Brother Adam Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 The epistles of John also tell us not to pray for people in mortal sin. Just because a biblical author gives his opinion about a specific instance of something, doesn't mean that it's God's commandment to follow that advice in all situations, or even in that specific situation. All scripture is God breathed, infallible, and inerrant, even the opinions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasJis Posted July 9, 2003 Share Posted July 9, 2003 The bigger picture of the entirety of Scripture is required. When you ask God to bless a heretic, JW, Mormon, Jew, etc., you should not be asking God to aid them in their error, a Christian should be asking God to bless them with Grace that He may be better revealed to them or their heart softened to know and recognize Him more fully. I have asked God to bless Mormons when they've come a-callin'. The debate usually ends when I say "May God bless us with the grace of discernment that we may come to know Him more fully and overcome our human errors." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironmonk Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 All scripture is God breathed, infallible, and inerrant, even the opinions All scripture is inspired works of God. There is no error, but to what context is the key. Some things in Scripture are strictly to teach a lesson, such as parables. Some things in scripture fit what was going on at that time. Scriture is not 'infallable', because scripture can not settle a dispute on what the scripture means or the lesson to be learned. The books and letters of the New Testament were not considered Scripture until around 400 AD, when the Catholic Church declared the 27 books out of over 200 that were considered. A few of the books that are good for teaching, but are not inspired are Gospel of Peter, The Didache, Acts of Paul & Thecla, Apocalypse of Peter, Acts of Thomas, History of Joseph the Carpenter, etc... For the Catholic Church to have the Authority to Declare which books belong in the NT, then the Catholic Church must be guided by God, and Infallible. God Bless, Love in Christ & Mary ironmonk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inDEED Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 When you ask God to bless a heretic, JW, Mormon, Jew, etc., you should not be asking God to aid them in their error, a Christian should be asking God to bless them with Grace that He may be better revealed to them or their heart softened to know and recognize Him more fully. So true, jas... Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Winchester Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 What if they sneezed? Wishing someone godspeed is not the same as asking God to bless them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inDEED Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 What if they sneezed? Depends... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katholikos Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 All scripture is God breathed, infallible, and inerrant, even the opinions Yes, and be sure to memorize the part where St. Paul tells Timothy to bring him the cloak he left in Troas, and the papyrus rolls, and the parchments. How do you know all Scriture is "God breathed, infallible, and inerrant?" How do you know which writings are Scripture? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TempleofVesarius Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 my best friend is a mormon... he is rather tempered tho by 6 years in catholic school... I dont know if I would call him a heretic more than confused and mislead tho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cmotherofpirl Posted July 10, 2003 Share Posted July 10, 2003 I will say God bless you to anyone, especially if God is the last thing they are thinking of. We are to evangelize ALWAYS! You never know who God is calling. For you to decide a person is not worthy of a "God bless you" is a judgement of the worst kind! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katholikos Posted July 11, 2003 Share Posted July 11, 2003 Found it. 2John 9-11 "Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctorine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctorine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctorine, recieive him not into your house, neither bid him Godspeed: For he that biddeth him Godspeed is partaker of his evil deeds." As for the definition of heretic, one that denies the diety of either the Father, the Son, or the Holy Ghost; one who denies eternal damnation; one who teaches Salvation in the name of any other. Basically, any denial of the basic fundamentals. Who gets to decide what the "basic fundamentals" are? The NT is not an instruction book for Christianity. Protestants for 500 years have tried to make it so, but it's self-evident, when read objectively, that the NT is the record of the spiritual journey of the the newborn Catholic Church. It recorded the MEMORIES of certain events and experiences of the Church during the first Christian century. The OT is the record of the spiritual journey of the people of God called Israel. The Church is the New Israel, holder of the New Covenent. The NT is the Church's family album. That's what it is, yes siree Bob, and any attempt to turn it into something else is hopelessly doomed. History hasn't written the last chapter on Protestantism yet! The Catholic Church will endure until the end of time. Nations, languages, religions come and go, but the Church endures forever. Interpreting a passage of Scripture without knowing what the sacred writer intended to convey and his purpose in writing it; without understanding the cultural milieu in which the words were written; without knowing the geography and history of the place where it was written; without knowing the nuances of the original language in which the words were written, makes personal and private interpretation of the Bible a risky business. The one who understands what it means is the one who wrote it -- the Catholic Church. When it is taken out of its context of the living, organic, teaching Church, misinterpretation is more than possible -- it's probable. Ex-Southern Baptist, ex-agnostic, ex-atheist, "ex-static" to be an industrial-strength Catholic! