesus Christ and Martin's discovery

that it is FAITH ALONE. Who are you telling? The souls in St. Michaels

are not my responsibility. Inside stands a man, supposedly trained in

what the Bible says about Christ redeeming act. They came to him to

hear. He tells them how many beads to count in order to earn some

limited temporary forgiveness. Blood is on his hands. I only do what I

can for Catholics as I brush against their lives in passing. My heart

breaks for the lies they have been told. When have you stood outside a

Catholic Church and asked people, real people, about their relationship

with Jesus Christ instead of their relationship with a church or his

mom? Try it. You could find it more enlighting than reading a catechism.

Pastor Ed Rice, Good Samaritan Baptist Church

Spreading the Truth of the completed redeeming act of the Lord Jesus Christ.

********************************************

Ok, its like beating a dead horse (no pun intended Mr Ed).

You cant say we didnt try. And it was fun doing that by email..I think im going to find another victim..er, um, subject to email and talk to. :D

Mr Ed is the perfect example of the hard hearts and heads that are in the prot churchs. Not willing one bit to even read our proofs, they just cast it off and go on their own blinded marry way.

It would of been different if he would of at least tried to open the Catechism and truly desired to know what we taught, THEN came to the conclusion that we are the 'Evil Catholic Church' that he claims..that would be different.

But just like most non Catholics, they choose to not want to learn anything about us, they choose to ignore the facts that we present them in fear that it will either open their eyes to something different than what they have been doing or prove their beliefs wrong and therefore forcing them to come to term with something they've been told was evil.

Oh well, I wont give up though, I know the Truth and its our jobs as Catholics to show them their wrong, not to judge, but to bring the error to the surface and get it out.

God Bless Fellow Catholics, nice job Jake, Iron and anyone else who has been emailing.

CatholicAndFanatical

[Lil Red]

I have been reading these posts and most by Pastor Ed give me a heavy heart. I truly feel bad for the man. For him to be leading people away from Christ's Church, to espouse such lies. I thank everyone that has written Pastor Ed, but I fear that it is all for naught. I think that our best tool now, is prayer. ;)

[Kilroy the Ninja]

It seems to me that the only thing we can do is to pray for people like this Mr. Ed Rice. Honestly, we should all spend more time in our own backyards helping people there and praying for people like him.

:ph34r:

[Dave]

Steve, I gotta give you mad props, along with Max and Jake, for defending our Holy Mother the Church against those who hate her. Truly inspiring! Now I'm gonna go and do some defending of the faith myself! B)

[CatholicAndFanatical]

Well I have to agree with Kilroy and Lil Red Devil, All I think im going to do is pray for this man.

And Iron, Jake..which one of you told him youd give him 5 bucks..lol now he's coming to me for it.

I said if he proved the Catechism wrong, id tithe his church, not give him 5 bucks for some fiddler..lol wow. And he says hes not in it for the money...

Thanks Dave for the props :D Go defend it brotha

Peace everyone,

CatholicAndFanatical

[Jake Huether]

Well I have to agree with Kilroy and Lil Red Devil, All I think im going to do is pray for this man.

  And Iron, Jake..which one of you told him youd give him 5 bucks..lol now he's coming to me for it.

      I said if he proved the Catechism wrong, id tithe his church, not give him 5 bucks for some fiddler..lol wow. And he says hes not in it for the money...

    Thanks Dave for the props :D  Go defend it brotha

      Peace everyone,

            CatholicAndFanatical

Hahaha! 'twasn't me. I don't know where he got that from, but it sounded like he was serious!

Sheesh. this guy is sooo frustrating. He'll only listen to ex-Catholics with problems, but he won't listne to Catholics who LOVE The Church. Oh, no, it is US that are lied to. How can we like the Church? Give me a break.

I'm about to shake the dust from my sandles if this guy dosn't show some sign of progress.

God bless y'all.

[cmotherofpirl]

Don't Jake.

That would only give him something to brag about.

Look for common ground.

It gotta be there somewhere!!!

Edited October 13, 2003 by cmotherofpirl

[CatholicAndFanatical]

doh!

come to think about it, the 5 bucks was my doing..lol. I said in one of my emails that "5 bucks say you stopped reading at the second paragraph and started to reply".

*insert foot in mouth*

Well, I am a man of my word so I will inDouche send him that 5 bucks. Maybe this will intice him into hearing a little better knowing that we have integrity of some sort..

but I still blame jake or ironmonk :D

God Bless,

CatholicAndFanatical

[Jake Huether]

Just ocured to me...

Now that we have his address, we should flood him with Catholic propaganda! LOL!

We can send encyclicals, rosaries, devotionals, if someones up to it, a catechism! Woooowhoooo!

[ironmonk]

Don't Jake.

That would only give him something to brag about.

Look for common ground.

It gotta be there somewhere!!!

I disagree.

This guy is a lover of Ian Paisley.

