Withholding Sacraments

[Brother Adam]

Hey phatmassers,

For those of us who have been following Teresa and my story back into the Church, here is another problem we've run into.

My understanding is that the Church teaches when someone understands what confession and has a strong desire to recieve the sacrament any formalities such as the completion of classes should not stand in the way.

Teresa strongly desires to go to confession, knows what it is all about, has already been baptized as an infant in the Church, and is ready to reconcile. But it is being withheld simply on the basis of the priest wants her to get her teacher and then the RCIA leader and the director to say "she is ready" after more formal training before she can go.

This is wrong. I'd even say it's borderline sinful behavior. We aren't talking Church law anymore. We are talking the scriptures, what it means to be a Christian and salvation. The sacrament of reconciliation should never be withheld from a person who understands its meaning and desires it.

:irate:

[Lil Red]

[Fiat_Voluntas_Tua]

True that...I have no doubt that Mrs.Bro. is more ready for Confession than anyone...But we also must remember that we must be obidient to the Church...yes I know that this issue is borderline 'wrong'...I was able to be received early because I met with the Arch-Bishop of Kansas City, and we talked, and he said, "You are ready my brother." So my Parish priest couldn't really tell me to wait, since the Bishop told me i was a go. So maybe if you wrote your Bishop explaining the situation. Or if you sat down with the parish priest the RCIA leader and teacher and you all talked about how Teresa is more than ready to receive the graces and forgivness through the Sacrament of Confession.
But we must trust that God is working through that priest and that he know's what is best for the sheep he is sheparding.

With Love and Prayer's,

Totus Tuus,

Andy

PS- I know what that feels like...I had to wait about a year until I could go to Confession...God Speed!

[Brother Adam]

Yet, it is not the priests job to withhold sacraments without a good reason. The completion of any formal training, IMHO, is about the worst possible reason I can think of. The Church is to be accomadating and assist in a persons journey to the Lord, they are not to be stumbling blocks, nor are they to be bankers, slowly giving out grace as they well please. Such use is damning in an economy of salvation.

Falling back on the catechism and past Church teaching a priest is out of bounds to delagate authority to decide when a person may recieve a sacrament to a laymen.

Personally, I would not want to be a priest on judgement day if they withheld the sacrament of reconciliation from someone who desired it, if that person died in mortal sin before recieving it.

Think about what reconciliation offers: CCC 1468-1470.

And while there is something to be said for being humble. This does not apply. If we were humble an obedient before, we would have had to be remarried, when we already had a valid sacramental marraige. But we had to fight to present the truth that we did and get our marriage declared so.

I don't advocate going in guns blazing, hot headed, and rude. I advocate always love and sincerity, but sometimes forthrightness and pushing an issue.

[Guest T-Bone]

You all are in my prayers.

[Thy Geekdom Come]

I don't know anything about this area, and I know that Teresa longs for full communion.

You're both in my prayers.

[cmotherofpirl]

Obedience and trust are virtues. It won't hurt you to wait, God knows she is sorry for any sins she might have committed.

[Brother Adam]

Just like we should have been obedient and gotten remarried right?

Obedience only goes so far. Sorry. Priests are not infallible in all of their decisions. Once in a while a decision can be wrong.

[cmotherofpirl]

Sit down with the priest and find out exactly why he has made this decision.
He could be wrong, he might have perfectly good reasons, and maybe he wants her convictions to stand the test of time.
ASK him.

[Brother Adam]

Well duh.

Edited October 4, 2004 by Brother Adam

[jasJis]

Bro. Adam,
You will find that many parish priests will tend to be strict in how they run the rules of the parish. Especially large parishes. The larger the prarish, the stricter the rules usually are. This is because people are always wanting to be the "exception" to the rule and don't have legitimate reasons like you do. If he makes an exception for you, then he might have to face 20 other people coming to him who don't know your story and ask for "exceptions" and he'll be stuck having to justify and defend himself, etc., etc.

Small parishes are usually much more flexible because of the small numbers. It's simply the dynamics of a large group of people as compared to a small group of people.

My suggestion for Teresa and you is to find a Cathedral or Shrine nearby that will probably have a priest on-duty for confession all the time. Have her go and explain her stituation and sit down and talk with the priest. You have to respect the pastoral responsibilites of your parish priest along with her desire to go to confession.

[Mrs. Bro. Adam]

On my behalf:



Here's what confuses me:


1st I'm told to go to RCIA because I need to go through the process to learn about the church and her teachings.

2nd, I'm told that since I am more advanced in my studies, that they don't want me to be in the program to learn about the church and her teachings, because I already know and undestand the basics of what would've been taught if I had stayed in, but to learn what Catholic community is.



My question is, if I'm only supposed to be in RCIA to learn about Catholic community, and nothing else, then why would they withhold any sacrament which I desire and am ready for?

Edited October 5, 2004 by Mrs. Bro. Adam

[StMichael]

[quote name='Mrs. Bro. Adam' date='Oct 5 2004, 03:32 PM'] On my behalf:



Here's what confuses me:


1st I'm told to go to RCIA because I need to go through the process to learn about the church and her teachings.

2nd, I'm told that since I am more advanced in my studies, that they don't want me to be in the program to learn about the church and her teachings, because I already know and undestand the basics of what would've been taught if I had stayed in, but to learn what Catholic community is.



My question is, if I'm only supposed to be in RCIA to learn about Catholic community, and nothing else, then why would they without any sacrament which I desire and am ready for? [/quote]
Are you baptised in the faith?

Have you passed through the Rite of Acceptance? (11/28/04)
Have you passed through the Rite of Election? (2/13/05)
Have you passed through the First Scruntiny? (2/27/05)
Have you passed through the Second Scrunity? (3/6/05)
Have you passed through the Third Scrunity? (3/13/05)

The earliest a Catechum can receive the sacrament of reconciliation would be Holy Saturday (3/26/05)

[Mrs. Bro. Adam]

I am not a Catechum, I'm a Canidate. There's a difference.

I received my baptism as an infant, in the Roman Catholic church.


What do these rites have to do with receiving the sacrament of reconciliation?

Edited October 5, 2004 by Mrs. Bro. Adam

[Brother Adam]

catechumens, coming from those Christians under Constantine's Edict of Milan in 313 AD who had not been baptized were just that - pagans coming into the Christian religion who had not yet been baptized.

Since Teresa has been baptized, she is a canadiate, as I am. And just as I have already made my act of faith, and been through my first confession, so could Teresa if she found a priest who was willing.