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anna Posted July 11, 2003 Share Posted July 11, 2003 If some folks are willing to place all their Faith and trust in the Book, why aren't they willing to trust Its Publisher? I can't believe that the Scriptures forbade Christians from extending God's blessings to those who had not yet come to know Him...Christ told his disciples to take the Good News to the ends of the earth. The very people who the Apostles were reaching out to were pagans... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katholikos Posted July 11, 2003 Share Posted July 11, 2003 Found it. 2John 9-11 "Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctorine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctorine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son. If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctorine, recieive him not into your house, neither bid him Godspeed: For he that biddeth him Godspeed is partaker of his evil deeds." I reread all those words I wrote last night this morning and realized that I still didn't make my main point. St. John was instructing the new Christians (Catholics) to avoid the Gnostics. Have any Gnostics come calling at your house lately? The Faith is no longer newly born and fragile; and I don't know about you, but I've never met a Gnostic (though I've met some with Gnostic tendencies). If St. John were living now, is this the advice he would give us? I doubt it. It was advice for the first Christians, part of the history of the early Church, and tells us what was occurring then . Once again, the New Testament is not an instruction book in Christianity. To treat it as an instruction book, as all Protestants do, is a colossal mistake. Jay (Likos) Katholikos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ryanmeyersmusic Posted July 14, 2003 Share Posted July 14, 2003 105 God is the author of Sacred Scripture. "The divinely revealed realities, which are contained and presented in the text of Sacred Scripture, have been written down under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit."[69] "For Holy Mother Church, relying on the faith of the apostolic age, accepts as sacred and canonical the books of the Old and the New Testaments, whole and entire, with all their parts, on the grounds that, written under the inspiration of the Holy Spirit, they have God as their author, and have been handed on as such to the Church herself."[70] 106 God inspired the human authors of the sacred books. "To compose the sacred books, God chose certain men who, all the while he employed them in this task, made full use of their own faculties and powers so that, though he acted in them and by them, it was as true authors that they consigned to writing whatever he wanted written, and no more."[71] 107 The inspired books teach the truth. "Since therefore all that the inspired authors or sacred writers affirm should be regarded as affirmed by the Holy Spirit, we must acknowledge that the books of Scripture firmly, faithfully, and without error teach that truth which God, for the sake of our salvation, wished to see confided to the Sacred Scriptures."[72] 108 Still, the Christian faith is not a "religion of the book". Christianity is the religion of the "Word" of God, "not a written and mute word, but incarnate and living".[73] If the Scriptures are not to remain a dead letter, Christ, the eternal Word of the living God, must, through the Holy Spirit, "open [our] minds to understand the Scriptures."[74] Notice paragraph 106, that the authors of the Scriptures wrote what God wanted them to, nothing more. Also notice 108 that we're not a "religion of the book" Just thought I'd bring out the basics here... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Katholikos Posted July 14, 2003 Share Posted July 14, 2003 Notice paragraph 106, that the authors of the Scriptures wrote what God wanted them to, nothing more. Also notice 108 that we're not a "religion of the book" Just thought I'd bring out the basics here... Whistling, foot stomping, and clapping loudly for Ryan . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandomProddy Posted June 26, 2004 Share Posted June 26, 2004 [quote name='ReformationNow' date='Jul 9 2003, 07:31 AM'] I would say that the Fundamentals would be the absolute basic beliefs of Christianity. [/quote] How about: "The central belief of Christianity is that by faith in the sacrificial death and resurrection of Jesus Christ, individuals are saved from death both spiritual and physical by Redemption from their sins (i.e. faults, misdeeds, disobedience, rebellion against God). "By faith, repentance, and obedience men and women are reconciled to God through sanctification or theosis and returned to their place with God in Heaven." (wikipedia definition) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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