He is a waste of time. The information given is scoffed at... "Don't you know that all Catholics in the Church are brainwashed... they can't be trusted. The Catholic Church is the devil and has a hold on them."

The guy is another jack chick, ian paisley, etc...

I'm sure we're not the only ones who have dialoged with him.

I even sent him the Early Church Father writings....

Our time is better spent dialoging with people who are open. Nothing we can do will save this guy.... Only the Holy Spirit can change his heart... not us.

"Don't cast pearls among swine." & "Don't give what is Holy to dogs."

"Don't waste time casting stones that bark at you along your way." - Josemaria Escriva.

Some have entertained angels without knowing, doesn't that mean that some could be wasting their time with demons (fallen angels) without knowing? Especially since this is the world ruled by the foolish person, Satan.

Ed is being used to waste our time from dialoging with those who are open to truth.

Everyone Dialoging with this guy,

I say send him one more email saying the following:

"Either show me where the Catechism lies with links, or stop emailing me.

Here is the link to where you can find the Catechism: http://www.USCCB.org

If you email me again with more slander about our Church, then that will let us know that it is ok to continue to send you emails with the Truth of the Catholic Church.

God Bless,

Me"

---It's short and sweet.

God Bless, Your Servant in Christ,

ironmonk

[cmotherofpirl]

We could try prayer and fasting.

And his hostility is no reason to stop trying.

He wasn't born hating Catholics, what is learned can be unlearned by the grace of God.

AS long as he is talking to you and you are being semi-polite there is a possibility of his growth toward the truth.

Stick to it like it depends on you, and pray because it depends on God.

Pick one starting point and stay on it.

I particularly like the comment one of you made about asking him why he accepts anti-catholic points but not catholic ones.

ASk him how we are brainwashed - is it secret radio waves aimed only at catholics?

Edited October 13, 2003 by cmotherofpirl

[CatholicAndFanatical]

I sent him this email. Not sure if it will help, but Im not going to give up on him. I would, however, like to find someone more open to dialoge than this guy.

****************** MY EMAIL TO HIM ***********************

Ed,

I hear your message, I really do. I understand how you think you are saving Catholics from evil Rome. You are correct in saying that some Catholics have no clue what the Church really teachs. Those are the people that can easily be astray into falsehoods. Those are the people who always gripe about the Church and end up leaving. But that is not the Churchs fault as a whole. Could be alot of factors as to why those people have no clue what the Church really teachs

1) The Laymen dont want to learn, they can be the 'Fast Food' ©atholics that are almost the norm in some parish's.

2) Poor Catechist class's, teachers could of been lax themselves or just wasnt very good teachers

3) The Priests at St. Michael's could be Lax Priests, just as you have lax Baptist Ministers that have their own version of stuff. Priests are not perfect, there are screwed up Priests. Although that can be the Churchs fault for not filtering those out, its definitly in no way going against the Church's actual Teachings.

You cannot take these 3 examples and say that the Catholic Church is bad. The People in the Church are going to be wrong, sinful, lax, corrupt. But the important thing that you are missing the the Teachings of that Church that have been around for 2000 years. The Teachings are what matters. That is what is being protected by the Holy Spirit.

You are correct in saying that its only by the Blood of Christ that we are saved. Faith in Christ is what redeems us. But its not just Faith that will do it. Faith without works is dead faith, St. Paul speaks about how not having works with your faith is useless. You cant have one without the other, you MUST have faith, then go out and express your faith in Christ by doing works.

Simply believing Christ is God is not going to get you to Heaven either. Even Satan says Lord, Lord then he trembles. Satan knows Christ is God, so if that is all it took then why isnt Satan in Heaven? Because his works are evil, not good.

Another misconception you have about the Mass is that most of the stuff you talked about like, rosary beads, for instance, are not even taught during Mass. I've been Catholic going on 4 years this coming Easter, never were there a Mass where we were taught how to pray the rosary or whatever. When we are at Mass it we ask Christ for forgiveness of any wrong doings that we have done, profess our Faith and listen to the readings from the Bible.

First part of the readings at Mass is from the Old Testament

Then we reflect on that reading, sing a song then the next reader comes up

We then hear a reading from the New Testament

We reflect on that reading then the Priest comes up and reads the reading for the day

Before he reads we ask Christ to open be in our Mind, lips and heart

After his reading we say "Praise to you Lord Jesus Christ"

Then the Priest has his homily on the readings that we heard.

After this then we begin to prepare to receive Christ in the Blessed Sacrament.

No where in this mass do you hear or see anyone saying how to pray the rosary or to put faith in beads like you said.

Now im not sure what kind of Church St. Michaels is, nor how faithful the Priests are there. But the Church says put faith in Christ, who died for us and redeems us. If those 230+ people at that Church cant tell you that it is through the blood of Christ that we are redeemed then I would say that those people have no clue as to what the Church truly teachs and should start actually listening at Mass.

Again, your presumption about me is right Ed, I have professed my faith in Christ, everyday and night like all good Catholics should do. Not only am I born again, as you call it, I get Recleansed every Sunday at Mass when I get the amesome pleasure of receiving Jesus Christ - Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity. At that moment Ed, He resides in me and I in Him. When the God of the Universe looks down from Heaven, He doesnt see me, but see's His son that is in Me.

I know this saying is hard to believe Ed, just like it was hard for the disciples of Christ to hear it in John 6:60 when they said "This saying is hard; who can accept it?"

But I tell you Ed. Jesus is present in the Blessed Sacrament.

John Chapter 6 Verse 53:

"Unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you do not have life within you"

And continues in even a clearer tone.

John Chapter 6 Verse 54:

"Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him on the last day."

My point to this was that I am as you would call 'Born Again'. Through Baptism I was reborn to Life in Christ, just as anyone who is Baptised in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit is.

One more point on this Ed. Why would you talk to someone that is a Catholic Hater before you would talk to a Catholic Lover? Wouldnt you think that the Catholic Hater would have an agenda or wouldnt have anything nice to say at all? How can you know they are being honest unless you check the facts with Catholic Lovers and compare?

What im saying is this Ed, if you get 250+ peoples opinion on Church teaching, why not go to the source of the Teachings and verify that what they said is inDouche the truth? Why go by just hearsay?

Then make a decision on whether the teachings are wrong or a lie.

Lets say I ask 100 people about Islam, especially after 9/11. These people use to be Islam but left because of 9/11. I ask them and they say all Islam are haters and evil because they believe its ok to fly a plane into a building and expect to go to heaven. Would this be a fair way of going about learning about Islam or knowing their true teachings? Of course not. You would take those 100 peoples opinions, then go get someone who actually knows alot about Islam religion, then say what those 100 people had to say. Then get the truth. If they confirm that it made those people martyrs because they did that...then you would say ok, those 100 people were probably right. But if not, then you would have the truth of what Islam really teachs, not falsehoods from people that left Islam for biased reasons.

The same should be said with the Catholic Church, ask 100+ X-catholics, or even 250+ Catholics that have no clue. Then go to the source of our Teachings, Sacred Scriptures and the Catechism, figure out what those say about our teachings. Compare the two and you will get the truth about what we teach and what we dont teach.

Until you do this Ed, you cannot have a fair view of what the Church is. You're only viewing the Sun from a broken view.

God Bless,

Steve

**************************************************

Peace,

CatholicAndFanatical

[Dave]

Amen, Steve!

[Jake Huether]

Steve,

you inspired me to write one more thing to our friend.

May the peace of Christ be with you!

One other thing, Ed. As I ponder your words.

It simply isn't fair that you ask 200 + Catholics what they think the Church teaches and then believe what the majority says. Do you think I could stand outside the Linear Algebra class at my local university and find out what a certain teacher is teaching simply by asking the students what they've learned?? That's absurd. As a student myself, I know I couldn't give you that accurate an answer! I can't speak for my teacher, and I wouldn't permit you to take what I say about him as "official". What my teacher teaches me, and what I "get" from his lecture, are two VERY different things! If I don't understand, however, it is on me to go to after hour's and ask him to clarify, or to check out extra books. Whatever it takes to learn the material that is TRUE. But it isn't logical to figure out what is taught, by asking the students. Why not ask the teacher!

Would you ask the Pharisees what Moses taught (by the power of God)? Or would you look to the writings of Moses, and the official Teachings of the Jews? I think the latter is a more intelligent means.

It's sad but true that MOST Sunday Catholic Churchgoers are there to fulfill the "law", but not to be nourished spiritually. If you insist on talking to Catholics coming out of Mass, then please, do me a favor, go to a NON-SUNDAY Mass. I can guarantee you, the Catholics who attend weekday Mass (not out of "obligation") can answer your questions about the Teachings of the Church much more accurately.

But I encourage you to just have a peak at what the Church officially Teaches. Ed, I am so overjoyed by my Catholic Faith. I have an abundance of peace, that Christ has given me through the Sacraments! I know Christ! And I want to know him better! The Catholic Church has so much to offer, that others are 1) taking for granted, 2) not understanding or 3) flat out rejecting.

Don't fault the Church for the "students" not "getting" the material, Ed. Please, the resources are out there. If a Catholic has something "bad" to say about the Church, there is good reason to believe that they did not search out these resources. The Teacher can only do so much to present the Truth, Ed. It is up to us to see it and learn it. If I am a hard learner, it isn't the Churches fault! I need to do more to learn the Truth! But God has given His Divine Authority to the Catholic Church. She does NOT error! Individuals inside, yes. The official Teachings are infallible. They are God's Words!

The servant of the Lord-

Jake Huether

Well, it's in the Lord's hands now. I will not respond unless the Holy Spirit prompts me to again.